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Help please - the best ph level for misting?
- Thread starter bubbl3r
- Start date
Mistings ok but not an absolute necessary. Neutral ph [ close to 7 ].
Plants also feed best by the roots so Im not a fan of using anything but water when I mist.
Mist anytime but right before the lights turn off so you arent promoting a moldy environment.
Plants also feed best by the roots so Im not a fan of using anything but water when I mist.
Mist anytime but right before the lights turn off so you arent promoting a moldy environment.
bubbl3r
Member
Hi Verite. I was expecting a reply of ph 7 from someone, but isnt it true that most natural rainwater is a little acidic due to absorbing CO2. Also I've heard that misting with a solution containing CO2 is also good, as it slowly releases the gas.
Have you tried misting with a weak solution of seaweed. apparently it contains a lot of vitamions etc that the plant can absorb through the leaves. I've tried it myself but havent seen any remarkable difference in growth or appearance, except to say that it stains the leaves a little, the times I've mixed it a little too strong, which cant be a good thing.
Do you mist above or below the leaves in general?
Have you tried misting with a weak solution of seaweed. apparently it contains a lot of vitamions etc that the plant can absorb through the leaves. I've tried it myself but havent seen any remarkable difference in growth or appearance, except to say that it stains the leaves a little, the times I've mixed it a little too strong, which cant be a good thing.
Do you mist above or below the leaves in general?
Sauce
Active member
No not really. I have DWC though so I think that helps the low humidity a lot. I haven't had a successful cloning yet though where humidity matters the most. All clones I've used have been rooted already by a friend in small dixie cups. I have clones in rockwool atm that I just cut about a week ago. I think 2 of 3 rooted but not positive yet. From what I've read misting allows them to take in water through the leaves, not misting forces them search for water faster. However if wilting misting is sometimes necessary. My clones were kept in a small glad container with another one on top to act as a humidity dome. They've been out of the container for about 3 days now and no wilting, no misting either. All situations will vary though and some may require misting.
bubbl3r
Member
Sauce said:
I think the biggest factor for rooting clones is temperature at the root level. My mate has run temps in excess of 90F and got great results, but I'm unable to get that in my fixed temp propagator. Having said that I dont get much trouble at around 75F anyway.
I'm concerned that my 6-9" clones although looking healthy, arent growing fast enough, and wondering whether misting with the correct ph, and additives may help with the process.
sweetgreendream
Member
Bubbl3r -
two diff issues I believe.
Misting - Like others I only use h2o since I find that ANY nutes leave a residual on the lead that negatively impacts growth. I cant say I have proven documentation but I believ that misting helps growth and (uh oh here comes trouble) I even mist late into flowering with no issues.
As for the stalling of clones mroe info is needed but I always find that clones and seedligns stall at soem point to focus on the root system
two diff issues I believe.
Misting - Like others I only use h2o since I find that ANY nutes leave a residual on the lead that negatively impacts growth. I cant say I have proven documentation but I believ that misting helps growth and (uh oh here comes trouble) I even mist late into flowering with no issues.
As for the stalling of clones mroe info is needed but I always find that clones and seedligns stall at soem point to focus on the root system
i have misted them with teas... i like a ph of 6.5
tap water has worked well for me but i dont own an RO and yes i always let my water sit or bubble to remove chlorine.
i have not ever noticed any issues with risiduals on leaves.
i imagine if i did i would just wash the leaves with plain water
oh tea i prefer is wormcasting, mycorrhizal spores and simple sugar.
what you can do is run a little test with a range of PHs between 5.5-7 and see what works best for you setup.
if your plants look healthy i wouldnt be too concerned about speeding things up. the more things you begin to add into the growing process will most likely cost you greater effort rather then your eventual reaping of better results.
plus if something is going wrong things are just more complicated overall.
anyway nothing like a good ol fashion experiment.
peace
tap water has worked well for me but i dont own an RO and yes i always let my water sit or bubble to remove chlorine.
