How to "cook" soil when its winter?

[dank.frank]

Aridbud - I disliked your post - saying as much because when I do, I don't like to hide behind the anonymity of it...

What you are saying is NOT correct...not ultimately. If you are having pest issues, your soil isn't healthy in the first place. Pests attack, thrive and make home in weak environments, ie environments lacking their natural predators that prevent them from gaining a foothold.

I can understand not re-using a soil that is full of chem salts, etc...but otherwise, your inability to recycle an organic soil successfully is simply a lack of understanding on how to do so...not because it is the BEST mode of action.

BigShrimp - thank you for all you points made about the anaerobic smells, etc...that is 1000% correct.



dank.Frank

 

[Team Microbe]

I don't consider it a "super soil mix" in such a term - because I don't want to confuse what I do with being derived in any way from what subcool / TGA does...

It was however a fully amended organic soil in which all that is necessary is to water it...and let the plant do it's own thing.

The notion that it was a bottle fed soil never even crossed my mind to be honest...LOL...haven't bottle fed anything for many many years. I tend to forget that people even grow that way!!!



dank.Frank

Amended organic soil / super soil whichever you call it it's still the same thing lol.

I feel like you lose control with super soil though, it takes growers years to dial in soil recipes/ratios for their garden, and being each strain is different it's hard to control things if youre growing more than 1 strain. Why not introduce exactly what you get with amended organics in bottle-form and tweak each strain for it's optimal potential?

I know I couldn't feed my girls all the same recipe... some would burn and some would still be hungry for N. I feel like super soil is best for breeders, because when they breed new genetics in a certain ratio'd mixture, that new strain is adapted to that mix from the get-go. I had a long talk to my local hydro dude today actually on this topic, it was a good conversation.

But to each man his own... if it works for you then more power to you. I haven't wandered in that area yet bc I'm a control freak, and losses with super soil are costly compared to being able to flush with hand-fed techniques, ya know? You shouldn't be so set on your old ways! I know master growers that have 40 + years under their belts and they've recently changed things up from traditional methods they've been working with for over ten years and they're much better now than they ever were... and that's saying a lot. Open minds in gardening will get us further and farther than we ever would with a closed-minded "my way is the best" type attitude. Trust!

 

[Team Microbe]

Ammonia is a result of anaerobic decomposition. This is your nitrogen ammendments being released in the air. If you are smelling this you should turn your pile and keep an eye on the moisture level. Not too wet.

Aerobic composting (cooking-curing) should not smell foul like that, depending on your what kind of microbes you have in your mix it will smell different, but i get a nice piney-fungal smell followed by the actinomycete soil musk. Inoculation with local soil - ewc - or high quality compost will help provide microbe diversity - which will help insure proper decomposition.

Properly curing soil should be mostly producing CO2 - which is a good reason to put it in your grow room if possible. Your soil will benefit from the added heat and your plants from the added CO2.

I would try to keep the soil warm say 70-75f , since the colder it is the longer it is going to take to break down.

very informative, good looks bud! I'll make room in the corner for a couple garbage cans this week...

 

[dank.frank]

Just add water - organic soil - same mix for ALL these plants:

LA Affie x Chem D Bx2

(Skunk #1 x Hindu Kush) x C99

Chem Sister x Northern Lights

G13/Burmese x Blockhead

pre-98 Bubba Kush

....


dank.Frank

 

[dank.frank]

ECSD x Pre-98 Bubba

Ghost OG

Happy Brother x Biker Kush

Ken's Father

My point being - that if you KNOW what you are doing...then a single mixed soil works PERFECTLY fine...and letting the plants choose for themselves and naturally take from the soil what is needed vs being all juiced up and 'roided out on whatever whimsical ionic concoction you feel like injecting into the root zone...works BETTER if your goal is to sort seeds and actually pick the best performing phenotype.

PS - you are completely out of line to go on some rant about how I think my ways are best - I never made one statement to that tone of nature - only attempted to answer the questions you asked. I only posted these pics to make a point - and that point being - you OBVIOUSLY have no idea how organic soil or gardening works, or you wouldn't be making the comments you do.

What you DO understand, is following some manufactures label / guidelines and smoking whatever it is they tell you a plant "should" be - versus allowing the plant to dictate it's own phenotypical expression and smoking what a plant actually, truly IS.

But this will be my last post in this thread - you've obviously got it all figured out - and I'm just "too set in my way" and narrow minded to be of any use to you...although, all I did was answer your questions, factually, based on my own experience and apparently crippling usage of soil...

