How to do scrog with 1000hps?

[JerryPakul]

Hey everyone, this might sound like silly question to some but iv got 1000hps kickin round and im debating between sog and scrog...

I know this depends heavly on the strain but if i were to scrog...would i have to use a octgonal reflector or what ?

Or is the scrog idea just bad all together...any suggestions or comments would be appreciated

Jerry

P.S sorry if this is the wrong forum

 

[JerryPakul]

Hey everyone....come on...theres got be someone who can give some advice on the situation....open to any ideas...
just trying to utilize my 1000w'er ....need all the help i can get...
Thanks,

Jerry

 

[burn586]

why dont you grow some trees with that?

 

[JerryPakul]

Hey Burn, oh my friend thats the plan just need a lil help im a virgin wit the 1000hps...

So by trees...u just mean let them go at it an train an what not..
or like SOG style?

This isnt my first grow iv had a few harvests wit my 400 just needed some upgrading...now i need more help

Anyways keep the ideas coming people....

Jerry

 

[Bozo]

4x4 tables work good my frame is 4.5x4.5 .I dont really scrog I just use the frame to expand the canopy. As it can become crowded quickly pruning is very important .First 2 weeks is the most important for creating the canopy you want .This method also helps hold them up in the e+f table but I still end up having to tie them up towards the end
I belive by trees he means 4-6 plants in 5 gallon containers grown huge .I have done this also and yeilds are as big if not bigger. Trees can yeild higher than small plants but I also found you spend abit more time vegging them so in the course of a year I can pull an extra whole crop off the 4x4 table (I"m sure I will get an arguement there about the time it takes but I also concider the limited space I have when stating my opion )
Another thing to concider is a 4x4 table will hold 36 plants and you need 36 more ready to go.Trees you could do with as few as 8 plants .

I would also concider the strain and growth patern when choosing method some strain wont thrive crammed into a table ie branchy stretchy = bad for table and short fat single cola dominant plants dont make very good trees
Anyway these are just my opions on it hope you come up with something that suits yer style and space
Happy HollidaZe

 

[Guest]

I wouldn't do a scrog exactly, but you could use a wide mesh to seperate the plants to allow light to penetrate to the lower branches better. 1000watts will already have good penetration to the lower parts of the plants even in normal bush style grows.

If you are stuck on the idea of a actual scrog. Build the screen or mesh and place like 4 plants under it. That should be able to fill a 4x4 area pretty easily. Remember to trim most of the growth under the screen, as you are focusing on the canopy only with scrogs.


**Added**

I just read over your original post again. I see you also mentioned a SOG grow. This would be your best bet for a 1000hps in my opinion. You could fit many plants into the 6x6 footprint of a 1000HPS. I am guessing you are still using a soil or soilless mix like promix or fox farms. Get a mother and cuttings established. I found the 2 gallon vinyl grow bags work great in SOGS as you can manipulate them a little to make the fit. Under a 1000watt you could easily fit many plants under it. Estimate about 14 to 20 grams per plant. When I grew a SOG I had a 2.5ft x 6ft area. Fit a 6 x 10 plants into the area.

If anyone is wondering how I fit 6 plants in a 2.5ft space then only fit 10 in a 6ft space is b/c the bags are rectangular.

 

[JerryPakul]

Hey guys, is all i can say thanks for the input guys i love the ideas keep them coming....

I could of described more of what i got also ...got a nice mummy of Blue Jack just chillin right now ...i also wanted to stay with my organic soil setup too....another thing to consider is i have a small bedroom to work with ...space is not that much of an issue, well i dont think any way

Bozo - Thanks for the tips man...i like the idea 4.5 table, i understand what u mean by creating the canopy but what do u mean by e+f table?
is that just he frame? Yea the tree method sounds nice and all but id rather not be in veg so long either...i agree with u there...anyways thanks for the ideas an time man have safe an happy christmas

Tokin - Hows it going man thanks for helping, i agree with u on the scrog now that i think about it...i also didnt know the exact foot print of the 1000w either thanks ...but isnt that relative to what reflector u use ...which is another issue i have to attend to decision wise.....
As for the SOG it sounds good but sound like an almost waste of the potential of the 1000w ...space istn a issue really either....i suppose i need to look more closelt into this strain....its jsut friggin hard to find info on it..

How many plants would u estimate i could fit under it?

anyways thats enough for now before i drive u mad....haha thanks alot once again man all the help is much appreciated

Thanks

Jerry

 

[JerryPakul]

Hey guys if i wanna change the thread name any way to do this?

 

[Bozo]

I meant a 4x4 ebb and flow table I do hydro but you can still be organic in hydro If I were gonna just use organic soil I would grow big plants in 5 gallon buckets
The frame is just a scrog frame with no webbing I tie them as they grow to spread them out
You can build your frame any size you want 5x5 may work better with your room ,just make sure its tall enough to do what you want it too and that is support and separate kinda like a traing bra . You are on the right tract all the thought you are putting into getting the most outa yer light will pay off Good Luck to Ya

 

[JerryPakul]

Hey Bonzo,

Yea man i can incorperate this for sure thanks for the good ideas an help...
how long do u usuasally veg for in this set-up?

thanks again

Jerry

 

[Pops]

Jerry, if you only have one 1000w light and are going to grow in soil, your best bet is sog or scrog, and you will need a reflector for that. The most simple solution is to do a sog(sea of green). If you get a cheap batwing reflector, you will have a 4 x 6 area,in which you could put 24 plants in 5 gal. nursery buckets. Veg them 3-5 weeks and trim the bottoms and train the main stem and 3-5 side branches to go up. Trim everything else off. This will yield about 1/2 to 1 oz. per plant. You will probably get around a pound of harvested bud.

