If a Female Hermie's after EXTREME Stress, are the Seeds Always Bad ?

[St. Phatty]

One of the girls that got frozen - and recovered - came out with some Hermie's pretty much overnight.

My first response was to put her outside in the "chicken feed" area. To be eaten.

Then I realized, maybe the seeds would be good seeds, with good genetics.

When people kill Hermie's, it's because they think the plant will make "more of the same".

But in this case, well I don't plan on freezing any more plants.

Is it possible the seeds she creates will be regular male or female seeds ?

Or are these seeds now somehow destined to produce Hermie's ?

 

[Teddybrae]

Phatty, why take the chance?

 

[St. Phatty]

Phatty, why take the chance?

It's not like I'm going to die if I get a hermie.

The female that went Hermie - it's not like she had a genetic transplant.

She was either normal Female genetics - or a Hermie.

50-50% chance ?

If she was normal Female genetics, and then goes Hermie from the stress of being Frozen Solid ... pretty extreme stress ... is there something about the pollen that guarantees that the seeds will themselves be Hermie ?

I'm asking questions to see if anybody else has experience with Freezing plants.

I'm thinking - could this be a way to create Fem seeds ? Only one way to find out. I figure that's a good chance to take.

If I run a separate flowering area, then the pollen will only affect this one plant. If I take clones from this plant and flower them, I'll just keep an eye on them.

Mainly this batch of plants is to give me genetics for the summer. I can get plenty of clones from the other 3 (or 5) females that survived freezing.

 

[I'mback]

Time... the most valuable resource we still have control of.

 

[Brother Nature]

A lot of the 'elite strains' tend to hermie when not treated delicately, but still get bread with plenty. I'm running a nice indica hybrid that does it late into flower if nutes or environment aren't prefect, doesn't produce seed though as it only really happens a week or two before harvest. The buds still really nice and I have no need to sell it off so not a bother for me, though if I were making more seed I'd probably not use her, but if I ever did find some in her dried product I'd run them just to see how they turned out.

 

[WelderDan]

The seeds aren't necessarily "bad." If it hermied under good conditions, then I'd say no, hermies tend to beget more hermies. If it only hermied after you stressed it pretty hard, then they may be ok to grow.

If you believe the origin stories of some of the elites, they came from hermies.

I've grown out seeds from hermies with no problems, and also some that were very hermie prone.

It's a crapshoot. Your mileage may vary.

 

[St. Phatty]

I think I'll let the 4 of them flower together, but sequester the Hermie plant some of the time.

Trying to get some spring Meds out of the grow. I don't mind a sprinkling of seeds on the other 3 plants.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Freezing hermied her? Thank you, I'll add that to my stress testing for weeding out hermies.

Unless you have some inkling of genetics in there you don't want to lose, I'm of the opinion it's best to chop the plant. Should there be genetics you want, I strongly suggest a femmed S1 run so you have thousands of seeds to sort through. Stress them all and breed only with the stable ones. In a few generations she should be much more stable, and possibly even have removed that trait. Femming is easier than you might think, take a look at the link in my sig and see for yourself.

 

[trichrider]

how far along was this plant? it froze and then recovered? outside?


every plant has the ability to hermie, just in case the environment doesn't treat it right.
too hot, too cold, too wet, too dry, no natural pollination, light cycle discrepancies, etc
every one.


i saw your comment about planting out recently and wondered if you had put these outside in unfavorable daylight (less than 12hrs day-length).

 

[therevverend]

I never take chances with hermies, I've been culling anything that shows a nanner and I haven't had a bad hermie in almost a decade. That said, if the plant really was stable and proven to not throw nanners in any other situation, the seeds could be valuable. On the other hand, if it's just one of a number of plants, and it hermied bad under stress, who's to say it wouldn't hermie next time nature throws a curve. If you do grow the seeds out let us know what happens. The more field tests the more we know.

 

[St. Phatty]

I never take chances with hermies, I've been culling anything that shows a nanner and I haven't had a bad hermie in almost a decade. That said, if the plant really was stable and proven to not throw nanners in any other situation, the seeds could be valuable.

The more field tests the more we know.

Yeah, not much to lose by letting them go.

I took about 10 cuttings. I don't feel like having 2 flowering rooms right now so the easiest way to deal with it is to keep the 1 flowering room at 12/12 for the Hermie and her 3 sisters.

Then move the 4 bags of cuttings to another light, when it's lights off in the flowering Hermie room.

 

[St. Phatty]

The end result. One big Hermie'd female and 3 female companions, the bigger plants on the side.

The Hermie grew up into the light - it grew fast.

When I moved it, it did its thing. Pollen everywhere.

So now I got a batch of baby seeds developing with a BIG question mark over their head.

The females are all Blueberry Headband crosses.

