I can't believe this kind of mentality.
Not everyone who votes no does so out of greed.
What is it with people saying that over and over?
It's simply not true.
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How to effectively debate someone who opposes Proposition 19
- Thread starter WestCoast4Life
- Start date
I can't believe this kind of mentality.
Not everyone who votes no does so out of greed.
What is it with people saying that over and over?
It's simply not true.
I agree with that bro--
I was an Anti 19er at one time also...and it sure as fuck wasn't from Greed!!
It was from Misconceptions and Ignorance--
I have since, Educated myself...and debating with No ppl has helped me "See the Light"--
Sorry one more question, you say you would elect to buy safe pot. How does 19 provide this? When I read the bill I don't recall seeing quality restrictions or inspections of grows, but I've smoked a few bowls since then.
It is not in there--
But...I don't believe that the Meat you buy (USDA)...is safe from contaminants-- Or the Fruit, Veggies...etc...
It is all bad for you--
But...for a higher price, you can buy organically grown Veggies...Meat that is untainted...(You getting where I am going with this??)
If I thought for a second, that Growers were going to suffer from this...I would still be an Anti!!
Richard Lee is an asset to The Cause...because he is willing to put his neck in the noose--
But his "Mega Farm" will produce inferior bud...I am convinced of that-- At least for a few years before he can possibly dial in a grow of that size--
By then...we will be on a new Prop...New Laws...New ways of growing--
This, IMHO...will change all-- Maybe not to what we would all like, but in 5 years...it will be a whole new game--
I'm wondering who you know with a grow that totals less than 25 sq ft.
Nobody's getting out of prison.
Marijuana will still land people there.
I'm wondering who you know with a grow that totals less than 25 sq ft.
Nobody's getting out of prison.
Marijuana will still land people there.
I know a few who just have a few plants for themselves-- But most, have larger, 215 gardens--
But I also have many friends...most are older, that would love to have a few plants...but are afraid to grow them right now--
You're right...nobody is getting out of Prison...whether it passes or not--
Altho I really think that if it passes, that they will start letting some of those that only have cultivation, or possession without sales out early-- Remember...Cali is under a Federal Mandate to lower the Prison Population right now...these will be obvious, easy/safe ways to do that--
And finally...yes, ppl will still get busted, but not for a few pounds in their house, not for Concentrates, and not for growing a few plants--
Ok few more questions for you:
I heard on KPFA yesterday that 19, by allowing cities and counties to set their own laws, can not only outlaw recreational cannabis, but medical cannabis as well. Can you comment on this?
I would be worried that travelling with that ounce, you would often run into "dry" counties, cities etc. A smart Sheriff or PD would basically set up roadblocks at those county/city limits to run a dog around your car, wouldnt you think? It would certainly complicate travel if true.
More on the "stoned masses" comment: I am sure you're a fine stoned driver, as am I. What I meant to convey is that in an area of very VERY lax pot enforcement, it becomes painfully obvious that most of the masses are not able to function as well as we do or can. When the entire state has a significantly higher portion of new smokers at the wheel, I'm frankly a bit worried for my own safety.
Another question: Also on KPFA yesterday it was mentioned that 19 would throw out the rules against being impaired in the workplace, can you please comment?
Thanks man! You're a wealth of information.
Kpfa is wrong. The bill is actually quite easy to understand, and doesn't require a law degree. Cities and counties can regulate commercial cannabis. They cant touch the minimums for personal cultivation and possession set in the bill. Though, they can Increase the minimums.
The rules for impairment at work state specifically that the employers rights are left unaffected in maintaining his workplace. However, they will have to demonstrate actual impairment instead of just showing that the worker has month-old metabolites in their system.
So if that's true, why are cities and counties already outlawing and restricting medical cannabis? Surely San Diego will do their damndest to outlaw all MJ completely. Is it just because they haven't been successfully sued yet?
They can not outlaw your basic 215 Rights...you have the Right to grow, and consume your Meds--
Dispensaries are a whole other thing--
215, as will 19, if passed...have a set amount you can carry and grow-- That is State-wide...Counties cannot restrict that--
So, "Dry Counties" under 19, would mean that nobody can have a Commercial Grow, or Distribute....but you can still carry your Oz anywhere in the State...Legally--
The same with whatever you have in your own home--
*Edit*
Actually 215 has no set amount you can carry or grow...but it is still the same deal--
Sand diego may not be the Mecca of marijuana,, but we do have about 70+ dispensaries operating at the moment.....