Either way - good luck - hope you get it figured out.

AND - should mention - this is re-used useless soil too...



dank.Frank

 

[AlterEgo860]

I can only say.. that as long as u aren't over feeding and not flushing .. recycling your soil is fine.. been using recycled soil for 2 runs now.. and the smells and tastes that come from these buds is ridiculous,.

 

[Team Microbe]

ECSD x Pre-98 Bubba

View Image


Ghost OG

View Image


Happy Brother x Biker Kush

View Image


Ken's Father

View Image



My point being - that if you KNOW what you are doing...then a single mixed soil works PERFECTLY fine...and letting the plants choose for themselves and naturally take from the soil what is needed vs being all juiced up and 'roided out on whatever whimsical ionic concoction you feel like injecting into the root zone...works BETTER if your goal is to sort seeds and actually pick the best performing phenotype.

PS - you are completely out of line to go on some rant about how I think my ways are best - I never made one statement to that tone of nature - only attempted to answer the questions you asked. I only posted these pics to make a point - and that point being - you OBVIOUSLY have no idea how organic soil or gardening works, or you wouldn't be making the comments you do.

What you DO understand, is following some manufactures label / guidelines and smoking whatever it is they tell you a plant "should" be - versus allowing the plant to dictate it's own phenotypical expression and smoking what a plant actually, truly IS.

But this will be my last post in this thread - you've obviously got it all figured out - and I'm just "too set in my way" and narrow minded to be of any use to you...although, all I did was answer your questions, factually, based on my own experience and apparently crippling usage of soil...

Either way - good luck - hope you get it figured out.

AND - should mention - this is re-used useless soil too...



dank.Frank

I'm going by what everyone tells me when we talk about organics man, you have less control bottom line. For example some of your girls fill in and some are left hungry in those pictures, then one was overfed you can tell by looking at the burnt leaves.

I'm not going to say it aint workin for ya, bc those are beautiful. But they could be better is all I'm saying. There can be more tweaking done, more teas being added and more potential being pulled from those girls without an add-water-only mix. Try it some day, youll thank me!

 

[Team Microbe]

Plus, you can't flush those flowers properly when you have amendments in there brotha.

 

[Eighths-n-Aces]

Plus, you can't flush those flowers properly when you have amendments in there brotha.

why would you worry about flushing a plant that never got fed anything that came out of a bottle?

there are to many people here who have been recycling soil for to many years for your argument to be taken seriously brotha.

 

[bigshrimp]

Drowning your root zone isnt going to give you better flowers... It might displace some nutrients in your medium but your not going to remove anything from your buds.

Just adding water for the last couple weeks will allow the plants to use what they have stored in leaves. This is good - but flushing (adding 3-5x the volume of the pot) water isn't going to do much but piss your plant off.

Save the flushing for when you have really fucked up your soil.

I guess its true that you have less control over what the plant feeds day to day. Thats ok in my book - the plant has taken over and is doing all that work for me. It knows what it wants better than me.

You can fuck up and add way to much of this or that amendment in organics but thats why alot of growers just err on the side of caution. You can always feed later on... bottles or teas or topdress.

The organic soil section here on icmag is the best on the net so i'd encourage you to go check it out rather that going by what you have heard from the hydro dude or whoever.

Very nice buds frank - they all look spot on to me.

 

[vapor]

Plus, you can't flush those flowers properly when you have amendments in there brotha.

You have a lot to learn, but dont we all lol. ok i grow with amendments for many years and it took 2 or 3 years of experimenting with all the different plants/soil mixes. i have nailed it down 2 mixes. I use them a bit differently depending on the size of the plant the length of flower time and the amount of light/type of feeder.
I time my plants out so i still get a great harvesto in terms of yields and it burn clean. A white ash is what we are looking for as soon as it is dry enough to smoke no having to wait for 3 months. If it burns black organic or not you are using too much food. I time my plants so the yellow out hard{still balancing the soil so buds do there thing}Just giving the plant enough food to make it through what it does and induce senescence hard{trimming becomes much easier when the plant uses its leaves and they yellow and drop off all by themselves}. After many years and many wayz this is the way i like my buds in the end. I love to smoke and i care what my patient gets as meds. I have seen/ smoked lots of organic and chemmy buds that burnt like shite, It is all over the commercial market. To each a zone but there are many ways to the same end...

