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If the Federal Reserve was to abolished-what would replace it?
- Thread starter minds_I
- Start date
NorCalChron
Member
what do you think our country did before 1913? printed the damn paper ourselves. nothing federal about the federal reserve.
Hello all,
Ok, print hte money ourselves...are you aware that the dollar is worth 4 cents of what it was in 1913.
What do we use to back up this dollar with?
My question really is this, if the fedral reserve were to to abolished. What would we then base or dollar on? Gold???? We don't have enough.
I have no asnwer and profer none. I am worried the US will suffer another depression.
The feds just lowered the prime lending rate again....this is in response to the real estate market and all those "creative finacing" and the spending of equity at a low interest rate.
If the bubble bursts, to what depth will the economic hardship go? And in this day and age of limited self-sufficiancy and dependance upon the 7-11 on the corner...man, I do not see anything pretty.
In retrospect and in line with other threads of simillar content...just look at how humans became animals after Katrina.
I do not wish to be a fear monger...but in the face of uncertain futures...one at least ask the "what if questions"...if only for my own education.
minds_I
Ok, print hte money ourselves...are you aware that the dollar is worth 4 cents of what it was in 1913.
What do we use to back up this dollar with?
My question really is this, if the fedral reserve were to to abolished. What would we then base or dollar on? Gold???? We don't have enough.
I have no asnwer and profer none. I am worried the US will suffer another depression.
The feds just lowered the prime lending rate again....this is in response to the real estate market and all those "creative finacing" and the spending of equity at a low interest rate.
If the bubble bursts, to what depth will the economic hardship go? And in this day and age of limited self-sufficiancy and dependance upon the 7-11 on the corner...man, I do not see anything pretty.
In retrospect and in line with other threads of simillar content...just look at how humans became animals after Katrina.
I do not wish to be a fear monger...but in the face of uncertain futures...one at least ask the "what if questions"...if only for my own education.
minds_I
Wiimote
Member
I'm not sure what commodity we could use to back the dollar. And I agree that changing to a commodity based currency would cause some sort term hardships.
The problem is though, if the current trends continue, things could get just as bad just as quick. Right now, you could say that oil backs the US dollar. If you want to buy oil, you have to pay in dollars. That creates the demand for the dollar which allows a fiat currency to work. Money always has to be desirable or else it loses all it's value. If the world decided tomorrow that all international markets would be traded on the Euro, all your worst fears would come true. 1929 would look like a picnic in the park. Luckily that probally won't happen. But global confidence is the dollar could plummet and cause some severe damage to America.
The problem is though, if the current trends continue, things could get just as bad just as quick. Right now, you could say that oil backs the US dollar. If you want to buy oil, you have to pay in dollars. That creates the demand for the dollar which allows a fiat currency to work. Money always has to be desirable or else it loses all it's value. If the world decided tomorrow that all international markets would be traded on the Euro, all your worst fears would come true. 1929 would look like a picnic in the park. Luckily that probally won't happen. But global confidence is the dollar could plummet and cause some severe damage to America.
G
Guest
i believe RPs plan is to put us back on the gold standard...its a little difficult for me to imagine a coherent banking system without the fed but i imagine it would take them about a week to figure it out with all the money at stake...the money issue is a big problem but the fact of the matter is that if the fed adopted a super hawkish bias and reduced the money supply on its own (as it should technically do if it was really interested in our best interests) then we wouldn't have to worry about it...something is going to have to give though if the dollar continues its freefall...china and japan are holding a ton of treasuries, maybe this is our way of getting back at china for their yuan scam...
Here in my town of about 170,000, we have a secondary local currency used by and traded by local people who live and work here. You can work at a store and part of your pay can go towards local dollars versus federal dollars. Other stores in the same town accept this as currency for their goods. Other towns and small cities have similar local currency. We might have to *GASP* depend on local trade versus global trade. Scary, I know 
I guess this a rumor, but to mention of the Amero. I read that scratching the dollar is what the feds having plans for. Not necessarily calling it the Amero, I dunno. Point was...I think Israel did the same thing before; the scratched what they had and replaced their current currency, it can be done smoothly.
I heard RP mention competing currencies before. People will determine what they are willing to back with their assets.
A. Federal Reserve note B. note backed by metals both industrial and precious c. note back on commodities d. foreign currencies e. US stocks f. oil g. insert here
I heard RP mention competing currencies before. People will determine what they are willing to back with their assets.