Fresno bans outdoor cultivation:
http://calpotnews.com/cultivation/outdoor-cultivation/fresno-county-supes-ok-ban-on-outdoor-pot-grows/
Lakeport has banned cultivation of medical marijuana within the city limits.
Many other localities have proposed dubious anti-cultivation measures recently. Tehama County Supervisors are considering an ordinance that would declare it a public nuisance for anyone cultivate over12 mature or 24 immature plants on parcels of less than 20 acres. The Tehama proposal would ban any cultivation whatsoever within 1,000 ft of a school, which is almost certainly a violation of Prop. 215 patients’ fundamental right to medicine; and require every landlord to register any Prop 215 garden with the city, which violates the 5th amendment right against self-incrimination. It is scheduled to be voted on April 6.
The city of Corning in Tehama County adopted an ordinance that prohibits cultivation outdoors or in a residential structure. Gardens would have to be located in a secure detached structure in the rear yard only, removed ten feet from the property line and with a six foot solid fence and with a mechanical ventilation system and security system approved by a Building Official or the Police Dept.
Cal NORML believes that Corning’s ordinance poses an unconstitutionally burdensome limitation on patients’ right to grow their own medicine under Prop. 215. Cal NORML is interested in hearing from potential plaintiffs wishing to challenge Corning’s ordinance.
Red Bluff, another Tehama town, dropped an even more stringent proposal to ban medical marijuana cultivation entirely, after Cal NORML attorney Bill Panzer warned the city attorney that it was unconstitutional and would precipitate a lawsuit.
Shasta County Supervisors are considering a proposal that would require patients to file a zoning permit for all medical marijuana gardens. Indoor cultivation would be restricted to legally established residences; outdoor grows would be limited to 60 square feet on lots less than an acre, or 240 square feet elsewhere, and would have to be surrounded by six-foot fences.
Redding adopted an ordinance to restrict medical marijuana gardens to a maximum of 100 square feet of canopy or 10% of home or garden area – relatively liberal limits that would suffice for most, but not all, patients.
Two Mendocino County towns, Ukiah and Willits, have ordinances banning outside grows within city limits so as to mitigate the odor of marijuana. So far, no patients have challenged these laws. However, they have filed a lawsuit against a proposed Mendocino County ordinance that classifies any cultivation of 25 plants or more on a single parcel as a public nuisance.
Eureka has an ordinance on the table that would require patients to reside where they cultivate. The language is based on Arcata's ordinance and is intended to prevent homes being turned into "grow houses."
http://calpotnews.com/cultivation/outdoor-cultivation/fresno-county-supes-ok-ban-on-outdoor-pot-grows/
Lakeport has banned cultivation of medical marijuana within the city limits.
Many other localities have proposed dubious anti-cultivation measures recently. Tehama County Supervisors are considering an ordinance that would declare it a public nuisance for anyone cultivate over12 mature or 24 immature plants on parcels of less than 20 acres. The Tehama proposal would ban any cultivation whatsoever within 1,000 ft of a school, which is almost certainly a violation of Prop. 215 patients’ fundamental right to medicine; and require every landlord to register any Prop 215 garden with the city, which violates the 5th amendment right against self-incrimination. It is scheduled to be voted on April 6.
The city of Corning in Tehama County adopted an ordinance that prohibits cultivation outdoors or in a residential structure. Gardens would have to be located in a secure detached structure in the rear yard only, removed ten feet from the property line and with a six foot solid fence and with a mechanical ventilation system and security system approved by a Building Official or the Police Dept.
Cal NORML believes that Corning’s ordinance poses an unconstitutionally burdensome limitation on patients’ right to grow their own medicine under Prop. 215. Cal NORML is interested in hearing from potential plaintiffs wishing to challenge Corning’s ordinance.
Red Bluff, another Tehama town, dropped an even more stringent proposal to ban medical marijuana cultivation entirely, after Cal NORML attorney Bill Panzer warned the city attorney that it was unconstitutional and would precipitate a lawsuit.
Shasta County Supervisors are considering a proposal that would require patients to file a zoning permit for all medical marijuana gardens. Indoor cultivation would be restricted to legally established residences; outdoor grows would be limited to 60 square feet on lots less than an acre, or 240 square feet elsewhere, and would have to be surrounded by six-foot fences.
Redding adopted an ordinance to restrict medical marijuana gardens to a maximum of 100 square feet of canopy or 10% of home or garden area – relatively liberal limits that would suffice for most, but not all, patients.
