Backpage used to have a lolipopping section....
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Lollipopping
- Thread starter Microbeman
- Start date
thedudefresco
Active member
IMO yeah.
Take my opinion with a grain of salt but I have tried both methods outdoors, never for yield, but out of a desire to create more top quality nugs using lollipopping.
My verdict is that by removing the lower budsites (Kushman style, I still keep leaves) you end up with less larf.
However, by keeping the lower nodes, I have found I still get a similar amount of high quality tops IN ADDITION to the larf which ends up meaning a lot higher yield but around the same amount of densest flower.
I have also experimented with early topping (sites calls this manifolding I think) and I would not recommend this style of growing outside. It stunts them and honestly I don’t think it even provides a good structure for any plant other than one that will have a short (indoor) veg time.
They write about it like tops are amazing but outdoors you know the denser nugs can also be the ones that hang below the canopy on a lower branch but which receives late afternoon sun or early morning sun.
The best outdoor structure I have been able to make involves topping once maybe in mid July after the plant has already developed a large stalk. Or, if I have more space, I prefer to let the plant grow and never top, opting for training instead (trellis branches out laterally)
I think indoors is just a different game. When you are growing a sea of green style, I think that’s where the debate over these methods is warranted.
At least for me, outdoors, I have learned that with the amount of sun my plants have access to, they do best without defoliation or topping, provided they have the space they need to grow.
thedudefresco
Active member
IMO yeah.
Take my opinion with a grain of salt but I have tried both methods outdoors, never for yield, but out of a desire to create more top quality nugs using lollipopping.
My verdict is that by removing the lower budsites (Kushman style, I still keep leaves) you end up with less larf.
However, by keeping the lower nodes, I have found I still get a similar amount of high quality tops IN ADDITION to the larf which ends up meaning a lot higher yield but around the same amount of densest flower.
I have also experimented with early topping (sites calls this manifolding I think) and I would not recommend this style of growing outside. It stunts them and honestly I don’t think it even provides a good structure for any plant other than one that will have a short (indoor) veg time.
They write about it like tops are amazing but outdoors you know the denser nugs can also be the ones that hang below the canopy on a lower branch but which receives late afternoon sun or early morning sun.
The best outdoor structure I have been able to make involves topping once maybe in mid July after the plant has already developed a large stalk. Or, if I have more space, I prefer to let the plant grow and never top, opting for training instead (trellis branches out laterally)
I think indoors is just a different game. When you are growing a sea of green style, I think that’s where the debate over these methods is warranted.
At least for me, outdoors, I have learned that with the amount of sun my plants have access to, they do best without defoliation or topping, provided they have the space they need to grow.
St. Phatty
Active member
When I first started growing & selling, I kept the Larf & popcorn buds for myself.
Cosmetically it wasn't as great but I didn't care about cosmetics, for my own smoke. I wanted my customers to get the prettiest buds.
So I always thought of the teeny buds (I call it "Teeny Bud Shit") as primo, something to share with a beginning smoker. Someone who might appreciate the buddage.
Cosmetically it wasn't as great but I didn't care about cosmetics, for my own smoke. I wanted my customers to get the prettiest buds.
So I always thought of the teeny buds (I call it "Teeny Bud Shit") as primo, something to share with a beginning smoker. Someone who might appreciate the buddage.
Sometimes when there is a lot of popcorn on a plant i let the small buds go for another 2 or 3 weeks. She has to be ready early so the light is running for some other plants anyway. I like the significant increase in harvest and potency i get.
Clayton_Bigsby
Active member
I don't know. Im not experienced enough to give you an informed opinion but i see a lot of big time growers lollypoping. Outdoors, yea it sounds dumb but i've seen people do it in indoor grows with excellent results.
Does anyone in here follow Grand Master Level? He consistently produces the most fire buds I've seen and he lollypops/defoilates. He also has the guys that own HLG on his channel and they post their grows where they're testing their lights and they lollypop as well.
Like i said, until i do a side by side comparison then ill consider myself uninformed on the subject because I've seen beautiful results from both sides. But it does intrigue me because nobody likes trimming all that LARF.
Does anyone in here follow Grand Master Level? He consistently produces the most fire buds I've seen and he lollypops/defoilates. He also has the guys that own HLG on his channel and they post their grows where they're testing their lights and they lollypop as well.
Like i said, until i do a side by side comparison then ill consider myself uninformed on the subject because I've seen beautiful results from both sides. But it does intrigue me because nobody likes trimming all that LARF.
mikeross
Member
I find I get the same amount of weight if I do aggressive lillipopping or if I don't. The only difference is with aggressive pruning I get all decent size buds.
