it's probably a shithole now, hanauma bay hawai'i used to be an easy place to interact with fishies in their natural environment (where it's possible that the lack of domestic stigmatisation may encourage more altruistic awareness).
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Lion Lured Out Of Park, Killed.
- Thread starter Green Squall
- Start date
it's probably a shithole now, hanauma bay hawai'i used to be an easy place to interact with fishies in their natural environment (where it's possible that the lack of domestic stigmatisation may encourage more altruistic awareness).
i didn't think that YOU would spot the non-think involved, and you did not disappoint me either.you don't KNOW anything, just take for granted that the source that you agree with is factually correct. the only people that KNOW what happened were there, and you aint one of them. the airlines stopped hauling trophies because they feared the financial censure of real-politiks. by the way, several of them have begun carrying legally killed trophies again, and hunting has been re-opened. i am done jousting with you, as it is not seemly to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed person. you may have the last delusional word...
Whatever, you've yet to make a valid argument that is supported by facts. You also weren't there so your view is at least as equally invalid as mine if not more so since all you've offered is things like, "what if the animal moved?" or "What if the projectile hit a blade of grass first?". You don't win a debate with what if's. From the start I've maintained that hunting is okay when you do it honestly and with respect for the animal you are hunting. That was not what happened though and I'm not talking about having an improper license.
As for your suggestion he might not have been aware the animal was lured out, get your head out of the clouds. Come on man, are you honestly trying to suggest the guides went out on their own, lured the lion out and then asked it to wait there while they go get the person wanting to kill it?. Of course he knew, he was right there and probably didn't wait very long once the animal was clear of the protected area.
S
StudenTeacher
I went there once with my family in 1993. It was a sight to behold. I couldn't believe how beautiful it was. Swimming with hundreds, if not thousands of different types of colorful fish. It was an amazing experience. In a perfect world, I would care more about them, but, I just don't think they have emotions. I eat fish twice a month at most, so it's not about favoritism, or being in denial, though I wish it was, so I could work on improving myself and moving past it.
Every energy form that exists here on our rock is on a different journey, and has a different purpose. Insects and simple aquatic life forms are here to benefit the planet in many ways, and I have respect for them and their purpose,, but them being void of emotion, I can't allow myself to feel bad for them in any way. According to my programming, they are beautiful life forms but as emotional as a piece of steel.
I stopped eating animals due to being an empath, as I couldn't take the pain anymore. They are often treated very poorly now days and their energy is screaming in anguish, which probably helps to explain the status of the world today, being that so many people love the power they get from stealing an animals life, and consuming it. They are so unhappy spending their days in captivity, being abused, and fed shit food. It became very uncomfortable for me over time. I have never felt any emotional energy from a fish that I have consumed. Sometimes there is no 'right' of 'wrong' for the whole, but for I believe this can be exclusive to each individual. I guess the last sentence contradicted my point, but such is life on the imperfect planet earth. Perhaps some people can align their energies with fish, I however cannot.
Last I read the landowner whose property the lion was
baited to is charged with complicity in the poaching.
Walter Palmer will likely not face extradition, but perhaps
a fine levied as a symbolic gesture.
His dental practice has reopened.
Besides, the new iPhone is due soon as well as the next
round of new TV shows.
And lets not forget about Tr ump.
And pre season football is right around the corner.
And not for nothing, tigers are bred and raised in China for
human consumption.
Discuss.
baited to is charged with complicity in the poaching.
Walter Palmer will likely not face extradition, but perhaps
a fine levied as a symbolic gesture.
His dental practice has reopened.
Besides, the new iPhone is due soon as well as the next
round of new TV shows.
And lets not forget about Tr ump.
And pre season football is right around the corner.
And not for nothing, tigers are bred and raised in China for
human consumption.
Discuss.