i have not ever noticed any issues with risiduals on leaves.
i imagine if i did i would just wash the leaves with plain water
oh tea i prefer is wormcasting, mycorrhizal spores and simple sugar.
what you can do is run a little test with a range of PHs between 5.5-7 and see what works best for you setup.
if your plants look healthy i wouldnt be too concerned about speeding things up. the more things you begin to add into the growing process will most likely cost you greater effort rather then your eventual reaping of better results.
plus if something is going wrong things are just more complicated overall.
anyway nothing like a good ol fashion experiment.
peace
bubbl3r
Member
king j....I have heard of this tea solution only for root drench, and didnt realise it was benefical for misting. I'm interested to know if your recipe was from a post or info you aquired or whether you devised it yourself.
The reason why I'm asking about the ph issue is that I'm sure theres a perfect range that is best in vegging, that helps the plant with its transpiration and chemical processes that take part in the leaves. I've read that if the humidity around the leaves is not sufficient that the plant transfers an amount of water from the roots to the leaves to conpensate, which can lead to other over toxification issues and hence slow growth.
Although the ph of the water and feed combination available at root level is known and controllable, does anyone really know what the ph of the water content is in the leaves?
I suspect that different elements are contained in different quanities and ratios to other areas of the plant.
Why should ph and ph range be so critical at root level, and not above ground at branch and leaf?
In conclusion I suspect the best way to find out maybe simply to take a number of healthy leaves from a donor plant and do a test for ph concentration.
Whatever this reading is, then it would seem natural to use that as the basis for the the plants misting ph level.
Having said that, if the ph concentration of solution contained in healthy leaves is at a certain level, what effect would humidity and misting of just plain water have at the same ph level, in simply "diluting" the content within the leaves, and would that be a good thing?
I know high humdity in vegging is associated with good transpiration, but I've found from misting in the past, that it has turned leaves pale and wonder whether this is due to incorrect ph or the composition of the solution used.
The next natural question is to ask what effect should available carbon dioxide be allowed to have an effect on the ph, of the humidity solution and misting process.
The reason why I'm asking about the ph issue is that I'm sure theres a perfect range that is best in vegging, that helps the plant with its transpiration and chemical processes that take part in the leaves. I've read that if the humidity around the leaves is not sufficient that the plant transfers an amount of water from the roots to the leaves to conpensate, which can lead to other over toxification issues and hence slow growth.
Although the ph of the water and feed combination available at root level is known and controllable, does anyone really know what the ph of the water content is in the leaves?
I suspect that different elements are contained in different quanities and ratios to other areas of the plant.
Why should ph and ph range be so critical at root level, and not above ground at branch and leaf?
In conclusion I suspect the best way to find out maybe simply to take a number of healthy leaves from a donor plant and do a test for ph concentration.
Whatever this reading is, then it would seem natural to use that as the basis for the the plants misting ph level.
Having said that, if the ph concentration of solution contained in healthy leaves is at a certain level, what effect would humidity and misting of just plain water have at the same ph level, in simply "diluting" the content within the leaves, and would that be a good thing?
I know high humdity in vegging is associated with good transpiration, but I've found from misting in the past, that it has turned leaves pale and wonder whether this is due to incorrect ph or the composition of the solution used.
The next natural question is to ask what effect should available carbon dioxide be allowed to have an effect on the ph, of the humidity solution and misting process.
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bubbl3r
Member
THE CANNIBAL EFFECT !!
It just occured to me that possibly the best humdity and misting "feed" available, maybe to take some healthy leaves from a donor plant of the same age, grind them up and add a solution or water infused with carbon dioxide at the correct ph level.
"Herbal tea"
Does that make any sense?
It just occured to me that possibly the best humdity and misting "feed" available, maybe to take some healthy leaves from a donor plant of the same age, grind them up and add a solution or water infused with carbon dioxide at the correct ph level.
"Herbal tea"
Does that make any sense?