You will also need a fan and probably some odor control, depending on variety. If you have more than one light, tree grows are the way to go, but you need to veg at least 8 weeks and get them up over 3 ft. before flowering. 1000w lights are good for penetrating dense foliage or for spreading out over a larger area with a reflector.

 

[JerryPakul]

Hey pops thanks alot....

I'm thinkin goin sog....scrog would be a waste of light iv determined....do u thikn just a batwing will good enough....i think i would somthing bigger to spread the light no?

thanks for the help man

Jerry

 

[Guest]

.

JP-

Nice to finally get to visit you. I see you are conteplating the very same things I was. And would be glad to help in way possiable.

You may want to look at both sog, and scrog. I mean, allow room in your design where you can play with both. I saw your last visit at my thread, and mentioned some of this there.

Look to get pots that fill the tray, and a light footprint to cover it. I see that this was mentioned by having a brighter light, much higher up. Good advice. Or you may think about getting multiple reflectors in your structure to give some more flexability. A light mover works here too, if the structure has some lenght to it, and would cut down costs of equipment. But would be limited from any perpetual growing.

You really need to see this as a companionship between the size of structure, size of tray, height of ceiling, and size of light bulbs. In other words. Build the structure for the size tray you want, that is covered by your light. Then fill the tray with 6 in. square pots. Build screens that fit over each tray. If you have two trays, and resivoirs; there is even more room for manipulation here.

Now, you don't have to buy all this equipment at once, either. So, in your design; allow for this manipulation. example; buy half the trays, and light at first. Or save on resivoirs and pumps, by hand watering.

It depends alot on the strain too, and if starting from seeds. I wanted to sog (had seeds), and by time they showed pre-flower 9 weks later, was forced to scrog them. So by having the flexability to do both, may be important. And it is nice trying different things. Sog awhile, then play with a scrog.

As far as the strain, some of these plants get pretty big. I started with a sativa. So, you might ask yourself, what type of high are you looking for.

I hope this was helpful, check the other thread for some more input. Or feel free to view my gallery. there are some good pics in there showing a sog / scrog set-up.

I am glad to have met you, and will watch your progress.


Peace, man

 

[JerryPakul]

Hey Chilly, nice to see u man thankns for stopin in..


Yea thats a good open way to look at it an i was coming to that decesion too....someone said before about 1000 HPS leaving a 6x6 footprint ...is this relavent to th shape of reflector...i was thinking so...What shape or sort of reflector would u recommend chilly...im looking to get the biggest footprint possible?

Hahha might sound crazy but yeah just wonderin

As for strains i got mummy of blue jack ...an germin some blueberry x nl...the blue jack grows small an stout...i imagine an heard the the bb x nl has more bud filled branches ...so i can play with both i suppose...iv came to the conclusion today that scrog mite be a waste of the 1000w's potential..

Thanks again chilly hope to see u around...merry christmas

Jerry

 

[Pops]

Jerry, don't be concerned with getting the biggest footprint possible. What you are concerned with is light intensity over your plants. You need at least 40 watts per sq.ft. to get good yield. With a 1000w light, that means that you have about 25 sq.ft. to play with. A reflector that gives you a 6 x 4 pattern or a parabolic that gives a 5 x 5 pattern will give you the watts that you need. If you have the money, a reflector with a gless plate in the bottom and ducts on each end to air cool the lamp would be best. If you can't afford that, a simple parabolic or batwing, with plenty of fans to control heat might be the best way to go.

 

[Guest]

JP-

I believe the answer to you first question; is no.

The foot print has to do with how high the light is above your plants. When you raise it, the light pattern is much larger. But when you raise the light, you lose your intensity very fast.

The first chart below, is for MHL buls; while the last is HPS.
See how fast intensity is lost. That is why it was mentioned to get a 1000 watt fixture, if it is higher above the plants, giving a larger foot print.

But smaller lights work too, but smaller foot print. So, this is why you need to see what you can afford in equipment, and then pick the size of structure, and type of grow to match up with your intesity.

Take a 4 ft x 8 ft area for example.

A 400 watt light at 12 inches puts out the light we want, but you would have to keep it at 12 in. from canopy. This is about a 3 ft. by 3 ft. area. So get 3x3 botanicare trays.

While a 600 watter has the same intensity as our 400 watter when at 18 inches away from the canopy. So, 4x4 botanicare trays are better. That is one reason a 4x8 grow area gives ya some flexability here. Reflectors are not that effiecent, its the light facing the plant that matters.

 

[JerryPakul]

Hey Pops,

Hmmm very helpful my friend....but yes money is tight at the time....
Is it possible to hook up a cool tube with the parabolic reflector?
I wouldnt see why not as long as u hooked it up properly...anymore ideas on this Pops?
thanks for the help though

Jerry

 

[JerryPakul]

Hey Chilly

Haha just missed u posted the exact same time..

But man thats a very useful chart...thanks alot...thats gonna help alot, the kinda info im looking for....
Keep up the good work on ur grow man im watching it looks like its gonna be quite

Thanks

Jerry Pakul

 

[pico]

 

[Guest]

Having used 1000's for some years...

the realistic footprint is way less than 6x6....

With a light mover I do about a 3.5 x 6....

The problem is that the outer plants will be shaded and eventually suck.....

To fight the shading problem a stadium setup helps....

A scrog would also fight that problem as well....

I have never done a scrog per se....


but if I did I wouldnt flower until the screen was full and grown thru the screen a ways.... The penetration of the 1000 can allow larger plants above the screen...

Or a screen of wheat rather than a carpet of buds....