 

[canna woop!]

Looking dank In here!

 

[dank.frank]

The plant you say is over fed (the skush x c99 -ie, I knew you would say such) was only a few days from chop or so and all the leaves were dying off...the others are yellowing naturally as they enter into senescence...

As far as "flushing" - eh you don't flush a soil...you end up flushing the plant, rather indirectly, to be correct. And your intention is to get the plant to use the nutrient reserves in the plant, rather than from the soil. If you are in an organic soil, all you have to do is let the medium dry out...ie stop watering, and the roots choke and can't feed and the plant is forced to use it's reserve, effectively getting the exact same results as people intend to achieve by needless flooding a medium, ie "flushing"...

Again, I don't try to get my plants to be anything they aren't. You CAN NOT grow the plant. The plant is only acting on it's genetic encoding, which only responds to environmental stimuli. The plant is really nothing more than a tool for which to evaluate the quality of your environment, ultimately. The more you try to grow the plant itself, the more you alter it from what it is naturally. I don't pump my flowers full of nutrients with the idea I'll get bigger flowers...maybe I would...but they'll taste like piss and lose all individual nuances that make them unique and end up tasting like AN says they should, or like Botanicare says they should, etc. I'd rather let the plant dictate it's needs and come out like the plant thinks it should...just like bigshrimp said...

If you are going to use a "super soil" - you should at least understand the fullness of trying to use it - or else you'll find yourself in a circle of self defeat and be disappointed in your organic experience...

And your assumption that this is the only way I have ever grown is entirely incorrect. This is the way I choose to grow...because it produces the best medicine. Could care less about yields. A flower that is TOO dense does not have the maximum resin concentration. I'm not growing rocks...I'm growing flowers.



dank.Frank

 

[dank.frank]

And really, don't take my posts as being an attack or being stuck up or any of the rest of that. I speak...well, frankly. I'm just attempting to share information with you in regards to what you are trying to accomplish and experience with a fully amended organic soil...

Good vibes...nothing but love here. If you have examples from your own garden of any of the plants or similar ones to show me your results with what you are saying works, I'll be more than glad to take a look...and hear you out...it just doesn't make sense to go too far down the rabbit hole with someone that doesn't have examples to support their projections...

Here is the full plant of that Skush x C99:

@ 6wk - much of the burning you see is from a vert bulb being too close...not from nutrients - the soil does NOT burn the plants. Should also note, the plant was in a 3 gallon bag, and then around wk 3 the bottom of the of bag was cut off and the plant was placed on top of a container of PREVIOUSLY USED soil in a 5 gallon bucket...roots and all still in place...so there was a bit of transplant shock that occurred disturbing the roots like that in mid flower and that is also visible in this pic...

and then @ 9wk

As you can see - there is NO ISSUE AT ALL - "flushing" - just isn't necessary.


The Pre-98, which I assume is the one you said could have fuller flowers:

G13/Burmese x Blockhead finished up, true SOG style, 4 per sq ft, flower from rooted clone:

Ken's Father finishing up, a few days before chop...

I am hoping a few full plant shots will give you a better idea of how the yields are and how a plant, when in control, naturally does all the things we tend to think we as the "grower" are responsible for...again, keeping in mind all these plants regardless container size or strain are grown in the exact same soil...veg and flower...no issues what so ever...only given water.



dank.Frank

 

[Team Microbe]

And really, don't take my posts as being an attack or being stuck up or any of the rest of that. I speak...well, frankly. I'm just attempting to share information with you in regards to what you are trying to accomplish and experience with a fully amended organic soil...

Good vibes...nothing but love here. If you have examples from your own garden of any of the plants or similar ones to show me your results with what you are saying works, I'll be more than glad to take a look...and hear you out...it just doesn't make sense to go too far down the rabbit hole with someone that doesn't have examples to support their projections...

Here is the full plant of that Skush x C99:

@ 6wk - much of the burning you see is from a vert bulb being too close...not from nutrients - the soil does NOT burn the plants. Should also note, the plant was in a 3 gallon bag, and then around wk 3 the bottom of the of bag was cut off and the plant was placed on top of a container of PREVIOUSLY USED soil in a 5 gallon bucket...roots and all still in place...so there was a bit of transplant shock that occurred disturbing the roots like that in mid flower and that is also visible in this pic...

View Image


and then @ 9wk

View Image


As you can see - there is NO ISSUE AT ALL - "flushing" - just isn't necessary.


