Liamba

[purple clouds]

I open pollinate in a closed room, clean the room then give the room a break to let humidity kill anymore pollen that may have been left in the room. I try to keep the males in the room for as little time as possible, so I don't have too much pollen floating around.

I ionize the air for pollen and other particles in the air to drop to the floor. Regular misting of the air helps drop pollen also.

I use my sensi room for a detecter of pollen if I never get any seeds in the sensi I figure I kept the pollen contained and cleaned up. I'm also allergic to cannabis pollen so my body is a detector too.

I agree with you on finding the worthiness of a male, unless you know the strain well enough.

 

[Thcvhunter]

PC, sorry, I reread my post and I sounded like a dick. I wasnt trying to.
I saw your other crosses you did and you do do some real nice work, like that Angola x Panama

 

[purple clouds]

all is well bro and thanks
The subject came up about the angola strain. Proper handling of pollen should be talked about. We all have different perspectives and different depths of of understanding. We are all here to learn from each other.

 

[Thcvhunter]

Much love

 

[vapor]

"You can also compare them to this pics of the original vintage Angola cut that LMN shared with Charlie from CBG when he was part of ACE collective, it was the cut that originated the S1s plants that Vapor posted at the begginning of the thread, as grown by my old friend Pebble (who did all the CBG Meao Thai male crosses later distributed by ACE as well):"

Wondering how you get males/heavy intersexed plants from S1??
What i started was not marked s1 angola red. I was gifted S1 angola reds at the same time and i still have them. I have grown s1plants in the past, And the Angola red i first grew{ar13 was in the batch} had a bunch of different female pheno types. so is this normal for s1?

 

[vapor]

Aswell when i made some seeds from the nanner pollen{ar13, The ar13 cut i have only throws nanners slightly at the end of flower if it is warm, through the winter i donot see them}} and grew them out you could see the mother in everyone of them very distinctively. I had many female phenos in the first batch of seeds i grew, some had thinner leaves and some fatter,similar but different terpene profiles from pea musk to citrus pea etc...... Interesting cant wait till we can DNA test these things....red look whaaat

 

[idiit]

And the Angola red i first grew{ar13 was in the batch} had a bunch of different female pheno types. so is this normal for s1

s1's from heterogeneous gene pools often exhibit variation.

I used an ar male from bsc and an ar female from snow at snow high seeds in my ar replication. no hermies in either parent, great vigor. I did notice phenotype variation in the resultant seed progeny which is good as genetic diversity is important in preserving an heirloom. a very few of the progeny ( seeds grown out) were reported to have minor hermie issues but none of my ar's went hermie and all had good vigor. some had a little more wld looking leaves in early veg than others but all exhibited sativa growth after early veg.

 

[vapor]

thank you.
Every plant i grew from that first batch had intersexed{not hermies, full male flowers on branches half way through flower or the end} plants{via LMN}, except the ar13 cut i kept. It was the only one that did not put male flowers out at some point{it will put put nanners on top bud with a hot run}...I grew some angola red from cali{motadios i believe} and found no hermies or intersex in any of those plants. I did not find the high or smells as good as the ar13 cut. Still you could tell they were angola red, kinda like nepalese etc, some of the traits are so recognizable..... So who else has had a wack of intersexed{full male parts on female plant or vice-versa}, plants from angola seeds they have grown?
I grew out the malanje and maconna, found no intersex with them either, a few nanners here and there on a few plants, no real hermies either. again i found common smells and terpenes to other angolas, pea musk earth. The buds were ultra whispy. I have them saved in the freezer for a cryo oil run soon, When i smell the tub they remind me of angolas.
I have a bunch of seed from another female from the first batch{ar18} she put out nanners heavy at the end of flower, but her smell was so interesting the angolas smells with a weird bit of citrus{grapefruit}. I saved her in seed form to play with laterz. Learned a lot growing angola planties great experience.... peace

 

[idiit]

grew some angola red from cali{motadios i believe} and found no hermies or intersex in any of those plants. I did not find the high or smells as good as the ar13 cut.

snow also known as motadios's ( same person) angola female had a musky, earthy hashy smell taste to her for me that I didn't find real desirable but not rude either. the auto zamal I used in the zamal/ar cross had nice pleasant terps so the ar terps from that experience can be positively influenced with correct mating in a poly sat hybrid.

the problem with many of the great adam strains is lack of hardiness outdoors, lesser high effects quality wise, tolerance build up issues and shorter durations to the highs.

with most landrace sativas I find that their hardiness and high effects translate well in hybrids and the bag appeal including taste/smell can benefit from mating with some nice adam danks. I really like the idea of combining the great bag appeal of some of the Amsterdam strains with the high effects, hardiness (outdoor runs for me) and potency including lengthy duration of high and no tolerance build up issues of the better landrace sativas.

dj short (my paraphrase) said if the progeny aren't better than the parents then why bother? with a proper combination of great landrace sativas with some of the great adam danks there are a lot of opportunities for an almost infinite number of new great outdoor/greenhouse strains.

 

[purple clouds]

The angola roja snowhigh had were from cutting I sent. They were from the same batch of seeds from bsc. I don't know anything about the seeds he got he said were f1s originally from LMN..