N
noyd666
TRUMP IS A CHUMP err TIGER
imo this is a great point to acknowledge, for real. glad you saw hanauma then, i keep hearing about less fish.
there is/will be probably an increasing number of videos on youtube documenting compassionate pisceans by now hehe.. even sharks "have emotions" certainly trepidation when encountering humans would not be uncommon, but once you deal with that then you have to deal with insects and plants and other things and it becomes tough to maintain the conventional values.
i remember reading the jain sutras and the affirmation that thoughts really do affect others.. and that really fucks up a conventional life, with all the selfish and sensational ideas we are presented in the modern world.. you don't want to get there any sooner than you want to get there..
at least if you eat fish you can tell the fish shop joke where you walk in and say "i'm here to officiate". i love that one. blank stares
The only thing new that I've learned from all of this is that lions name their young.
Truly astounding.
Just incredible.
It's so odd that we as a species act like the killing of another is alternately agreeable.
What do you think that lion thought?
Was it perhaps "Oh shit this is what I get for killing my entire life..." like just maybe should perhaps cross our minds as we die??
Just food for thought you noisy bastards
Truly astounding.
Just incredible.
It's so odd that we as a species act like the killing of another is alternately agreeable.
What do you think that lion thought?
Was it perhaps "Oh shit this is what I get for killing my entire life..." like just maybe should perhaps cross our minds as we die??
Just food for thought you noisy bastards
On this new side topic of whether it's right to kill animals for food the answer I feel is yes. That's how the animals do it and really people are just as much animals as any other creature, just smarter and a much stronger sense of self. On a biological level we are designed to derive nutrition from both plants and animals. Our teeth for example have qualities that are good for tearing up meat as well as mashing and grinding plants. Now granted there are some animals they eat only plants but they don't do it as a conscious choice over meat because they think killing other animals for food is wrong. They are hardwired that way thru evolution. But that aside there is nothing forcing people who don't want to exploit animals, into using them for food. People can make that choice if they wish but they also have to respect other people's right to choose.
Perhaps if each of us had the land and ability and time to raise ourr own food then we could begin to expect people to not depend on animals because they could raise whatever they choose rather then whatever sells best at local stores. Many of us however do not have the land, ability or time to raise our own food and we can't afford a vegetarian lifestyle and get proper and balanced nutrition from the sources we do have access to for food. If however you add meat to the diet then almost everyone in the civilized world has access to enough nutrition with what is available.
Perhaps if each of us had the land and ability and time to raise ourr own food then we could begin to expect people to not depend on animals because they could raise whatever they choose rather then whatever sells best at local stores. Many of us however do not have the land, ability or time to raise our own food and we can't afford a vegetarian lifestyle and get proper and balanced nutrition from the sources we do have access to for food. If however you add meat to the diet then almost everyone in the civilized world has access to enough nutrition with what is available.
The only thing new that I've learned from all of this is that lions name their young.
Truly astounding.
Just incredible.
It's so odd that we as a species act like the killing of another is alternately agreeable.
What do you think that lion thought?
Was it perhaps "Oh shit this is what I get for killing my entire life..." like just maybe should perhaps cross our minds as we die??
Just food for thought you noisy bastards
The only problem is, the lion doesn't kill other creatures by choice. They aren't ruled by things like empathy, they see a creature they like to eat they kill it and eat it. A lion is never going to contemplate human concepts of right and wrong nor are they going to chalk it up to karma if they one day get killed. Also a lion is never going to sit there and say, "killing is wrong I'm going to eat tofu and soy beans from now on, I've heard they can do wonderful things with a little food dye and artificial flavoring that 20 or so years from now will be determined to cause cancer". Other things they don't do are things like hunt for trophies, sport, or to kill beyond what they need to survive and feed the pride.
K
kopite
I agree with this.
I've been a pescetarian for a couple years now and feel great. I must admit I don't really care much about fish or their feelings. I eat free range organic chicken eggs. I think keeping chickens warm and safe from predators is a fair trade for some eggs. Humans can survive just fine without killing and eating animals. It's a choice, and not a necessity. What makes a lion more important than a cow, chicken, or pig, etc? If lions were docile and tasted good, humans would be raising them for food as well. People should get over the killing of this oversized cat. Millions of people and animals die every day. One can cry for all of them, or pick and choose their favorites but neither will bring peace to the world or anyone in it, not even for a moment.