The Pre-98, which I assume is the one you said could have fuller flowers:

View Image


G13/Burmese x Blockhead finished up, true SOG style, 4 per sq ft, flower from rooted clone:

View Image


Ken's Father finishing up, a few days before chop...

View Image



I am hoping a few full plant shots will give you a better idea of how the yields are and how a plant, when in control, naturally does all the things we tend to think we as the "grower" are responsible for...again, keeping in mind all these plants regardless container size or strain are grown in the exact same soil...veg and flower...no issues what so ever...only given water.



dank.Frank

Your posts are teaching me a lot, I appreciate it man. I shouldn't go by what I hear, but instead only what I've experienced. All of my friends use bottle nutes.. but some of the best growers I'll admit feed w only water.

Your plants look really good, I'll admit I was being defensive in that previous post. My bad.

I watched an hour video recently on Humboldt's full organic line and they make it sound like if that line is used properly, it'll deliver all the organic nutes/life in the soil that amendments would. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

That line is $350, I have a feeling I could cook up a batch of soil for cheaper though. Don't need a ton, as my flowering room only fits 10 seven gal pots.

 

[dank.frank]

man, I can put together 60 gallons of dirt for less than $150...

And honestly, I wasn't being snide earlier...I really do tend to forget that folks feed bottles in soil...I hear "soil" and I by default think amended organic - I'm pretty much outta the loop on the new product lines and such....won't lie. Head in the sand I suppose...if it isn't broke, ya know...

I know UncleFishSticks does some GREAT grows with the General Organics line...so, I mean, I know it is possible, but if you aren't smoking what you see, then it really is hard to discern the nuances in things. I primarily grow the way I do because of the intense flavors I've been able to achieve...I just can't give up that flavor...for anything. Having the increase in terpenes only builds that synergy with cannabinoids...and amplifies the medicine...

And truly, I'm glad we are able to turn the corner and get past the notion that anyone is trying to belittle or pick at each other - way to much to do in life than bicker and make snide remarks and blah, blah. Let's learn together man...it's what the site is for...

Link me to those nutes and I'll take a peak at them.

Good vibes...glad the thread is on track. I hate senseless tension.



dank.Frank

 

[Team Microbe]

All good brotha. No hard feelings, the only area I haven't dabbled in is organic soil. I'm using the last of my GO line as we speak actually, I like it a lot esp the veganic aspect of it. Ready to move on though, I don't have time to cook my soil this time, as my girls are already germinated and heading into early veg...

I was debating mixing up a mix until I remembered I needed to cook it lol. So I might go with the next best thing in my mind - Humboldt's organic line:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2s-N7B71BtU

^That's a video that explains it pretty well


http://www.humboldtnutrients.com/

^Their site

 

[Team Microbe]

And that's exactly what I want, I'm going for quality over quantity. If youre saying I can achieve better taste and smell with your method then I'll give it a shot myself, the only thing I can think of is buying TGA soil online because I believe you aren't required to cook it.

I don't like to post pics on icmag anymore (mainly bc I'm too paranoid to leave loose ends out there) or I'd share some nug shots with ya, nothing too special though cuz I'm def still learning. Thanks for the help man, much appreciated!

 

[dank.frank]

really, if you want a very simple organic mix to get you started, no cooking necessary...

1/2 bale pro mix bx
1 bag FFOF
1/2 bag wiggle worm
5 gal chunky perlite
1 cup bone
1 cup blood
1 cup dolomite
1 cup kelp

You'd be surprised what that does. You can take it much further than that (I've got 22 things or so in my soil mix), but...that is about as simple, quick and easy as it can be...assuming you can get to a hyrdo store and a lowes / home depot.



dank.Frank

 

[Team Microbe]

really, if you want a very simple organic mix to get you started, no cooking necessary...

1/2 bale pro mix bx
1 bag FFOF
1/2 bag wiggle worm
5 gal chunky perlite
1 cup bone
1 cup blood
1 cup dolomite
1 cup kelp

You'd be surprised what that does. You can take it much further than that (I've got 22 things or so in my soil mix), but...that is about as simple, quick and easy as it can be...assuming you can get to a hyrdo store and a lowes / home depot.



dank.Frank

I found a store that ships TGA soil so I'm going with that since it's already cooked. I'm gonna add 30% to the bottom then leave some room for topdressing after I fill the rest in with base soil. Any other advice before I dip my seedlings into 7 gals?