Living organic soil from start through recycling

[YosemiteSam]

Yosemite Sam - Nice!

I like the way you think, $5 kiddy pool vs. $200 hydrofarm plastic tray


Maybe Im misreading, but are you contemplating using this conainer, unscathed, in your next run? i.e. the NoTill reference. I say absolutely! I mess around with many difference sizes (no-till) and I was just thinking today that my largest container, the #45 smart-pot easily outperforms any others. Definitely an ease-of-use aspect to them.

(****AH, now I know what Mob Boss is, looks like a nice plant for sure!)

Fuckin hydro store junk is just retarded. God how I wish we had a Naomi's or Peaceful Valley around here.

So I guess true confession time. I do reuse the soil over and over but I am not totally organic just yet, mostly but not totally. I have been afraid to take the leap without being really confident of my compost. Its been a question of scale

I got a plan...but its about a yr away. When that happens I will give no till a go...at least as close as you can come when you gotta pop a 3.5 gallon root ball into a pot. I wanna develop the fungal part of the soil and see what happens.

 

[Pseudo]

is napa 8822 a direct replacement for perlite? thank you

 

[FunTimesIndeed]

Yup.

 

[dank.frank]

Okay. I'm glad this is coming up....

I wanted to make direct comments on the NAPA 8822 and other such products...

I suggested using it from early 2009 - and played around with it in a few different mixes, at a few different ratios.

At very best - I find it to work in a pinch for replacing perlite. I will have to hunt down the pictures, but I ALWAYS - WITHOUT FAIL - have a particular type of brown / rust spotting that happens when using these products as a drainage amendment. The spotting is not aggressive but does spread to some fans while growing, and is not corrected by nutritional adjustments.

Now, I know...it was suggest at one time to screen these products before use, but I NEVER agreed with that as the dust from them is not good to breathe in. So, I always suggested rinsing it off before use. However, being one if it's primary purposes is to ABSORB spills - you can only really "rinse" it so much...

At the end of the day - I have healthier plants when I use perlite, permatill, or as oft suggested by others lava rock / pumice.

Even if you decide to use the Napa product, it still functioned best when cut with a second drainage amendment that was a different particle size...

I DO NOT suggest using the Napa or other similar products any longer...there are BETTER alternatives for drainage.

And before one suggests it - this is NOT a Ca/Mg deficiency. A lock out some how - maybe - but the soil is not deficient or deplete...for what it's worth.



dank.Frank

 

[FunTimesIndeed]

Well hot damn...thanks for that Frank!

 

[rrog]

I don't use DE any more, either. I found it limited aeration, and I don't need the water-holding capacity nor the insecticidal benefit. I get both of those roles filled by other amendments that don't limit my aeration.

 

[Gascanastan]

I don't think many people here...in this thread use DE. I know 'MadL' pushed for how great it was. @ one point I used a bag....after being rinsed. No notible change in my soil as compared to pumice,lava rock,or perlite except that it comes in one size and this limits it's abilities as a drainage/aeration amendment.

 

[rrog]

Glad for the confirmation Gas. Thanks.

 

[ClackamasCootz]

I know 'MadL' pushed for how great it was

That was the deal-killer on my end......

 

[W89]

lol

 

[VerdantGreen]

perlite isnt absorbant, it just holds water on its surface, whilst most other amendments like napa and calcined clay, pumice will hold water like a sponge...
that is two very different properties.

when i replaced perlite with calcined clay/seramis i found it made my mix heavy and water retentive (which is also what i would think D.F's brown spots were a symptom of.

of course the water holding amendments have other qualities that perlite doesnt have, like better CEC etc.

now i use 15% perlite and 15% calcined clay and that seems a good compromise.

so i would say that, whilst they are both aeration amendments, one is not a 'direct' replacement for the other.

perlite has been much maligned recently but i have a gallery full of pics to show it works just fine, i used to use 30% perlite and got great results. probably costs a bit more than some other amendments but thats a different subject.

VG

 

[ClackamasCootz]

VG

Pumice is 'volcanic glass' - it can't absorb anything

CC

 

[unthing]

no love for vermiculite?

 

[ClackamasCootz]

unthing

Setting aside the source issues (asbestos), vermiculite is roughly 2x the price of Perlite, Pumice and Rice Hulls but it's available and it is used in some of the base mixes from Sunshine, Pro-Mix, etc. usually in a mix of Pumice, Perlite & Vermiculite for the aeration component.

CC

 

[DARC MIND]

congratZ to mr S on the well "earned" mentor tag!!

 

[Cann]

question of the day: have any of you guys had rock dust get wet and clump up on you? last night I was adding some amendments to a soil mix when I had an unexpected visitor to the house and had to drop EVERYTHING and scramble to clean up etc. The visitor ended up staying so long that it got dark out, so I figured I would wait until the sun was out to mix up the soil.

It must've dewed overnight or something, because when I went to turn the soil today I found that the rock dust (which was sprinkled on top forming a 1/2 inch layer or so) has formed little chunks that resemble clay in texture. a.k.a. instead of crumbling between my fingers it just squishes into a pancake. this is a huge pain in the ass because the rock dust is no longer spread evenly, it is in little clay-like chunks throughout the soil. is this a problem? how can I fix this without letting my soil dry out fully? pain in the ass.....

 

[schwagg]

hair dryer?

 

[rasputin]

Indeed, congrats MrS.

 

[VerdantGreen]

VG

Pumice is 'volcanic glass' - it can't absorb anything

CC

hi CC, thats exactly what i said in the post. it doesnt absorb water but has a moderate water holding capacity due to the textures on the surface of the grains.

VG

 

[dank.frank]

It's funny you guys talk about these threads and the happenings around here having a direct influence on what certain companies bring to retail, and I can say first hand I KNOW that is true...

For example...

The calcined clay was NEVER found in any store mix until discussed here at ICm and suddenly you have a mix called Just Right Xtra that uses calcined DE - WHICH - I think in all reality was a poor move on the producers part because I found the same issue with the Just Right Extra as I did when making my own various mixes with it....go figure. In reality, I think the makers of that soil jumped the gun and tried to be innovative on something that myself and (some a bit more) others...lol...were playing around with.

That being said CALCINED DE - for the reasons VG stated, it is certainly not a 1 to 1 replacement - but I can see to an outdoor guerrilla grower where the qualities of it are still rather useful.

of course the water holding amendments have other qualities that perlite doesnt have, like better CEC etc.

VG

Personally, I STILL like food grade DE as a soil amendment. It's super effective - a little bit goes a very long way. And I'd rather add a couple tbsp of it to the soil than get stuck using something like Silica Blast or Protek later on....



dank.Frank