The problem I have with it, is elitism pure and simple a rich fucker decided he can do as he pleases, because he has the cash do to so, it's that simple! anyone sprouting shit about food source and shit is off their cake plain and simple the 2 do not compare.. the world is overpopulated and getting more so, food costs are going up supply demand etc... humans are selfish and always have been just look around yourself and you will notice this, it would be great if every fucker could be sustainable and grow their own, keep their own chickens and what have you but they can't due to where they live etc etc... what I'd like to know is are you down with people paying to do what the fuck they like? if so I'm game I'll get hunting folks and having me some fun after all what's the difference between a human life and a big fucking cat? people gonna cry for ya?... after all it should be ok long as I just pay to get away with it... mind you this has happened in some countries & they even got to be a celeb after murdering people, long as you can pay!!
I think it's time that vegans face the fact that they are responsible for the murder of billions of plants.
It's a fact of life. We kill to live.
Humans seem to be the only animal that feels they know the difference in value of one life over another.
It's all the same soup sir.
And I wasn't referring to that lion as being aware of anything aside from life and how it works.
I feel that lion probably understands the ebb and flow better than anybody that eats tofu.
S
StudenTeacher
Kopite,
For the most part people do what they want with their lives. This guy wanted to kill a Lion, and probably lots of other lame ritch people activities. Who knows what else he's up to? Something good, something bad, and something ugly, I'm sure. Just like most humans. What of people setting traps for rodents? They are not eaten the overwhelming majority of the time. Would the person responsible for the death of the innocent creature be persecuted? I've never heard of such a thing. You chose one of the most majestic beasts in all of the land to cry for. The king of the Jungle. They are beautiful and powerful, that's for sure. What of the weak and the ugly? Who is the elitist?
People eat meat to feel powerful. Sounds like you are one of these people. Of course you probably don't care what a vegetarian thinks about that, just like the type of guy that killed the lion could care less of anyone's opinion. Some people think killing and eating any animal is evil. Does their opinion carry as much weight as yours? If not, does this make you an elitist for not considering others passionate view points?. Anyone that understands basic nutrition knows animals are not needed in a human diet. Sure, if you give into temptation, and eat like shit, you'll need to steal some energy from an animal to nourish your body. You can get there with plants as well.
Humans are selfish yes, and they are also loving, and compassionate, and understanding. Some aspects of society can be scary and ugly at times, but if you look at the big picture, you have billions of people living and working together in relative peace. Every day someone falls in love, every night a mother rocks her baby to sleep, and every moment in between there are children singing and playing in the sun!
You sound like the type of person that isn't into hurting lions. This doesn't make you a good person. There is no such thing. Be kind to yourself, be kind to others, what else matters? There will always be evil in the world. It's not ever going to be heaven, as we're on planet earth. The good, the bad, and the ugly, it's all here, all the time, forever. When one can come to terms with this they will find peace. I wish you the best on your journey
For the most part people do what they want with their lives. This guy wanted to kill a Lion, and probably lots of other lame ritch people activities. Who knows what else he's up to? Something good, something bad, and something ugly, I'm sure. Just like most humans. What of people setting traps for rodents? They are not eaten the overwhelming majority of the time. Would the person responsible for the death of the innocent creature be persecuted? I've never heard of such a thing. You chose one of the most majestic beasts in all of the land to cry for. The king of the Jungle. They are beautiful and powerful, that's for sure. What of the weak and the ugly? Who is the elitist?
People eat meat to feel powerful. Sounds like you are one of these people. Of course you probably don't care what a vegetarian thinks about that, just like the type of guy that killed the lion could care less of anyone's opinion. Some people think killing and eating any animal is evil. Does their opinion carry as much weight as yours? If not, does this make you an elitist for not considering others passionate view points?. Anyone that understands basic nutrition knows animals are not needed in a human diet. Sure, if you give into temptation, and eat like shit, you'll need to steal some energy from an animal to nourish your body. You can get there with plants as well.
Humans are selfish yes, and they are also loving, and compassionate, and understanding. Some aspects of society can be scary and ugly at times, but if you look at the big picture, you have billions of people living and working together in relative peace. Every day someone falls in love, every night a mother rocks her baby to sleep, and every moment in between there are children singing and playing in the sun!