A. Federal Reserve note B. note backed by metals both industrial and precious c. note back on commodities d. foreign currencies e. US stocks f. oil g. insert here
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I actually love this situation. Mainly because even though it affects me as much as you, I still love shoving it into the face of every idiot who ever argued about the strength and especially the stability of American currency in the global market and the strength of America's economic system and how every other country's economies revolve around Americas, etc, etc.
Some Q & A that might help answer some of these questions
Q: Abolishing the IRS is crazy. How can we pay for running the government?
A: The federal income tax proceeds make up approximately 1/3rd of the federal budget. With all of the reductions in government under a Paul administration the federal income tax is unnecessary. Certainly we can reduce the federal government by 33%, at least. See The Case Against the Income Tax by Ron Paul.
Q: Going back to the gold standard will cause all sorts of catastrophic problems in banking and the stock market.
A: He is not an advocate of going back to the gold standard necessarily. He would foster competition in hard money (money backed by gold or silver) along with the federal reserve notes (fiat money) we have today. He has stated that eliminating the Fed and fiat money immediately is irresponsible and believes passing laws to legalize other forms of currency would foster competition that would end up eliminating fiat money in a slower and safer fashion. See What the Price of Gold is Telling Us by Ron Paul.
Quotes from RP
When the federal government spends more each year than it collects in tax revenues, it has three choices: It can raise taxes, print money, or borrow money. While these actions may benefit politicians, all three options are bad for average Americans.“
“A system of capitalism presumes sound money, not fiat money manipulated by a central bank. Capitalism cherishes voluntary contracts and interest rates that are determined by savings, not credit creation by a central bank.”
“Capitalism should not be condemned, since we haven’t had capitalism.”
Q: Abolishing the IRS is crazy. How can we pay for running the government?
A: The federal income tax proceeds make up approximately 1/3rd of the federal budget. With all of the reductions in government under a Paul administration the federal income tax is unnecessary. Certainly we can reduce the federal government by 33%, at least. See The Case Against the Income Tax by Ron Paul.
Q: Going back to the gold standard will cause all sorts of catastrophic problems in banking and the stock market.
A: He is not an advocate of going back to the gold standard necessarily. He would foster competition in hard money (money backed by gold or silver) along with the federal reserve notes (fiat money) we have today. He has stated that eliminating the Fed and fiat money immediately is irresponsible and believes passing laws to legalize other forms of currency would foster competition that would end up eliminating fiat money in a slower and safer fashion. See What the Price of Gold is Telling Us by Ron Paul.
Quotes from RP
When the federal government spends more each year than it collects in tax revenues, it has three choices: It can raise taxes, print money, or borrow money. While these actions may benefit politicians, all three options are bad for average Americans.“
“A system of capitalism presumes sound money, not fiat money manipulated by a central bank. Capitalism cherishes voluntary contracts and interest rates that are determined by savings, not credit creation by a central bank.”
“Capitalism should not be condemned, since we haven’t had capitalism.”
If the Federal Reserve was to abolished-what would replace it?
Freedom.
Freedom.
money has never been backed up by anything besides a fancy network of imagination and collective agreement in whether money or the gold or the resevres that the money is supposedly back up with has a real value. any intelligent person realizes that whether money, whether gold, it simply has no value besides the arbitrary value and importance you subjectively assign to such objects. that is economics even atheists bow down to this imaginary god 
paz
even atheists bow down to this imaginary god paz
FRANKENBLUNT420
me blunt is like, wicked yo!! owight
. . .and i will be standing right behind you with a wheelbarrow full of it and an extra shovel just in case you get tired of shoveling bruh!! totally with you on that, hands down!marx2k said:
WoW maannnn
Member
SilverSurfer_OG said:
yep
state rights
C
Chamba
Right now, you could say that oil backs the US dollar. If you want to buy oil, you have to pay in dollars. That creates the demand for the dollar which allows a fiat currency to work. Money always has to be desirable or else it loses all it's value. If the world decided tomorrow that all international markets would be traded on the Euro, all your worst fears would come true. 1929 would look like a picnic in the park. Luckily that probally won't happen. But global confidence is the dollar could plummet and cause some severe damage to America.
Saddam had the audacity to try and sell Iraqi oil for Euros instead of US dollars..............silly him!
if another oil producing country like Venezuela or some Middle Eastern country decided to sell it's oil in a currency other than US dollars tomorrow then the US would invade it in a New York minute, that's for sure not maybe!