About 8 years ago I had 2 flower rooms, each mono-cropping a Purple Kush cut. On Room1 I aggressively lollopopped everything up until the first node or two on each branch. On Room2 I still lollipopped but only the bottom 20% of the plant.
After the stretch I did a follow up trim on Room1 and took off any little shoots I thought would not make it into the light... I did not defoliate back then. On room2 I did nothing.
I actually don't recall which room weight more... I do recall that they were so similar in weight it didn't really matter. The room that was aggressive lollipopped had all nice bug chunky buds and trimming went much faster. Room2 was similar weight but a real mixed bag or sizes and trimming the small stuff was a pain.
I think you need to learn your strain. Some strains don't need to be aggressively lollipopped or defoliated and some do.
About 8 years ago I had 2 flower rooms, each mono-cropping a Purple Kush cut. On Room1 I aggressively lollopopped everything up until the first node or two on each branch. On Room2 I still lollipopped but only the bottom 20% of the plant.
After the stretch I did a follow up trim on Room1 and took off any little shoots I thought would not make it into the light... I did not defoliate back then. On room2 I did nothing.
I actually don't recall which room weight more... I do recall that they were so similar in weight it didn't really matter. The room that was aggressive lollipopped had all nice bug chunky buds and trimming went much faster. Room2 was similar weight but a real mixed bag or sizes and trimming the small stuff was a pain.
I think you need to learn your strain. Some strains don't need to be aggressively lollipopped or defoliated and some do.
sbeanonnamellow
Well-known member
You're not defoliating them, you're deflowering them. That's such a neat approach dude I really dig you're though process on this. Very cool! Much love
What is a big time grower? We were a small time commercial outfit for 15 years and produced on average 8 pounds per month. A visiting friend once got access to one of our rooms and did me the 'favor' of defoliating. That crop was extreme lower quality and was not sold.
What is the difference trimming while growing or after harvest as far as work load?
How many farmers do you know who defoliate their tomatoes or apples or peaches? The leaves deliver the nutrients to form the fruit or flower.
St. Phatty
Active member
When I had time to Lollipop, I would gently squeeze the lower buds at about 4 weeks of 12/12.
If there was "something there", I would let it mature.
If my fingertips touched with hardly any buddage, I would strip it.
OR - I would just run my fingers down the stem, below the smallest "worthwhile" bud, to strip all the smaller buds.
But it's still time-consuming.
If there was "something there", I would let it mature.
If my fingertips touched with hardly any buddage, I would strip it.
OR - I would just run my fingers down the stem, below the smallest "worthwhile" bud, to strip all the smaller buds.
But it's still time-consuming.
Clayton_Bigsby
Active member
Don't read too much into it. You know what I meant. I'd consider a company that produces some of the best lights on the market a big time grower. Like I said HLG lollypops with great results.
I find it hard to believe that defoliating would hurt the quality. Your one experience does not negate the numerous others I've seen with positive results.
Lollypopping is quick from what I've seen on Grand Master Levels channel. Trimming small tiny buds to my OCD liking takes FOREVER.
Do tomatoes, apples and peaches produce small tiny useless fruits? Are they grown in a completely controlled indoor environment? Common, terrible comparison.
Sorry for my complete and utter ignorance.
That's okay. We're all used to it by now.
BTW it may be worthy pointing out that the removal of sun leaves has naught to do with the trimming of bracts.
That is according to my botany classes.
That is according to my botany classes.
Most people do stuff because some other person told them to. No real understanding or intuition, just follow the recipe. The truth is that most people would rather be given instructions than learn the fundamentals. Leads to people doing things "just because", with no idea why. This applies to pretty much everything.
Cherry trees and peach trees occasionally go through the process of thinning to create large clusters of fruit on upper and stronger branches. One difference though is fruit is also thinned while it well fruits, the smaller clusters are knocked off before ripe and the idea is the energy left makes some fat peaches or whatever. It is similar to the lollypopping concept.
Tomatoes, apples, and peaches are not flower crops. Your question would be better posed by asking "how many farmers do you know who defoliate their cotton crops?"
As far as "lolloping" goes, that's just a particular form of pruning. My entry level horticulture classes covered this 20+ years ago, and the science says that if you prune off a branch, that energy will be redistributed to other parts of the plant, resulting in increased vigor.
Pruning branches and copious individual leaves are entirely different animals. I guess the term fruitset was not covered in your horticultural classes? Maybe you can get your money back.
Oh lordie, please forgive me for starting this stupid thread.