You sound like the type of person that isn't into hurting lions. This doesn't make you a good person. There is no such thing. Be kind to yourself, be kind to others, what else matters? There will always be evil in the world. It's not ever going to be heaven, as we're on planet earth. The good, the bad, and the ugly, it's all here, all the time, forever. When one can come to terms with this they will find peace. I wish you the best on your journey
K
kopite
Kopite,
For the most part people do what they want with their lives. This guy wanted to kill a Lion, and probably lots of other lame ritch people activities. Who knows what else he's up to? Something good, something bad, and something ugly, I'm sure. Just like most humans. What of people setting traps for rodents? They are not eaten the overwhelming majority of the time. Would the person responsible for the death of the innocent creature be persecuted? I've never heard of such a thing. You chose one of the most majestic beasts in all of the land to cry for. The king of the Jungle. They are beautiful and powerful, that's for sure. What of the weak and the ugly? Who is the elitist?
People eat meat to feel powerful. Sounds like you are one of these people. Of course you probably don't care what a vegetarian thinks about that, just like the type of guy that killed the lion could care less of anyone's opinion. Some people think killing and eating any animal is evil. Does their opinion carry as much weight as yours? If not, does this make you an elitist for not considering others passionate view points?. Anyone that understands basic nutrition knows animals are not needed in a human diet. Sure, if you give into temptation, and eat like shit, you'll need to steal some energy from an animal to nourish your body. You can get there with plants as well.
Humans are selfish yes, and they are also loving, and compassionate, and understanding. Some aspects of society can be scary and ugly at times, but if you look at the big picture, you have billions of people living and working together in relative peace. Every day someone falls in love, every night a mother rocks her baby to sleep, and every moment in between there are children singing and playing in the sun!
You sound like the type of person that isn't into hurting lions. This doesn't make you a good person. There is no such thing. Be kind to yourself, be kind to others, what else matters? There will always be evil in the world. It's not ever going to be heaven, as we're on planet earth. The good, the bad, and the ugly, it's all here, all the time, forever. When one can come to terms with this they will find peace. I wish you the best on your journey
for a start it is not just about a lion for me, that is you making an assumption isn't it? , it could of been any animal or human.. you are then assuming I'm a massive meat eater, I'm not and I personally don't like meat from a supermarket but others have little choice due to various reasons, my missus is vegan for the record so stop the assumptions and pretentious shit.. and on rodents well that would depend where you are in the world to how it's perceived, to some they are a delicious food, I haven't tried so wouldn't know... (noticed ya don't give a fuck about fish though because you decided they have no emotion! hmmm)the point was not of a lion but we as humans deciding what is what and doing as we please, nothing will ever change in that regard..
and I'm ok with myself ta though did find that very patronising, I can look in the mirror and feel fine thanks, though thanks for the assumptions... I have no problem with people hunting their own food, I do have problems with rich ****s hunting for fun because they can..
anyway hope the cosmos goes well for ya...
K
kopite
I think it's time that vegans face the fact that they are responsible for the murder of billions of plants.
It's a fact of life. We kill to live.
Humans seem to be the only animal that feels they know the difference in value of one life over another.
It's all the same soup sir.
And I wasn't referring to that lion as being aware of anything aside from life and how it works.
I feel that lion probably understands the ebb and flow better than anybody that eats tofu.
or the price! (you know the thing that actually does annoy me, is this dentist going into hiding and shit, fuck that, you did the deed so front it the fuck out! that's a pussy and tells you all you need to know about him... a shit house ****!)
I didn't buy my ticket...
S
StudenTeacher
Here's another assumption Mr. Kopite, that you have a tremendous amount of guilt for something you've done in the past. It's OK, let go, that time has gone, it's a new day. It's clear that you wish to be a good person now, and in time you'll find a way to feel OK with who you are without putting others down. You are projecting quite heavily your unhappiness, so maybe your mirror isn't as truthful as some. Give 'er a wipe down, and have another look.
I eat fish because I'm an imperfect human and crave the powerful energy that their flesh contains. I could care less about what other people eat. Some people will disagree with my personal decisions, and some people will not. I'm no pretentious vegan or veggie preacher, but some people are, and I've found the balance between their perspective and an omnivore's perspective. It = I don't care. And why should I? Who am I to judge? You speak of elitism being dishonorable as you sit back and judge others? Can you see the contradiction? I don't hold it against you. I understand that you're trying.