I found 3 males hermies in all the seeds I ran. They hermied when going into full flower. 2 of them would have completely females buds on certain branches

 

[Thcvhunter]

When dealing with wild(-ish) strains, intersex is my marker for certain things I breed for.
I wonder if there is better terminology here for dealing with intersex in sativas.
Hermying at week 4 and washing a room full of pollen is bad. But is a plant that shows intersex(adaptability) at week 12 and the pollen released is dependent upon certain controllable conditions, is that also bad?
Is Hermy vs Intersex enough of a distinction?

I dread that many of our great genetics have been lost in preservation projects which breed purely against intersex traits.
Angola is a Very special strain and I feel like I'm watching it slip away with each post by a pollenchucker.

If a strain has another strain its its lineage, and we know it, can we please stop calling it by the original landrace name?
Much of the Angola and Congo on the markets, and boards, are polluted by PCK - an inbred Paki that saps away the true potency and cannabinoid profile of its mate.

Can we stop calling Angola x PCK "Angola" and call it "Angola x PCK". Same goes for [(Congo x Congo) x (PCK xPCK x PCK) that goes around as "Congo" these days?

I dont have the best communication skills and Im not meaning to be rude, I just felt that that needed to be said.
Lets actually preserve genetics when we say we are going to preserve genetics. This all starts with being honest about what we actually have.

 

[Mustafunk]

What i started was not marked s1 angola red. I was gifted S1 angola reds at the same time and i still have them. I have grown s1plants in the past

Sure bro, I was simply trying to show Purple Clouds a good representation of the plant via an old cut sourced by LMN himself, and explain to him that this was the cut later used to produce S1s in order to preserve the strain in Spain. Vibes Co and it seems many other people were already preserving BSC stocks at the time anyway.

I'm no genetic expert but from what I've read the only way to know the true sex genotype from a plant is testing its DNA for true sex markers. I guess it's hard to understand why this monoecious plants or why the monoecious and hermie genes are present in Cannabis species, or the reason why they express themselves producing flowers from the other sex under stress conditions and so on.

Plant populations according to their sex:

• Hermaphrodite: only hermie plants (this is staminate + pistillate flowers at the same calyx).
• Monoecious: only monoecious plants (this is staminate + pistillate flowers at the same plant).
• Dioecious: only dioecious plants (this either staminate or pistillate plants, but firm sex).
• Ginodioecious: both firm females + hermies.
• Androdioecious: both firm males + hermies.

I've seen a few of this weird cases of allegedly S1 seed producing male flowers and even full male plants that produced regular offspring... Peyote Purple and Bubba among them for example. I guess you'll know better than anyone if the interesting plants you grew were the s1s or not.

But anyway, the debate started when Purple Clouds posted his plant and we noticed she was showing some weird hybrid traits indeed that were obviously segregating on those plants from certain recessive or hidden genes within the population.

So the good news is that plenty african genes are still alive and well within the community, I think Angolese Red by Lmn is just one name for one strain that become well known within the online scene because its rarity back then (just like many other cases like that). In my opinion the good landraces he and others were receiving from hippies, fishermen and so on are gone on its purest form or that's what it seems. Just like most of the old african heirlooms found along Spain or Mexicans at the US back in the days.

Peace.

PS: Calling one cultivar "liamba" is just like calling another "mota", "weed" or "ganja". I have three other different angolese landraces at the moment and they are all diamba or liamba strains as they came from Angola and it's the local portuguese slang for weed, also widely used in Brazil. This is why it's always interesting to use the geographical name to differentiate them like botanists do.

 

[purple clouds]

Apologies thcvhunter.

 

[Thcvhunter]

PC, that wasnt pointed at you, it was just a general statement.

 

[idiit]

purpleclouds, you are highly regarded and warmly welcome at ic.. I follow your posts and see the + reps you get.

If a strain has another strain its its lineage, and we know it, can we please stop calling it by the original landrace name?

^ yeah that!

Sure bro, I was simply trying to show Purple Clouds a good representation of the plant via an old cut sourced by LMN himself, and explain to him that this was the cut later used to produce S1s in order to preserve the strain in Spain. Vibes Co and it seems many other people were already preserving BSC stocks at the time anyway.

^ yeah that.

But anyway, the debate started when Purple Clouds posted his plant and we noticed she was showing some weird hybrid traits indeed that were obviously segregating on those plants from certain recessive or hidden genes within the population.

^ yeah that. nothing personal. this is a classroom and the students are teaching the class.

 

[CimeTempestose]

.. reading ... learning .. .. tuned

 

[vapor]

Hope you all are still growing great africans in the new years... SO a wee update, for fun i kept one of the original angola reds that had bad intersex traits{around week 5,6 of flower} But i loved the smell so bad, i couldnt kill her. So we have crossed her into a few things haze, puna haze etc etc, So far the daughter from the heavy intersex female i liked are not showing intersex at all almost done flowering will post pics when i get em done.... I want to hunt down that smell profile in a form that is not intersexed so i can share them, it was much different smells wise then the ar13 cut i keep, more citrus in a very strange way....peace and light

 

[vapor]

Here is my angola red 13 cut x original haze male....

 

[vapor]

Here be angola red 18{intersex mom} x original haze male... You can see no intersex were around week 11

 

[Mustafunk]

My angolese as grown by several friends the past season. Thank u brothers!

Outdoors in Germany, coping with below zero temps inside a greenhouse:

Indoors US:

After a few generations of selection, she's testing 12-15%THC quite consistently. Interesing high terpene contents too. Not bad for a pure african, right?

Vibes.