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Imo youre wasting your knowledge boner on misting when theres a whole other realm below the soil you should be concentrating on before you go limp. Focus on the common methods to grow and go to town practicing. You can always do an in depth book on the perfect misting storm later.
But I am curious where you would dream up the idea of yoinking healthy pot leaves to grind up for misting? Is that like severing your digits for some killer finger sandwiches?
But I am curious where you would dream up the idea of yoinking healthy pot leaves to grind up for misting? Is that like severing your digits for some killer finger sandwiches?
bubbl3r
Member
LOL Verite, try not to lose the plot of my request for help, as I'm only looking for postive responses.
I'm not interested in trading insults or getting too crazy about anything, so I will answer your question in good faith.
You asked...."But I am curious where you would dream up the idea of yoinking healthy pot leaves to grind up for misting? Is that like severing your digits for some killer finger sandwiches? "
Well the answer is simple really. I'm looking to improve on potentcy and yeild through active misting aka "foliar feeding".
Isn't it reasonable to assume that a plant can absorb certain elements and substances through its leaves in an osmosis process, and the idea of infusing the leaves with "more of the same" simply sounds logical to me.
I believe the leaves are best described as the engines or "powerplants", excuse the pun, and that the ability the plant has to produce flowers, resin and the quality of high in the set time period, must be directly proportion to the amout of energy it can produce at that given time.
Grinding up and using heathly leaves from a donor seems the natural additive "" IF " the plant can use it presented that way.
I can only grow out a few plants at a time, but have plenty of spare clones I can use for feeding.
If you think about it, the idea of the "Cannibal Effect" shouldnt be too strange to you either. After all, arent most of the plants grown today both indoors and out side in nature, fed off the dead decomposing remains of there prevoius anchestors.
Bubbl3r
I'm not interested in trading insults or getting too crazy about anything, so I will answer your question in good faith.
You asked...."But I am curious where you would dream up the idea of yoinking healthy pot leaves to grind up for misting? Is that like severing your digits for some killer finger sandwiches? "
Well the answer is simple really. I'm looking to improve on potentcy and yeild through active misting aka "foliar feeding".
Isn't it reasonable to assume that a plant can absorb certain elements and substances through its leaves in an osmosis process, and the idea of infusing the leaves with "more of the same" simply sounds logical to me.
I believe the leaves are best described as the engines or "powerplants", excuse the pun, and that the ability the plant has to produce flowers, resin and the quality of high in the set time period, must be directly proportion to the amout of energy it can produce at that given time.
Grinding up and using heathly leaves from a donor seems the natural additive "" IF " the plant can use it presented that way.
I can only grow out a few plants at a time, but have plenty of spare clones I can use for feeding.
If you think about it, the idea of the "Cannibal Effect" shouldnt be too strange to you either. After all, arent most of the plants grown today both indoors and out side in nature, fed off the dead decomposing remains of there prevoius anchestors.
Bubbl3r
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Tokin White Guy
Member
Sorry to deny your request, but I believe you just very well may have smoked yourself retarded
and, no I don't think it'd do shit, or even be possible as the leaf particles would almost immediately clog your sprayer
and, no I don't think it'd do shit, or even be possible as the leaf particles would almost immediately clog your sprayer
bubbl3r
Member
Hey TWG, you don't think you'd do shit?
That's an entirely new subject, but while were on the matter....There are mainly people that feed their plants bat or worm shit. Indeed here in the U.K. there's a big fuss about people going back to the "old ways" of eating organic food again, as it's "more healthy".
I mean, would you feed your plant's human shit, or say dog shit?...No, then what's so special about horse's shit anyway?
Bubbl3r
That's an entirely new subject, but while were on the matter....There are mainly people that feed their plants bat or worm shit. Indeed here in the U.K. there's a big fuss about people going back to the "old ways" of eating organic food again, as it's "more healthy".
I mean, would you feed your plant's human shit, or say dog shit?...No, then what's so special about horse's shit anyway?