 

[St. Phatty]

Planted 20 of the seeds yesterday, from 3 different plants that got pollinated by the Hermie.

1 of them was extra skunky so did 8 of her seeds.

no down-side - as long as i keep an eye out for bananas.

plants that don't work out get fed to the wildlife.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Time... the most valuable resource we still have control of.

This is what keeps coming to mind, yes.

Just think of how awesome your grow would/could be, if you spent this time searching for stable genetics instead. You're preserving something the entire educated community is working to eradicate.

 

[mriko]

What kind of hermi traits does your plant show?

IS that "cosexual" hermaphroditism, with both sex in the same flower, or has your plant produced distinct, on their own, true male flowers such as shown in this photo ?



If as on the photo, your seeds are most probably good, and might well produce all female plants.

Irie!

 

[Ready4]

You will be fine with those - they are not true "hermies" . Grow them out, the worst that can happen is you get a few seeds. Great hybrid strain, cut away the crappy low branches and you probably will have zero seeds. If you grow them outdoors, they will have zero seeds also.

Very funny how some people freak over a few seeds - if it is product for your own personal use ( not for sale), some seeds should bother nobody.

 

[djonkoman]

What kind of hermi traits does your plant show?

IS that "cosexual" hermaphroditism, with both sex in the same flower, or has your plant produced distinct, on their own, true male flowers such as shown in this photo ?

[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=21564&pictureid=2029496&thumb=1]View Image[/url]

If as on the photo, your seeds are most probably good, and might well produce all female plants.

Irie!

I kind of doubt that last statement, most hermi's I've seen have been the kind with seperate fully male flowers. I've killed them all.

the ones with mixed flowers, eiter a ball with a pistil sticking out or bananas, are much much rarer ime. I've only seen a few of those in my life compared to many with both fully male and fully female flowers on the same plant.

in my limited experience the banana-kind are the least bad hermi's(but I only remember encountering 2 of those in my whole life, one of them I did not discover till halfway smoking it's harvest when I found 1 banana in a dried bud. both weren't really seeded, just the random seed now and then from growing outdoor and catching some random pollen floating around which full females get too), since they often just express a very few banabas late in flower. the ones with both full male and full female flowers are often the really bad full-blown herms that often already show within a few weeks of the start of flower and can ruin all the plants standing directly around them, and definitely ruin themselves.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

SMFH

The *ONLY* difference between a male ball sack and a 'nanner' is the female flower pushing in against the 'nanner.' Without the female flower pushing at them, they form perfectly normal male pods.

The pollen is the same, they're both hermies, both types are garbage. The ONLY reason to preserve it would be if it (for some strange reason) had genetic traits you wanted to keep which are not available in any other strains. This is rather rare, and this is not what you're dealing with here.

This thread is starting to read like facebork.

 

[djonkoman]

The pollen is the same, they're both hermies, both types are garbage. The ONLY reason to preserve it would be if it (for some strange reason) had genetic traits you wanted to keep which are not available in any other strains.

that I agree with, I would not keep either if there's any choice.

but if you do want to distinguish them into different kinds, and say anything about how bad either is, personally I've had way worse experiences with the full ball-kind than with the nanner-kind.

 

[mriko]

I kind of doubt that last statement, most hermi's I've seen have been the kind with seperate fully male flowers. I've killed them all.

the ones with mixed flowers, eiter a ball with a pistil sticking out or bananas, are much much rarer ime. I've only seen a few of those in my life compared to many with both fully male and fully female flowers on the same plant.

in my limited experience the banana-kind are the least bad hermi's(but I only remember encountering 2 of those in my whole life, one of them I did not discover till halfway smoking it's harvest when I found 1 banana in a dried bud. both weren't really seeded, just the random seed now and then from growing outdoor and catching some random pollen floating around which full females get too), since they often just express a very few banabas late in flower. the ones with both full male and full female flowers are often the really bad full-blown herms that often already show within a few weeks of the start of flower and can ruin all the plants standing directly around them, and definitely ruin themselves.

Well, I guess we all speak from our own limited experience and so is mine of course.
No one wants to/plans to have hermies, but those male flowers on female plants I posted a photo of illustrate something intentional & planned. When pushing the right buttons at the right time, it is possible to make the female plant to grow between 1 and 4 pairs of male flowers, always on the lowest branches, and not a single more later in the flowering. I have produced several batches of seeds this way, and so far ALL plants grown from these have been female, without any hermaphroditism problems.

Still in my limited experience, late-flowering bananas are of non consequence, except for nice photos maybe, never got a single seeds produced from these.

To have both female and male flowers on the same plant does not necessarily means hermaphroditism (which is more about both male and female sexual organs in the same flower, in my experience) and I'm wondering wether it might be possible, or not, to have the plant to temporarily express monoecious traits...


Irie!