Help me diagnose Cannalope problem.

[romuros]

Hi
Tried to diagnose what is wrong with my plants but couldn't find similar problems.
Plants are 10 days in veg.
Strain Cannalope.
Medium coco with perlite.
The problems first started on top of the plant.
PH 5.8-6.0
EC 2.3-2.6 on Athena fertilizer plan.
Lumatek 600w leds on 50% power.
Hand watered when medium dried to 40% then watered to 60% saturation.
In vitro clones from realible suplier.
PPFD 350- 400 lighs 4ft above canopy.
No pest found.
Temperature 26c humidity 65%.

 

[Creeperpark]

I can barely see the problem. Can you take a shot of the plants at distance for a better photo?

 

[chronosync]

looks like variegation to me

 

[PadawanWarrior]

What kind of coco and water are you using? It's properly buffered right? Also that coco looks pretty dry. It wouldn't hurt to flush it either. That's the first thing I'd do if I see issues with coco and salts.

 

[I Care]

Flush is best approached full strength where you get about half the water through the bottom of the pot. Check that water and you may see your EC has come up to 3.0 or maybe even more.

Discard that then run another batch of clean fert water through it.

Working with large containers, you can capture that initial run off, cut in half with water then add back to your usual EC. You don’t need to do this cause it’s not going to be many gal/L of water you need for that plant

Never apply water less than your normal as a flush. You are very likely to create a deficiency if you do it that way as a beginner.



I have a mildly related thread. It’s not complete guide but highlights the procedure. Just ignore the PPMs.. I didn’t know I was kinda fuccin it up, the plant did tho.

How I Have Been Buffering Root Zone Nutrient Content with Water

I’ve been meaning to take the time to do this and this last one was a back breaker I almost left it alone in the middle of it. One should check pH through this process. Im leaving out what nutrients I use. I started with a blend of fertilized peat and coco soils with added peat and perlite...

www.icmag.com

 

[Lester Beans]

The plant is 10 days in veg doesn't seem right. Those plants are older than 10 days. Even so with an EC of 2.6 you are burning them. That EC is high for mature plants in flower.

 

[Guy Brush]

The plant is 10 days in veg doesn't seem right. Those plants are older than 10 days. Even so with an EC of 2.6 you are burning them. That EC is high for mature plants in flower.

Right. I don't even get to 2.6 EC in full flower under 600W HPS. In this young stage I'll use probably around 1.2 max. They're even happy with 0.8.

 

[Ca++]

Oh man. You can't bring pictures like that into my house. I'm going to have to disinfect everything. Wtf is it. Have you checked for mites? You could need a microscope, but a good magnifier can help. Many are under 0.1mm so you won't see much more than dirt, unless it's moving dirt.

 

[Treetroit City]

looks like variegation to me

I’ll second this. Healthy plants but genetically a little off.

 

[I Care]

Oh man. You can't bring pictures like that into my house. I'm going to have to disinfect everything. Wtf is it. Have you checked for mites? You could need a microscope, but a good magnifier can help. Many are under 0.1mm so you won't see much more than dirt, unless it's moving dirt.

Ca may be into something here, it may be good to put it by the window or under another fixture while you investigate the issue.

Right. I don't even get to 2.6 EC in full flower under 600W HPS. In this young stage I'll use probably around 1.2 max. They're even happy with 0.8.

I was thinking you maybe want more like 1-1.5 espescially if you’re not with a constant flood. I’ve stopped using 1000ppm or more cause if you let them dry theyll def be burned up.


In a perfect world where you have nothing but time to and a lot of space and origination equipment to make sure your constantly at full saturation, thats maybe where you’ll find that High EC/ppm feeding to work well. But, when you are growing many and it’s on drip trays where u can’t run off to waste or recirculating system, it’s just way too much to keep up with. Consistency is key; Wether it’s 0.8ec pr 2.8ec,


If that plant seems to have an ongoing issue regardless of irrigation management, use it for a window/patio grow somewhere away from the rest of them. Even maybe worth giving to a friend for complete preventative.

 

[TanzanianMagic]

Hi
Tried to diagnose what is wrong with my plants but couldn't find similar problems.
Plants are 10 days in veg.
Strain Cannalope.
Medium coco with perlite.
The problems first started on top of the plant.
PH 5.8-6.0
EC 2.3-2.6 on Athena fertilizer plan.
Lumatek 600w leds on 50% power.
Hand watered when medium dried to 40% then watered to 60% saturation.
In vitro clones from realible suplier.
PPFD 350- 400 lighs 4ft above canopy.
No pest found.
Temperature 26c humidity 65%.

1. EC 2.3-2.6 on Athena fertilizer plan.

Forget the plan. In veg, 1.0 EC total is usually enough.

2. Hand watered when medium dried to 40% then watered to 60% saturation.

Always water to 100% saturation, then allow the top of the medium to be dry in the morning for watering to 100% satuation again. Especially when you've also added extra drainage material to the coco coir.

This gets enough water and nutrients to the plant, while also allowing air back into the medium while it dries.

Also, by adding perlite for drainage, you're reducing root contact with the medium. The medium also dries faster with perlite.

Next time you're growing, you should try:

1. Use coco coir only.
2. Water to full saturation, and wait for the top of the soil to be dry in the moring.
3. Reduce nutrient concentration, because it increases as the soil dries.
4. Keep the pH at 6.0, forget about the 5.8.