Yes, people will do as they wilt for the most part, which is why the world is such a beautiful place. How bad could it be when we are still discussing the killing of single lion that took place more than a week ago? If you zoom out a bit you'll notice the forest and not the decaying leaves at the base of the nearly dead tree. There's life out there! Loosen up dude!
K
kopite
The only person I judged was the dentist for being a spineless **** I stand by that judgement call when I look at his actions, as for guilt well maybe you have something there, the only guilt I feel is not having someone offed, but it wasn't my call, my wish yes but ultimately not my call, as for loosening up the only thing that need loosening is my bowels as I've just had a double hernia op!
S
StudenTeacher
Yikes man, good luck, I hope the recovery goes smoothly
yall should read the jain sutras, not just because they're ill, because jainism is the world' oldest recorded belief system......
400 pages on how to beg for food, inspect it for insects, eat only rice.. it is not fruit or seed and has no propogative desire...
i think anyone looking at a world would realise they have a tremendous amount of guilt, how else did the world get here... didn't buy your ticket.. but it's still your ticket ? or is it? "papeles, passportes.."
can we use life to justify behaviour? i think it could be hazardous to do so.. like any circumstance where you let your environment make choices for you.
are cats robotic death machines?
i live in the sonoran desert, i've lived in the uk and australia and forested northern arizona (above the mog. rim) as well, and been other places... and i'll tell you what i see is ye magyckalle netwyrke of lyfe..
..like, say you've got some rodent that is being a jackass and eating all the fruit early and causing them to rot or spoil... woodpecker sees it, realises it's gonig to suck for others, puts the word out, a week later mr. fox, who isn't a bad sort, nabs the troublemaker.
i see that again and again. at least you might be able to spot that killing isn't impartial... just like "responsible human hunters" you'll notice your local predators taking the juvenile or aged animals, not the mothers.
if you think animals are dumbshits you'll never watch their behaviour expecting to see that. they don't brush their teeth, they don't have to decalcify their pineal glands or whatever.. or relearn to communicate without using letters..
but anyways if you read them there jaina sutras you'll know, you need to sit down and occasionally smoke some weed and don't do a damn thing until life goes away. life is fucked up, "all this business of killing and eating" - just because it's intrinsic to life, it don't mean life is any good shit. don't try to justify your shit!
even if life is all you know. like it would be stupid to believe charles in charge, just because you've only seen charles in charge.
400 pages on how to beg for food, inspect it for insects, eat only rice.. it is not fruit or seed and has no propogative desire...
i think anyone looking at a world would realise they have a tremendous amount of guilt, how else did the world get here... didn't buy your ticket.. but it's still your ticket ?
or is it? "papeles, passportes.."can we use life to justify behaviour? i think it could be hazardous to do so.. like any circumstance where you let your environment make choices for you.
are cats robotic death machines?
i live in the sonoran desert, i've lived in the uk and australia and forested northern arizona (above the mog. rim) as well, and been other places... and i'll tell you what i see is ye magyckalle netwyrke of lyfe..
..like, say you've got some rodent that is being a jackass and eating all the fruit early and causing them to rot or spoil... woodpecker sees it, realises it's gonig to suck for others, puts the word out, a week later mr. fox, who isn't a bad sort, nabs the troublemaker.
i see that again and again. at least you might be able to spot that killing isn't impartial... just like "responsible human hunters" you'll notice your local predators taking the juvenile or aged animals, not the mothers.
if you think animals are dumbshits you'll never watch their behaviour expecting to see that. they don't brush their teeth, they don't have to decalcify their pineal glands or whatever.. or relearn to communicate without using letters..
but anyways if you read them there jaina sutras you'll know, you need to sit down and occasionally smoke some weed and don't do a damn thing until life goes away. life is fucked up, "all this business of killing and eating" - just because it's intrinsic to life, it don't mean life is any good shit. don't try to justify your shit!
even if life is all you know. like it would be stupid to believe charles in charge, just because you've only seen charles in charge.
