Marijuana legalization victories could be short-lived

[Hydrosun]

...we are not violent people in general but the culture that surrounds the trade can be. The legal regulation of mj would make it a commodity that the violent drug pushers and thieves would not be able to profit on anymore, causing the potential for less crime in general and less funding for the organized criminals to fund their violent and bullying lifestyles....

Uh which forum do you think this is? WE ARE the people that surrounds the trade.

In my estimation 95% of all canna related violence is inflicted by the POLICE on US.

The government does need to get their heads out of their asses, but so does the populace if they think cannabis growers, distributors, or users are violence prone.

 

[huligun]

we all know its about the money.. The DEA is fully aware of the medical benefits from Cannabis they choose to ignore it so they can collect there war on drugs money..Its only a matter of time.. I thought I would never see this in my lifetime I'm happy to say that I did live long enough to see it start..I hope I'm here is see it offered right next to Don Julio..I would still never buy it at any retail shop.. I will support the local mom and pop specialty shops. These people will always have a better product and service..

I have said this a thousand times... The war on drugs is a food chain that employs people on both sides from the low level to the very high paying. The drug Czar is a very powerful position for instance and you can go down from there to the head of the DEA. Then you have the spoils of war.... When someone big is arrested they can often have millions and millions of dollars in assets that the government can harvest very easily. It is an empire and theological movement. Slogans like "Just Say No" and actors on TV frying eggs saying that is your brain on drugs (a frying egg?).

So legalizing anything that has ever been illegal is a momentum shift in policy that cannot happen from one single thing. You need to plant a seed, then another in various forms to get the end result. The attack has to be legal to garner mainstream support. You have to support your cause with the same kind of propaganda throughout the movement. One or two state initiative passing are small things that have to be supported in as many creative and legal ways as possible. For acceptance by the mainstream you have to un-group weed with other drugs in direct opposition to what the authorities have been doing since the 70s. Pot smokers cannot be these underworld characters that will do Anything for a a buck or to get high. One guy dumping chemicals, robbing power or sticking someone up with a gun makes us all look the same. Stereotyping is one of the best tools known to man.

So in short do not think it is over on our end. All we did was plant a couple seeds. Now we have to plant more seeds and maintain our crop, protect it from disease and theft. The more we plant and the various locations insures a better chance of success.

 

[Hammerhead]

its not over on our end its just starting..We got our foot in the door now we need to go through the door..There's still allot of work to do. Most of it is getting the DEA and DOJ out of out ass holes..There is plenty of proof that cannabis is not harmful they just dont want to address/admit it. They would lose millions in drug war money..

 

[fatigues]

This is not the Beginning of the End. It is the Beginning of the Middle part of this political game.

The End, however, is in sight. We are 8 to 10 (12 at the outside) years out from the general repeal of prohibition at the Federal level, absent some new, game-changing event.

I'm going to quote myself going all Nate Silver before it was popular to do so -- over three years ago when I posted on this very subject here in ICM. The link to the original post is in my sig and I think it holds up pretty well over time.

So what does all this demographics and polling analysis mean? It means that around the year 2012-2013, the percentage of Americans who will favor legalization of marijuana will tip the scale in favor of marijuana legalization as national numbers go above 50% for the first time nationally. As the population ages further, and those opposed to marijuana legalization in the largest numbers die off, seniors who have personal experience with marijuana will also creep to above 50% -- and then even higher.

Based on the current trends and demographics concerning direct experience of personal use, by the year 2022-23, those in favor of the legalization of marijuana will not simply be 50% of the voting population – it will by that time have increased to 60% a supermajority.

Sorry to continue with my Nate Silver impression here on ICM, but the answer really does all lie in the demographics. I went through this three years ago here on ICM and I have not seen any data since to make me question the outcome. We had a stutter with Prop 19, true, but the real foe there seems to principally have been a voter turnout that skewed older than it does during a Presidential year. (And yes, it appears some Moms and Dads aged 45-55 got cold feet.)

Still, the thing to take away from this week's experience is this: mid-term elections are a BAD IDEA for pot legalization ballot initiatives.

I repeat: mid-term elections are NOT the time to try this if we want to win. Mid-term elections have a turnout about a third the size of Presidential years, the electorate skews MUCH older, and with a Democratic President in power, it is VASTLY likely to skew more Republican as well. Remember the House results in the 2010 mid-terms? That wasn't an accident. It was utterly predictable.

Aim the next serious run for ballot initiatives for 2016 and we will have AT LEAST another 3 or 4 states -- Cali among them, that have repealed state prohibition. THAT event will then mark the End of the Middle game.

The End Game will begin ca. 2020. By that time, we will be well on our way for a dozen plus+ states legalized, including the first state to do so directly at a legislative level (i.e., other than by ballot initiative). By that time, those in favor of legalization will be on its way towards a demographic supermajority.

In any event, sometime between 2020 and 2024, this fight will be over. The demographics are noted in my sig below.

Keep the faith and remember: just because we're stoners doesn't mean we have to be stupid.

 

[Avinash.miles]

short lived my ass:

Satterberg dismisses all misdemeanor marijuana cases

BY LEVI PULKKINEN, SEATTLEPI.COM STAFF

King County Prosecutor Dan Satterberg has dismissed all misdemeanor marijuana possession cases currently pending in Washington’s largest county.
Taking action following Tuesday’s landmark vote on marijuana legalization, Satterberg said there would be “no point” in continuing to prosecute the 175 people currently facing misdemeanor charges of marijuana possession.
Friday’s announcement followed the passage of Initiative 502, which legalized marijuana possession of one ounce or less in Washington State. The law also called for a legal framework under which marijuana could be grown and sold; both those activities remain illegal outside the medical marijuana industry.
The initiative goes into effect Dec. 6, but Satterberg said he saw no reason to wait to drop the charges.