So basically - water more but less frequently, and use much less nutrients.

 

[PadawanWarrior]

1. EC 2.3-2.6 on Athena fertilizer plan.

Forget the plan. In veg, 1.0 EC total is usually enough.

2. Hand watered when medium dried to 40% then watered to 60% saturation.

Always water to 100% saturation, then allow the top of the medium to be dry in the morning for watering to 100% satuation again. Especially when you've also added extra drainage material to the coco coir.

This gets enough water and nutrients to the plant, while also allowing air back into the medium while it dries.

Also, by adding perlite for drainage, you're reducing root contact with the medium. The medium also dries faster with perlite.

Next time you're growing, you should try:

1. Use coco coir only.
2. Water to full saturation, and wait for the top of the soil to be dry in the moring.
3. Reduce nutrient concentration, because it increases as the soil dries.
4. Keep the pH at 6.0, forget about the 5.8.

So basically - water more but less frequently, and use much less nutrients.

Have you used Athena? I haven't myself, but I did a quick search and 2.5 doesn't sound as hot as you would think for their line I guess. I agree with coco only with 6.0 pH though.

 

[TanzanianMagic]

Have you used Athena? I haven't myself, but I did a quick search and 2.5 doesn't sound as hot as you would think for their line I guess. I agree with coco only with 6.0 pH though.

1. I haven't used the Athena line myself.
2. 2.0 seems way too high for veg, let alone the start of vegging.

When the plants veg, they need to develop their root system. They also need development more than growth. An NPK of 5-5-5 or similar is all that's needed.

Of the foliage, stem and roots, the roots grow the most slowly, because the have to burrow through the soil, stems the second most slowly, while foliage just grows in the air. That's why extra nitrogen at this stage makes the foliage grow too quickly for the stem to keep upright or the roots to supply with food and water.

The main source of feeding is the expansion of the root system at this stage, and that's most encouraged by having a reasonably low nutrient concentration.

That way, when nutrient deficiencies start showing up, all you need to do is increase the concentration. You know you're not locking out nutrients because of a high concentration, too much calmag, etc.

Also, if you let the soil dry, it concentrates the nutrients more. So 2.0 may not seem like much, however if the soil dries 50%, that 2.0 become 4.0. So if you start with 1.0 and let it dry, it becomes 2.0.

 

[PadawanWarrior]

1. I haven't used the Athena line myself.
2. 2.0 seems way too high for veg, let alone the start of vegging.

When the plants veg, they need to develop their root system. They also need development more than growth. An NPK of 5-5-5 or similar is all that's needed.

Of the foliage, stem and roots, the roots grow the most slowly, because the have to burrow through the soil, stems the second most slowly, while foliage just grows in the air. That's why extra nitrogen at this stage makes the foliage grow too quickly for the stem to keep upright or the roots to supply with food and water.

The main source of feeding is the expansion of the root system at this stage, and that's most encouraged by having a reasonably low nutrient concentration.

That way, when nutrient deficiencies start showing up, all you need to do is increase the concentration. You know you're not locking out nutrients because of a high concentration, too much calmag, etc.

Also, if you let the soil dry, it concentrates the nutrients more. So 2.0 may not seem like much, however if the soil dries 50%, that 2.0 become 4.0. So if you start with 1.0 and let it dry, it becomes 2.0.

Plants need to develop a root system to grow? Interesting. Who would've thunk.

 

[I Care]

this thing do all that damage? Maybe someone else here knows if that is potential leaf eater. Its unusual your others look good.

If that’s a load of new plantings of course it’s possible that one plant will suffered from salt damage. It could just be the one that has the most salt damage. Transpiring on the edge there more than others, or in front of a fan, or near heat source, or near cooling duct. Or if that one dried out whatever reason.


Dry plant definitely be inviting for leaf eaters as the plant loses its vigor.

 

[Lester Beans]

The plant is most likely burned to a crisp by now.

 

[TanzanianMagic]

Plants need to develop a root system to grow? Interesting. Who would've thunk.

Well...

Many people water too often, use too high of a nutrient concentration, or give the plant too much nitrogen. It also needs good soil contact with light, fluffy soil that is easy to penetrate.

In all cases, either the root system doesn't develop or is insufficient to take care of the new growth.

So clearly, metaphorically speaking, they don't know. They didn't 'already know that'.

 

[TanzanianMagic]

Just to re-state.

- This is nitrogen lockout/deficiency.
- In vegging, nitrogen lockout nearly always happens because the soil is dry.
- So it's an underwatering issue.

 

[Ca++]

Too much N causes dark green growth, and to little drops bottom leaves, as it's very mobile. I don't see either. There is a certain symmetry though, and light veins, that may relate to P and dry conditions. Thinning at the base of the leaves is interesting. I forget what it means, but I might start there, if I were not so battered right now

 

[TanzanianMagic]

Too much N causes dark green growth, and to little drops bottom leaves, as it's very mobile. I don't see either. There is a certain symmetry though, and light veins, that may relate to P and dry conditions. Thinning at the base of the leaves is interesting. I forget what it means, but I might start there, if I were not so battered right now

What you're seeing is the beginning of chlorosis, the yellowing of the leaves characteristic of nitrogen deficiency, and the clawing down of the fan leaves, another occasional characteristic.