You are right, if the US$ became just another currency then a worldwide depression and or war would occur..history repeats....
let's also keep in mind that price to earning ratios are at silly levels never seen before......there's a few headlines spuiking about doom and gloom, so you can bet the average donk will panic and sell up, the big guys will buy up and then the markets will soar to new heights, the media will tell us that the market is soaring getting all the lemmings excited and they will jump in as it peaks, as they always do, the big guys will sell hard as the volume and market peaks, the market will panic and then there will be a major sell off ....history repeats
if the US $ somehow no longer was the major currency that was traded, then the US would be in the dirt ..and they may as well call it the US Peso due to it's massive debt and minimal exports...if the US was a company, it would be bankrupt tomorrow..unless a major turn around happens soon then the USA will definitely decline as a major power, then the rest of the world will also go into a decline..but if the US maintains it's military supremacy then things will stay artificially the same for a little longer
being wise in retrospect, if the US had not blown it's surplus on the chase for WMD and other lies and Greenspan, US Fed and US Govt had prevented, controlled or regulated the current mortage problem from happening by discouraging those idiotic and plainly irresponsible home loans to deadbeats, overloaded investors and the greedy late comers then the US would be in a much better state financially than it is now.
Greenspan was not the genius everyone made him out to be...he held the reins during an upturn in the cycle, that's all....when history looks back they will rightly lay the blame for the upcoming (largely preventable) sharp world economic downturn on him for his lack of decisive action several years ago when things were showing signs of obvious overheating......
Saddam had the audacity to try and sell Iraqi oil for Euros instead of US dollars..............silly him!
if another oil producing country like Venezuela or some Middle Eastern country decided to sell it's oil in a currency other than US dollars tomorrow then the US would invade it in a New York minute, that's for sure not maybe!
You are right, if the US$ became just another currency then a worldwide depression and or war would occur..history repeats....
let's also keep in mind that price to earning ratios are at silly levels never seen before......there's a few headlines spuiking about doom and gloom, so you can bet the average donk will panic and sell up, the big guys will buy up and then the markets will soar to new heights, the media will tell us that the market is soaring getting all the lemmings excited and they will jump in as it peaks, as they always do, the big guys will sell hard as the volume and market peaks, the market will panic and then there will be a major sell off ....history repeats
if the US $ somehow no longer was the major currency that was traded, then the US would be in the dirt ..and they may as well call it the US Peso due to it's massive debt and minimal exports...if the US was a company, it would be bankrupt tomorrow..unless a major turn around happens soon then the USA will definitely decline as a major power, then the rest of the world will also go into a decline..but if the US maintains it's military supremacy then things will stay artificially the same for a little longer
being wise in retrospect, if the US had not blown it's surplus on the chase for WMD and other lies and Greenspan, US Fed and US Govt had prevented, controlled or regulated the current mortage problem from happening by discouraging those idiotic and plainly irresponsible home loans to deadbeats, overloaded investors and the greedy late comers then the US would be in a much better state financially than it is now.
Greenspan was not the genius everyone made him out to be...he held the reins during an upturn in the cycle, that's all....when history looks back they will rightly lay the blame for the upcoming (largely preventable) sharp world economic downturn on him for his lack of decisive action several years ago when things were showing signs of obvious overheating......
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D
dreamdancer
Local Exchange Trading Systems (LETS) also known as LETSystems are local, non-profit exchange networks in which goods and services can be traded without the need for printed currency.
LETS networks use interest-free local credit so direct swaps do not need to be made. For instance, a member may earn credit by doing childcare for one person and spend it later on carpentry with another person in the same network. In LETS, unlike other local currencies, no scrip is issued, but rather transactions are recorded in a central location open to all members. As credit is issued by the network members, for the benefit of the members themselves, LETS are considered mutual credit systems.
Michael Linton originated the term "Local Exchange Trading System" in 1982 and, with his wife Shirley, for a time ran the Comox Valley LETSystems in Courtenay, British Columbia. The system he designed was intended as an adjunct to the national currency, rather than a replacement for it, although there are examples of individuals who have managed to replace their use of national currency through inventive usage of LETS.
