Guy at my hydro store says digi ballast with 600 performs equally to 1K'er.

[razerfish]

I finally called him on it, asking how a 600 with a digital ballast could perform equally to a 1K with regular magnetic ballast. He swears by them. He said he's had feedback from growers that have reported no loss in yield using the 600 digi's vs. 1K's. I'm very skeptical, though.

I told him that I've read there's only something like a 7% increase in light output (I forget the amount that has been reported) and that a lot of people using them says the power savings are minimal. He still swears by them. Says he's had multiple growers say they're giving them the same yields as their 1K's.

The reason I'm interested is because of the power consumption savings. I have a portable air con in my room now, plus CO'2. I can't run any more lights in there now without tripping the circuit. A 600 would allow me to throw a 400 watter in the closet as well.

Anyone compared their yields with digi ballasts vs. magnetic ones? Anyone tried a 600 over a 1K yet? Would like some real world opinions.

 

[MMZRetro85]

i'v done 600 grows and 1k grows, yield wise i did deff notice a loss in weight, plus i didnt get the solidness that i got using the 1k lights

 

[silvertrain]

yea u definately have increase in yeild and bud mass with the 1000..well atleast in my opinion.

 

[Guest]

They have 1kw digitals now, you just have to look around I saw them not to unreasonable I think.

 

[New Holland]

One thing I'd like to point out, that in my research I learnt that alot of 600's now are giving you 90,000 lumens compared to 120,000 lumens for the 1k's. Now that sounds pretty impessive thinking that the 600's which are nearly half the watts, perform nearly as good............

That is until yo look at the PAR watt ratings. Lumens don't mean jack shit to plants, PAR watts is what they want. And the PAR watts for the 1K's are nearlly double the 600's.

 

[Guest]

razer do you have a good co2 setup?If you do I'd get rid of the portable,are you exhausting into the attic?Well thats where all your co2 isgoing too believe me I tested till I was blue in the face.I had a dual hose unit with the intake through a wall to another room too,still my co2 ended up in the attic.You may want to switch to a window unit,they dont affect co2 enrichm,ent like a portable doesEDIT O yea the guy at the hydro store doesnt know what he's talking about if he's comparing anything to flowering with a 1 K hortilux

 

[Mr. Nevermind]

People like 600's over 1000s for a few reasons.

1. 600's dont put out as much heat as 1000's so you can put them closer to the light and not burn them and get more lumens on your girls

2. They dont use as much power as the 1000's. But are still quite effective.

3. You can cover morground with five 600's then three 1000's




Nevermind

 

[James Morrison]

Well, it depends, a 1000 watt burns VERY hot...so you can put the 600 watt closer...It isnt as bright obviously, but its pretty darn close efficiency wise because of all factors mentioned. Def more that only 60% of the efficiency of a 1000 watt one would assume.

 

[icdog]

600w lumateks put out less light on a light meter then a 1000w, I measured it.
But far less heat.
My yields:
.6 g/w with 1000w, .9 - 1 g/w with 600w lumatek.

 

[Maccabi]

icdog,

you are yielding the same amount.
.6 q/w with 1000w = 600g
.9-1 g/w with 600w = 540-600g

if this is true, then why would you run the 1000w? you would grow the same amount with the 600w and still save electricity, cut down heat, etc.

 

[icdog]

Don't use the 1000w anymore and didn't know before. Everybody says 1000w are the way to go and yes they do well, it depends on your setup and what you want for efficiency.

 

[Guest]

I used to use 1000's and raved about them but now go with 600's and have no interest in changing. I think the whole 600 digi compares to a 1000 is kind of crap. I'd like to see the actual test data. While some say there is no difference I noticed a positive improvement regarding yield and quality after changing from coils to digis. 600's are the most efficient. As for heat and distance from plant tops just air cool the things.

 

[Germanator]

I am considering going with 2X750 Digitals next round. I ave been told the same thing by a local hydro store owner. For my set-up he claims that the 750 digis will out yield my 1000W X 600W coils I have run.
That and the chance of lowering my electric bill will have me switching in a couple months...if I see a difference (I'll be running the same cut), I'll post up some results.

