St. Phatty
Active member
Why are extra Cations Good, for growing Pot ?
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If clay holds cations why don't we add a little to our soilless mixes?
- Thread starter Growdo Baggins
- Start date
The acidic peat will probably also need a lot of ag lime or oyster shells.
Growdo Baggins
Active member
I think it's because more cations means more available nutrients. Hopefully someone can chime in and confirm that. I'm still just learning this stuff.
No don't add any amendments to the peat or you will disqualify the CEC principle.
There are a few more cations than before with the addition of peat. However, the cations have a stronger bond that will hold on to nutrients longer allowing for fewer fertilizers to be used. It's not more fertilizer just more of a stronger bonding with the fertilizer. .
Cation exchange capacity (CEC) is a measure of the soil’s ability to hold positively charged ions. It is a very important soil property influencing soil structure stability, nutrient availability, soil pH, and the soil’s reaction to fertilizers and other ameliorants
any garden area i've ever did took time,but it is worth the trouble for the return in growth!
Most heavy clays are loaded with nutrients with the exception of nitrogen. When you drop the pH in the clay you boost the CEC and allow the other nutrients to become available. I do this by just adding Canadian peat moss to the clay. The peat moss brings a lot of good stuff to the garden when you have clay present. The nitrogen source you add will be determined by your preference for organic or synthetic.
ramse
Well-known member
Zeolite. Montmorillonite clay is also sometimes used in budget mixes, but zeolite is definitely the number one choice. At least by a ratio of 15% if you want to see any significant results.
I'm talking for soilless mixes. For outdoor soils rich in clay, acid peat, organic matter and chalk (only on non-carbonate soils)
I'm talking for soilless mixes. For outdoor soils rich in clay, acid peat, organic matter and chalk (only on non-carbonate soils)
around here you are diging redrock with clay ,sandstone or limestone everywhere !
I have dug my own and Sun dried it to the point of complete dryness. I crushed it into the finest particles. Use a cotton shirt to sift through to keep the aggregates the same size. Or one can just buy some already screened.
Ca++
Well-known member
Digging does present the problem, of not knowing what's in it. Often clay holds excess amounts of some things, but is lacking in others. I saw a lot of variation, sampling 6 of the sites I use. Though most were just a few miles apart.
Clay is really not a great medium for a plant that loves air at the roots. Getting the cec up, would have to be very important to you, to be using such a thing.
Personally, when I'm running soilless mixes, I'm hitting it like hydro. So don't need a cec at all, in theory.
If we look at farming as an example, the guy with a high cec, can dump a seasons worth of some feeds out, in one go. While the low cec land, might need 3 applications. As the feed has nothing to hold on to.
When I'm giving a high peat mix ec1.4 every day, it doesn't need a lot of holding capacity. The only clay on my mind, might be expanded aggregate. Though tbh, I buy a good bag of stuff, that needs no fixing.
Clay is really not a great medium for a plant that loves air at the roots. Getting the cec up, would have to be very important to you, to be using such a thing.
Personally, when I'm running soilless mixes, I'm hitting it like hydro. So don't need a cec at all, in theory.
If we look at farming as an example, the guy with a high cec, can dump a seasons worth of some feeds out, in one go. While the low cec land, might need 3 applications. As the feed has nothing to hold on to.
When I'm giving a high peat mix ec1.4 every day, it doesn't need a lot of holding capacity. The only clay on my mind, might be expanded aggregate. Though tbh, I buy a good bag of stuff, that needs no fixing.
our soil and water are alkaline, so i suppose that peat would be the choice.
Just a potter's note about adding clay. The best glaze, or should i say the glaze that fits the clay pot best is the 'slip' that is made from the clay. When we would screen our dry clay to the desired fine-ness and have a gallon or so in a five gallon pail, we'd add water to near the top, stir. The clay would settle, but the 'slip' water would be saved for natural glaze. We would spray the slip water onto the clay pot and it would be the best for not dripping or sliding off the pot during high firing. Anyway, even though it looks just like water, after sitting a couple of days, it is still full of goodies. If careful not to stir up much clay at the bottom of the pail when taking the water off, i wonder if it would clog some of the simple forms of 'soil-less' methods. I suppose that it would eventually clog emitters or blumats.
I also wanted to mention that smaller amounts of very clean clay could be purchased at newdirectionsdotcom . Their inventory changes with world events, so not everything stays available and pricing changes with the political and weather whims. What is really nice, is that the contents of the clays are detailed in the additional paperwork on the site. I got some rassoul clay from them, because it didn't have aluminum listed...so that was rather handy.
Other neat items can be purchased from them for plant use, also. (We are hooked on the wintergreen essential oil for our old age muscle aches. Need to be very careful with it, it is super potent, just a couple of drops!) I read that it is useful to add a drop in a gallon of water...basically, it is aspirin, for upping a plant's immunity. Very good prices and multiple sizes of very pure oils there. They are a major distributor and you can buy by the sample or the barrel.
Just a potter's note about adding clay. The best glaze, or should i say the glaze that fits the clay pot best is the 'slip' that is made from the clay. When we would screen our dry clay to the desired fine-ness and have a gallon or so in a five gallon pail, we'd add water to near the top, stir. The clay would settle, but the 'slip' water would be saved for natural glaze. We would spray the slip water onto the clay pot and it would be the best for not dripping or sliding off the pot during high firing. Anyway, even though it looks just like water, after sitting a couple of days, it is still full of goodies. If careful not to stir up much clay at the bottom of the pail when taking the water off, i wonder if it would clog some of the simple forms of 'soil-less' methods. I suppose that it would eventually clog emitters or blumats.
I also wanted to mention that smaller amounts of very clean clay could be purchased at newdirectionsdotcom . Their inventory changes with world events, so not everything stays available and pricing changes with the political and weather whims. What is really nice, is that the contents of the clays are detailed in the additional paperwork on the site. I got some rassoul clay from them, because it didn't have aluminum listed...so that was rather handy.
Other neat items can be purchased from them for plant use, also. (We are hooked on the wintergreen essential oil for our old age muscle aches. Need to be very careful with it, it is super potent, just a couple of drops!) I read that it is useful to add a drop in a gallon of water...basically, it is aspirin, for upping a plant's immunity. Very good prices and multiple sizes of very pure oils there. They are a major distributor and you can buy by the sample or the barrel.
Bio boy
Active member
That’s what I wondered ,variations and unknown npks
By hitting hydro do you mean like sip organic style lettin em suck it up or fertiliser hydro
Ca++
Well-known member
I feed like it was hydro. Many feeds for this job, don't contain things like calcium or magnesium. That might be okay for other plants, but I'm growing fast. I give them everything they need, and pretty much ignore what the substrate might supply. I don't use huge pots, so it's exhausted before long anyway. It's just there for taste, not nutrients.
Frankenbeanie
Member
Clay - Aluminum silicate
You can call yourself Clay but you're not Clay without aluminum. That'd be talc. But we know how pot growers like to reinvent and rebrand what already exist.
You can call yourself Clay but you're not Clay without aluminum. That'd be talc. But we know how pot growers like to reinvent and rebrand what already exist.
