You know I never looked into cmh that closely until you mentioned that they work in an HPS ballast and it appears as thought they do! The bulbs aren't too pricey either. So perhaps that is the best route to go here. I love waldiest's thread and have seen his zig zag wire method, very similar to bonsai training. It appears that cmh delivers the best spectrum, any other users?
Indoor tropical sativa grow lighting questions
- Thread starter walkabout
- Start date
I use the 315w CMH which some would consider the best(hotly debated in the CMH thread I linked earlier. But they only work with their own special ballast. Personally, after using them and reading what others have to say, I believe they're close to the best lighting out there for small scale growers. So of course I would recommend them. But the initial cost is highish. Similar to LED initial cost.
They make retro fit bulbs that will work with certain HPS ballast. I've never used them and know nothing about them but have heard good things. If I already owned an HPS ballast I would of gone that route.
I think this is what you want if you go Retro Fit. But I may be wrong. I know nothing about them.
http://www.advancedtechlighting.com/cdmed18.htm
It appears as though HTG supply has a 400w cmh reasonably cheap...in my situation where I have the 250w ballast its more expensive but if I didn't have it then that option isn't too much as far as initial cost. Is advancedtechlighting the only place these retro fit bulbs are available cuz I am not seeing them elsewhere haha
I've heard good things about the retro whites and I think that's your best option. They are discontinued which is why most retailers have dropped them.
I wouldn't buy a new CMH setup in your situation unless it was the 315w Philips. You'll have to do some research but not all CMH are created equal. If you want to spend the money and time and effort you have a few options.
Advanced Tech Lighting sells a kit which makes things nice and easy. But you don't get to use the best bulb.
They also sell the Ballast on it's own. If you can source the PGZ sockets(hard to find) and DIY wiring(the ballast run off 220v) or (buy a transformer off Amazon) then you can buy a Agro/Green Power 315w bulb(made for agriculture) Around $300 total cost. This does not include a reflector. Works well for Vert. This is what I did for my setup btw.
And finally the most expensive option is to buy from Cycloptics.
https://www.cycloptics.com/store
The appeal of this option is the reflector. It's made for the bulbs and there's all kinds of info on their site and in the last 10 pages of the CMH thread I linked earlier. Very highly recommended by trusted people on this forum. Very expensive upfront.
But really the Reto Whites are your best, simplest, cheapest, option. But if you do want to spend money on a new setup. Don't spend it on "other" CMH.
I wouldn't buy a new CMH setup in your situation unless it was the 315w Philips. You'll have to do some research but not all CMH are created equal. If you want to spend the money and time and effort you have a few options.
Advanced Tech Lighting sells a kit which makes things nice and easy. But you don't get to use the best bulb.
They also sell the Ballast on it's own. If you can source the PGZ sockets(hard to find) and DIY wiring(the ballast run off 220v) or (buy a transformer off Amazon) then you can buy a Agro/Green Power 315w bulb(made for agriculture) Around $300 total cost. This does not include a reflector. Works well for Vert. This is what I did for my setup btw.
And finally the most expensive option is to buy from Cycloptics.
https://www.cycloptics.com/store
The appeal of this option is the reflector. It's made for the bulbs and there's all kinds of info on their site and in the last 10 pages of the CMH thread I linked earlier. Very highly recommended by trusted people on this forum. Very expensive upfront.
But really the Reto Whites are your best, simplest, cheapest, option. But if you do want to spend money on a new setup. Don't spend it on "other" CMH.
Seems like a great grow ...only let down by the inexperience of the grower and his gear, bigger 4x4 tent and a 400/600w hps digital is what you need
http://www.amazon.com/Aviditi-PTU-6...004U6XSRC/ref=pd_sim_lg_2/186-1433666-7723462
http://www.amazon.com/Apollo-Dimmable-Hydroponic-Reflector-Pressure/dp/B004L3AQ1U/ref=pd_sbs_lg_2
http://www.amazon.com/Aviditi-PTU-6...004U6XSRC/ref=pd_sim_lg_2/186-1433666-7723462
http://www.amazon.com/Apollo-Dimmable-Hydroponic-Reflector-Pressure/dp/B004L3AQ1U/ref=pd_sbs_lg_2
Waldgeist
Active member
i use one 100w cdm for veg and also 2 of them for flowering,
those are industry floodlights, for veg i made a reflector
, the ones in flower i still use as they are sold, only removed the security glass in front of the bulb. Imho those small wattages are not very prone to explode when mishandeled as their bigger sisters, i foliared onto them several times and nothing happened. also can confirm shock resistance while running.