Bubbl3r
sweetgreendream
Member
bubbl3r said:
I use tap water and usually never wait for the chlorine to dissipate. I have very good tap water though - under 125PPM (@1.0 conversion) - so this may be why I see no issues.
Off to check on my lady. peace
ahh fan leaves solarpanels/sugarfactory
in veg I spray a light nitrogen feed [organic only] your choice lots of goodies on the market. I mist an hour before lights on. then again during mid of light cycle this time with filtered water only. u want to avoid a buildup of excess nutes on leaves and in your soil from run off- if your a soil person.
i saturate the entire canopy. as for ph dont know i do it by feel/instinct I guess half strength would best describe it.
and during bloom filtered water [consideration is given to good air exchange/ circulation] only.
myself Ive found an increase in growth rate and yeild. we say this because we were curious and did a med size run of WR and half the garden was root watered only, the other half foliar and root fed.. holy shit what a diffrence a good foliar/root fed grow can produce.
the other advantage seems to be the elimination of mite problems.
is it true mites dont like moisture epsecialy cool moisture? I know first hand they love a dry hot garden lol.
if so another good reason to mist regular
in veg I spray a light nitrogen feed [organic only] your choice lots of goodies on the market. I mist an hour before lights on. then again during mid of light cycle this time with filtered water only. u want to avoid a buildup of excess nutes on leaves and in your soil from run off- if your a soil person.
i saturate the entire canopy. as for ph dont know i do it by feel/instinct I guess half strength would best describe it.
and during bloom filtered water [consideration is given to good air exchange/ circulation] only.
myself Ive found an increase in growth rate and yeild. we say this because we were curious and did a med size run of WR and half the garden was root watered only, the other half foliar and root fed.. holy shit what a diffrence a good foliar/root fed grow can produce.
the other advantage seems to be the elimination of mite problems.
is it true mites dont like moisture epsecialy cool moisture? I know first hand they love a dry hot garden lol.
if so another good reason to mist regular
about the shit or the leaves for that matter
i guess you can figure the nutrient components of different plants and animals are different not only based on what they eat but how they break the food down.
human and dog carry a lot of pathogens as well but this is almost a fact about animal waste. these all can be used as nutes but must be carefully composted and processed so as to avoided very harmful side effects. i believe there is a whole book about composting human waste if you are really that curious. you can compost meat for that matter if you are gonna setup such a great compost.
i prefer wormcastings for many many reasons and enjoy the process of making my own as what i feed them changes what nutes are in the poo that will be harvested so i can tailor things as i please or the plants please.
also about using leaves... a common tea component. i have never used ganja leaves but it is common practice to use something like comfrey or alfalfa. these teas are a lot funkier to use and make requiring more touch and smell to know when you have them right in my experience.
if you are gonna make teas you should get to know your organics.... it seems a lot of your questioning is very speculative. i think you should narrow down what you are trying to provide for the plant beyond what it takes to achieve optimal growth which seems to be part of your questioning.
i will also add that you asked i provide links to back up why i use what i use and i could provide anything from posts to books to educational websites all talking about what processes are involved and what you are looking to provide for the plant... but the end all nothing is gonna say do this and your plants will be perfect and you are gonna have to be the one to say i do that because my plants like it... sure you can back it up with research and whatnot but all bullshit walks out the door when you end up lookin at crappy results.
i understand we began at misting ph which i believe the issue is rather cleared up that optimal could be a range based on environment and solution mixture.
if you are now questioning the proper mixture i believe its time to crack the books on organic teas before you just throw shit in a bottle and call it a tea.
peace
i guess you can figure the nutrient components of different plants and animals are different not only based on what they eat but how they break the food down.
human and dog carry a lot of pathogens as well but this is almost a fact about animal waste. these all can be used as nutes but must be carefully composted and processed so as to avoided very harmful side effects. i believe there is a whole book about composting human waste if you are really that curious. you can compost meat for that matter if you are gonna setup such a great compost.