Read more: http://www.seattlepi.com/local/arti...sdemeanor-marijuana-4024296.php#ixzz2Bmwu1mog

 

[Hammerhead]

thats really good news..

 

[trichrider]

it's the BOMB!

die a perilous death prohibition!!!

 

[gingerale]

King County Prosecutor Dan Satterberg has dismissed all misdemeanor marijuana possession cases currently pending in Washington’s largest county.

Rock on! Good on that prosecutor...he didn't have to do that.

 

[DIDM]

lets put it this way

OR legalized alcohol before the FED did


the states have power, and once tax revenue comes in, every state will be down. Who doesn't need a few hundred million to fund schools and such?

 

[White-rhino]

once tax revenue comes in, every state will be down.

They can be down for it, but I'd never pay them the tax. It's mine, not theirs.

 

[rives]

They can be down for it, but I'd never pay them the tax. It's mine, not theirs.

I'm curious as to why you think this should be treated any differently than anything else that is grown, created, built, or labor exchanged for?

 

[huligun]

Tell those 220 people in Pierce and King County this isn't a victory. To have your case dropped is a huge thing.

 

[The High Corp]

We work with dispensaries and individuals around the state and people are just ecstatic, there has never been such positive sentiment just palpable in the air. Dec 7th will hopefully see a major change in the attitude and focus of this country on marijuana as a drug. So glad 64 passed, you can count us in. Allegedly no more then a 15% tax on producers, someone please correct me if need be. I pulled the info posted on here and threw it straight up for everyone to see, this could be the beginning of an era.

 

[SCF]

Fuck The Feds FTF !

 

[Hydrosun]

I'm curious as to why you think this should be treated any differently than anything else that is grown, created, built, or labor exchanged for?

That question cuts both ways.

In WA for example there is NO INCOME TAX (corporate or personal) and NO SALES TAX on APPLES. There is an 8% sales tax on soda for the FINAL sale only.

WA proposes to tax cannabis 25% farmer to distributor 25% distributor to retailer and 25% retailer to consumer PLUS 8% sales tax.

So I ask you why should cannabis be treated any differently than anything else that is grown, created, built, or labor exchanged for?

Perhaps the previous poster should have rebelled against discriminatory taxation, but his stance is perfectly understandable.

 

[Stranger]

Is there any language specifically about hemp in any of the measures that past?

I haven't heard a peep.

 

[Hydrosun]

Is there any language specifically about hemp in any of the measures that past?

I haven't heard a peep.

NO. CO has INDOOR / COVERED grow requirement, and WA has the TAX OUT THE ASS requirement; so there is no room for hemp in either state.

 

[rives]

That question cuts both ways.

In WA for example there is NO INCOME TAX (corporate or personal) and NO SALES TAX on APPLES. There is an 8% sales tax on soda for the FINAL sale only.

WA proposes to tax cannabis 25% farmer to distributor 25% distributor to retailer and 25% retailer to consumer PLUS 8% sales tax.

So I ask you why should cannabis be treated any differently than anything else that is grown, created, built, or labor exchanged for?

Perhaps the previous poster should have rebelled against discriminatory taxation, but his stance is perfectly understandable.

I can certainly see rebelling against discriminatory taxation. However, taxation is likely going to be one of the largest tools in our favor for legalization, so some level is going to be unavoidable. Additionally, it was taxes that got Capone, not the crime.

For a little more equitable comparison, what taxes does Washington levy on alcohol?

 

[Hydrosun]

For a little more equitable comparison, what taxes does Washington levy on alcohol?

A better comparision.

"Washington State citizens successfully put an end to their state’s “archaic, state-run liquor monopoly” when an initiative to privatize spirits sales went into effect on June 1, 2012. Initiative 1183, voted into legislation this past fall, sought to end a 78 year tradition left over from the post-prohibition seizure of liquor sales by the state’s government"

"Washington had a markup of 51.9 percent, an alcohol sales tax of 20.5 percent, and an excise tax of $3.77 per liter, making their total excise tax rate the highest in the country at $26.70 per gallon: more than 3 times the national average of $7.02 per gallon. Under the new legislation, retailers are allowed to set their own markup rate, and the government no longer collects this tax; as such, this loss of revenue can be viewed as a tax cut."

So it looks like WA has a 20.5% tax plus $14.20 a gallon.

Even by comparing the proposed tax on cannabis to the highest liquor tax in the nation, the proposed tax on cannabis is incredibly high and discriminatory against cannabis users.

Get a WA med card and grow your own, problem solved. I for one don't think WA will see much money under the proposed taxation.

 

[rives]

A better comparision.

So it looks like WA has a 20.5% tax plus $14.20 a gallon.

Even by comparing the proposed tax on cannabis to the highest liquor tax in the nation, the proposed tax on cannabis is incredibly high and discriminatory against cannabis users.

Get a WA med card and grow your own, problem solved. I for one don't think WA will see much money under the proposed taxation.

Jesus, here I thought that the Mormons were based quite a ways to the east. I guess that they have to balance out that lack of income tax somehow.