they sell around 35€ for the complete Philips fixture, e-ballast and bulb included. you also can get the parts (bulbs/ballasts) of the smaller wattages like 35/50/70/100/150 watts really cheap on egay in about the same price range. 70 watt hardware is the cheapest. possible to find bulb and ballast for around 15€.
Theres Philips Elite cdm-t and standart cdm-t bulbs, you only want elites, they have longer life and better lm/watt. Osram sells equivalent bulbs as HCI-T, theres also a 250w HCI-TT (cost around 40€/bulb, E40) that can be run on standart hps ballast, hehe.
I would say the hardware is very good but the inbuild reflectors of my lights are not suited for growing as it delivers the light too spotted, its just a floodlight for high ceiligs, its ~60° beam angle with a long rectangular footprint.
the bulbs I use are Philips CDM-T 100W (942+930) MASTERColor Elite G12.
heres a single plant right now under one of them
those are industry floodlights, for veg i made a reflector
they sell around 35€ for the complete Philips fixture, e-ballast and bulb included. you also can get the parts (bulbs/ballasts) of the smaller wattages like 35/50/70/100/150 watts really cheap on egay in about the same price range. 70 watt hardware is the cheapest. possible to find bulb and ballast for around 15€.
Theres Philips Elite cdm-t and standart cdm-t bulbs, you only want elites, they have longer life and better lm/watt. Osram sells equivalent bulbs as HCI-T, theres also a 250w HCI-TT (cost around 40€/bulb, E40) that can be run on standart hps ballast, hehe.
I would say the hardware is very good but the inbuild reflectors of my lights are not suited for growing as it delivers the light too spotted, its just a floodlight for high ceiligs, its ~60° beam angle with a long rectangular footprint.
the bulbs I use are Philips CDM-T 100W (942+930) MASTERColor Elite G12.
heres a single plant right now under one of them
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Waldgeist
Active member
this what you want:
Osram HCI-TT, 250watt
http://www.osram.com/osram_com/prod...ceramic-technology/powerball-hci-tt/index.jsp
you have to pick the 250watt model, then you can see into its datasheet.
you can use this bulb with your 250w hps ballast it works, i use it myself
Hey there Waldgeist, thanks for the info.
I am not sure of yours but the security glass you mentioned sounds like the uvb blocking glass I have read of before. The bare bulbs put out uvb and a and c too I guess in unknown amounts. Just in case there is any danger there to avoid.
I am not sure of yours but the security glass you mentioned sounds like the uvb blocking glass I have read of before. The bare bulbs put out uvb and a and c too I guess in unknown amounts. Just in case there is any danger there to avoid.
Waldgeist
Active member
Hey yesum,
I think the uv blocking glass is already the one thats directly around the bulb, my bulb packaging sais 'uv-block' , the philips datasheet mentions:
'UV-related Characteristics
Damage Factor D/fc 0.4 (max) - '
have no clue what that means
i use proper sunglasses when working under them anyways.It also sais:
• Use only in totally enclosed luminaire, even during testing
(IEC61167, IEC 62035, IEC60598)
• The luminaire must be able to contain hot lamp parts if the lamp
ruptures
heres the datasheet, last page is a simple spectral analysis(zoom):
http://download.p4c.philips.com/l4b/9/928064205131_eu/928064205131_eu_pss_aenaa.pdf
best, wald
Hi walkabout,
250 w HPS is ok to flower small sativa clones, of course the higher light intensity the better (keeping always the temperatures in a good range). It's also good idea to use different type of lighting and lamps in different positions, extra vertical lighting is great to improve the development of the lower branches of big plants.
There are excellent examples of other users in this room about growing sativas in small spaces, Waldgeist comes to my mind.