i prefer wormcastings for many many reasons and enjoy the process of making my own as what i feed them changes what nutes are in the poo that will be harvested so i can tailor things as i please or the plants please.
also about using leaves... a common tea component. i have never used ganja leaves but it is common practice to use something like comfrey or alfalfa. these teas are a lot funkier to use and make requiring more touch and smell to know when you have them right in my experience.
if you are gonna make teas you should get to know your organics.... it seems a lot of your questioning is very speculative. i think you should narrow down what you are trying to provide for the plant beyond what it takes to achieve optimal growth which seems to be part of your questioning.
i will also add that you asked i provide links to back up why i use what i use and i could provide anything from posts to books to educational websites all talking about what processes are involved and what you are looking to provide for the plant... but the end all nothing is gonna say do this and your plants will be perfect and you are gonna have to be the one to say i do that because my plants like it... sure you can back it up with research and whatnot but all bullshit walks out the door when you end up lookin at crappy results.
i understand we began at misting ph which i believe the issue is rather cleared up that optimal could be a range based on environment and solution mixture.
if you are now questioning the proper mixture i believe its time to crack the books on organic teas before you just throw shit in a bottle and call it a tea.
peace
bubbl3r
Member
Hi Fuzzbang, thank you for your input!
you wrote........."myself Ive found an increase in growth rate and yeild. we say this because we were curious and did a med size run of WR and half the garden was root watered only, the other half foliar and root fed.. holy shit what a diffrence a good foliar/root fed grow can produce"
You've also suggested increased nitrogen levels, and a good timing regime. I wonder if you've thought about automating that by misting with an ultrasonic fogger and a fan setup on a timer etc?
This is just as I suspected, that good selection and fine tuning of a misting/foliar feed could make some vast improvement in growth, yeild and even potentcy.. I believe to some degree, that it may have been overlooked as a very important aspect and opportunity.
The addition of carbon dioxide in soluble form...i.e carbonic acid (simply bubbled through water) at the correct ph could also be vital, but for the quantities required per square inch of surface area, a high ph starting point before bubbling it through may be required as the solution is acidic.
Going back to using healthy leaves, maybe another way of boosting at the right ratio's required, and to some degree taking out the guess work. I'm sure there is a process other than making a tea, that could lead to making the composition perfect for absorbtion.
I look forward to hearing about any other of your findings and would be interested to know what your misting ph level is, and whether you would experiment and consider raising it.
There's also a Ying Yang element to all this way of thinking too. As the plant absorbs different elements more effeciently at different ph levels, then it maybe possible to adjust the compostion and ph at root level to push and promote in one direction, and the foliar feed in another.
Bubbl3r
you wrote........."myself Ive found an increase in growth rate and yeild. we say this because we were curious and did a med size run of WR and half the garden was root watered only, the other half foliar and root fed.. holy shit what a diffrence a good foliar/root fed grow can produce"
You've also suggested increased nitrogen levels, and a good timing regime. I wonder if you've thought about automating that by misting with an ultrasonic fogger and a fan setup on a timer etc?
This is just as I suspected, that good selection and fine tuning of a misting/foliar feed could make some vast improvement in growth, yeild and even potentcy.. I believe to some degree, that it may have been overlooked as a very important aspect and opportunity.
The addition of carbon dioxide in soluble form...i.e carbonic acid (simply bubbled through water) at the correct ph could also be vital, but for the quantities required per square inch of surface area, a high ph starting point before bubbling it through may be required as the solution is acidic.
Going back to using healthy leaves, maybe another way of boosting at the right ratio's required, and to some degree taking out the guess work. I'm sure there is a process other than making a tea, that could lead to making the composition perfect for absorbtion.
I look forward to hearing about any other of your findings and would be interested to know what your misting ph level is, and whether you would experiment and consider raising it.
There's also a Ying Yang element to all this way of thinking too. As the plant absorbs different elements more effeciently at different ph levels, then it maybe possible to adjust the compostion and ph at root level to push and promote in one direction, and the foliar feed in another.
Bubbl3r