LETS are generally considered to have the following five fundamental criteria:
Cost of service - from the community for the community
Consent - there is no compulsion to trade
Disclosure - information about balances is available to all members
Equivalence to the national currency
No interest
Of these criteria, "equivalence" is the most controversial. According to a 1996 survey by LetsLink UK, only 13% of LETS networks actually practice equivalence, with most groups establishing alternate systems of valuation "in order to divorce [themselves] entirely from the mainstream economy." Michael Linton has stated that such systems are "personal money" networks rather than LETS.
How LETS work
Local people set up a club to trade between themselves, keeping their own record of accounts.
A directory of members' offers and requests—goods, services or items for hire, priced in local LETS units—is compiled and circulated.
Members use the directory to contact one another whenever they wish. They pay for any service or goods by writing a LETS cheque or credit note for an agreed amount of LETS units, or by exchanging printed LETS notes.
If applicable, the credit note is sent to the LETS bookkeeper who adjusts both members' accounts accordingly.
Since its commencement over 20 years ago, LETSystems have been highly innovative in adapting to the needs of their local communities in all kinds of ways. For example in Australia, people have built houses using LETS in place of a bank mortgage, freeing the owner from onerous interest payments.
LETS is a fully fledged "monetary system", unlike direct barter, with LETS members able to earn credits from any member and spend them with anyone else on the scheme.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LETS
LETS networks use interest-free local credit so direct swaps do not need to be made. For instance, a member may earn credit by doing childcare for one person and spend it later on carpentry with another person in the same network. In LETS, unlike other local currencies, no scrip is issued, but rather transactions are recorded in a central location open to all members. As credit is issued by the network members, for the benefit of the members themselves, LETS are considered mutual credit systems.
Michael Linton originated the term "Local Exchange Trading System" in 1982 and, with his wife Shirley, for a time ran the Comox Valley LETSystems in Courtenay, British Columbia. The system he designed was intended as an adjunct to the national currency, rather than a replacement for it, although there are examples of individuals who have managed to replace their use of national currency through inventive usage of LETS.
LETS are generally considered to have the following five fundamental criteria:
Cost of service - from the community for the community
Consent - there is no compulsion to trade
Disclosure - information about balances is available to all members
Equivalence to the national currency
No interest
Of these criteria, "equivalence" is the most controversial. According to a 1996 survey by LetsLink UK, only 13% of LETS networks actually practice equivalence, with most groups establishing alternate systems of valuation "in order to divorce [themselves] entirely from the mainstream economy." Michael Linton has stated that such systems are "personal money" networks rather than LETS.
How LETS work
Local people set up a club to trade between themselves, keeping their own record of accounts.
A directory of members' offers and requests—goods, services or items for hire, priced in local LETS units—is compiled and circulated.
Members use the directory to contact one another whenever they wish. They pay for any service or goods by writing a LETS cheque or credit note for an agreed amount of LETS units, or by exchanging printed LETS notes.
If applicable, the credit note is sent to the LETS bookkeeper who adjusts both members' accounts accordingly.
Since its commencement over 20 years ago, LETSystems have been highly innovative in adapting to the needs of their local communities in all kinds of ways. For example in Australia, people have built houses using LETS in place of a bank mortgage, freeing the owner from onerous interest payments.
LETS is a fully fledged "monetary system", unlike direct barter, with LETS members able to earn credits from any member and spend them with anyone else on the scheme.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LETS
what when the already existing technologies that can replace oil and be a source of free energy are finally released and implanted world-wide? wait, that is already happening... what will happen to the currency? whether euro, bolivar or dollar? 
just because you have a massive herd of peoples following a destructive trend, does not mean that their idea of what is valuable is factual.
paz.
just because you have a massive herd of peoples following a destructive trend, does not mean that their idea of what is valuable is factual.
paz.
Right now, the dollar is backed by the overall health of the American economy. The only thing wrong Federal Reserve system is when Americans borrow too much, thus become to leveraged and economic growth is slower than other countries the dollar follows to earth.
The idea of returning to the gold standard is just not going to happen. There are too many power players with too much to loose that would block it!
The idea of returning to the gold standard is just not going to happen. There are too many power players with too much to loose that would block it!
PazVerdeRadical said:what when the already existing technologies that can replace oil and be a source of free energy are finally released and implanted world-wide? wait, that is already happening... what will happen to the currency? whether euro, bolivar or dollar?
just because you have a massive herd of peoples following a destructive trend, does not mean that their idea of what is valuable is factual.
paz.
That is debatable, as I am not aware of a "magic wand" that generates the massive amount of energy, that billions of people demand each day on this planet.