Two Mendocino County towns, Ukiah and Willits, have ordinances banning outside grows within city limits so as to mitigate the odor of marijuana. So far, no patients have challenged these laws. However, they have filed a lawsuit against a proposed Mendocino County ordinance that classifies any cultivation of 25 plants or more on a single parcel as a public nuisance.
Eureka has an ordinance on the table that would require patients to reside where they cultivate. The language is based on Arcata's ordinance and is intended to prevent homes being turned into "grow houses."
They can pass what they like...and see if they can get away with it...but in the end, none of those will fly when they are challenged in Court--
It has already been determined that they cannot limit 215...and they are just wasting tax $$ in trying--
It has already been determined that they cannot limit 215...and they are just wasting tax $$ in trying--
WestCoast4Life
Member
This act will legalize adult use of relatively small(still an oz!) of cannabis anywhere within the state of California, I think 25 square feet is adequate to sustain all my dreams in terms of cannabis use. Although at heart I believe cannabis should be flat out completely legal with no restrictions what so ever and widely accepted, this is a CRUCIAL stepping stone to that goal. As said in that article if any of you guys actually read it and the bill, that post these incorrect assessments of this act in this thread, we can always draft a new act! What a wonderful state this is that we can have this amazing direct democracy! I want to do this legally this year, let's all enact this historic milestone in marijuana law reformation! and please, I cannot reiterate this enough, educate yourself! read this friggen act! read all the sensible arguments in favor of it in the link I posted, THEN, I would love to hear your opinion.
Peace.
Peace.
Looks like these guys answered most of the questions. 19 gives all Californians some Basic rights..posses an ounce, grow 25', have and make hash, possess a shit-load at home. Any attempt to restrict or take away any of the these basic rights would be a violation of law. As kmk stated
, these guys can try all they want but it will get thrown out out court. I'm sure we will see more of theses shenanigans and they will get challenged and so on...it will take a while for everyone to get with the program...but I don't think as long as 215 has taking. 19 is better defined and more cut and dry so to speak.
I also don't think we will see a big increase in stoned drivers. That is more of a FEAR thing to me. Mj is not a major factor in crashes...not in the least. Studies show that driving stoned is not an issue...in fact the Federal Transportation dudes don't even keep track of that statistic because it is so minute.
19 sucks because of the increased penalty for the 18-21 thing. It sucks because it limits personal grows but a company can buy a license to grow as much as they want. It sucks because I just might want to take more than an ounce with me on my week long fishing trip. But shit howdy...look at what 19 DOES give us. Just the fact of every adult being able to grow...that right there is reason enough to vote yes. But add in the hash, the ability for cities to allows shops and clubs, public possession, transportation...all gravy! All this and the fact that I get to keep my medical rights...how could someone not vote yes?
I don't like cops...don't like them in my rear view. When I see a LEO I get an uneasy feeling. That is because I smoke pot. Something he can mess with me for. I have been busted. I was in their system for pot crimes lol. It cost me a lot. If 19 had been law...I would of never of had to go through that and I wouldn't have a Marijuana Drug Conviction on my permanent record.
BTW...I was just in Kauai and I score at a certain local hangout. All these guys wanted to know about was this new Legalization Law in Cali. They were dumbfounded that it would allow everyone to grow and possess pretty much all you want at home.
All eyes are on us! Stoners everywhere are hoping this passes because they know it will spread once people realize legal regulated marijuana won't hurt but help society.
Some nice outdoor sativa, grow in the wettest place on earth. The more I smoked...I higher I got
Sunrise
The fact that cities and counties have been trying to stop progress in the MMJ scene should make you wonder what they'll do when they actually have expressed power over the recreational scene.
Purty pics vta!!! What'd that grass taste like?
Purty pics vta!!! What'd that grass taste like?
Damn you vta!!! DAMN YOU!!
I can't wait for Harvest this year...I am definitely taking a much needed Vacation with the Wife--
HAHA! It's so cheap to fly to Hawaii right now...$260 round trip! I think I might retire there...or mover there before that. It's the perfect lifestyle.
You can get a permit and just camp out at this beach for cheap...Tunnels
Sweet. Very sweet..I'm not good at smoke reports but it reminded me of some real good mexican bud from back in the day. Dense buds that when you break them up you have a pile that melts back onto its self...lol that's the best way I can describe it...almost melty like drysift or something. You can't compare it to what we got going on in Cali but it had a very high ceiling and great uplifting high. The phone pic doesn't due it the justice it deserves...it was the best out of about 10 times scoring in Hawaii.