Germ

 

[nUt_jOb]

What I have seen personally when run side by side:

1k hortilux core and coil with great temps due to airconditioner: large dense buds with huge trichomes and the vast majority of the bud is top notch (verses airy popcorn)

600w hortilux on a digi ballast no aircon: 2/3 the yield of 1k (very impressed) but the bud had smaller trichs, took about 3-5 days longer to finish (clones of the exact same plant), and although it looked almost the same when it was manicured, once dried it was much less dense (much less weight per volume too).. less bag appeal.. and not nearly as desireable as the 1k with an aircon bud. There was also way more popcorn bud thats only real use to me was in cannabutter.

Lets see what else I can tell you...

the 1k lights heat up not only due to hot bulbs but their radiated heat is way more too.. this is good and bad.. what it means is that the lights even when air cooled will end up heating stuff in your grow room just like a black leather car seat on a hot summer day. This is because the photons are of higher energy levels meaning that there are far more photons emitted at a energy level high enough to support photosyntisis. This is a key difference between the 600 and 1000 watt lights. A 600 watt light will never come close to this and we often hear this refered to as "canopy penetration."

So to make a long story short.. If you can cool them then 1k hortilux lights are the way to go IMHO. That will give you top notch product. If you are looking to grow a suprising amt of bud that is of decent quality while maintaining a reasonable electric bill and inital setup costs (cooling a 1k light is expensive if you live in a warm area).. you will like the 600 digi.

Other info you might like to know... I have kill-a-watt metered these ballasts and you may find this interesting..

1k core and coil el-cheapo ballast kit I assembled ran at 1400watts (120v) on the kill-a-watt meter

1k core and coil top shelf fully assembled store bought ballast runs at 1200watts (120v)

600 watt eLux ballast runs at just barely over 600 watts on my kill-a-watt meter and has a built in time delay to refire bulb after a power outage (just thought i would throw that in there.. cuz those relays for the 1k lights to time delay cost $70).

 

[Guest]

A 600 watt light will never come close to this and we often hear this refered to as "canopy penetration."

If you are looking to grow a suprising amt of bud that is of decent quality while maintaining a reasonable electric bill and inital setup costs (cooling a 1k light is expensive if you live in a warm area).. you will like the 600 digi.

600 watt eLux ballast runs at just barely over 600 watts on my kill-a-watt meter and has a built in time delay to refire bulb after a power outage (just thought i would throw that in there.. cuz those relays for the 1k lights to time delay cost $70).

Awesome info in general . I didn't 'quote' everything...just stuff I wanna address. Agree totally a 600 watt will never come close in regards to canopy penetration. I've used 1000 coils and the current 600 digis don't compare in that respect even though they are great.

As for the second point...I'm not even close to agreeing. Wish I could get into details but my 600 digi setup is kicking my friends asses who use 1000 coils in regards to quality (and bud density) with lots of other stuff being equal. Yield is pretty darn...excellent.

Awesome info about 600 digi power useage...I was pretty surprised when the electric bills started to come in after installing the digis... .

Anyway...thanx for the input .

 

[nUt_jOb]

well again, quality can always be attributed to other things. In your example you have two different growers.. Ive seen people not able to pull a qp from under a 1k light. I can say this though, I am in no way giving up on 600w lights and actually I am trying to dial in the system a little better to work with it. I think the results will be good.

 

[Trichome Toker]

An experienced grower can get much more with a 1,000w than a 600w.

Plenty of growers clear two pounds with a single 1,000w.

No one ever got anything close to two pounds with a 600w.

600w bulbs have their place for sure, but they can't yield the same as a 1,000w by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[Rosy Cheeks]

A quality 600w bulb run with a digital ballast will perhaps not match a 1000w bulb in lumens, but the light output will increase with a digi, and the life span of the bulb will too, so there's your justification to switch to digital ballast technology.

Apart from that, most of you are looking at it from the wrong perspective. I'm not trying to pick a fight here, and this shouldn't turn into a this vs that thread, but I wonder why so many growers persist with 1000w bulbs when there are so few advantages with them.

The 600w light is more economic. In terms of lumens per watt-conversion, you will get 150w/l out of a 600w HPS, and 140w/l out of a 1000w/l. For those growers who put a lot of work and effort into making your growrooms as efficient as possible, those figures mean something.

Heat is a major factor in bulb life span, and very hot bulbs (for instance, bulbs caged into a sealed reflectors with extraction) will loose in performance quicker. Since the 600w generates less heat, it will last longer than a 1000w bulb used in the same way.

One thing I'd like to point out, that in my research I learnt that alot of 600's now are giving you 90,000 lumens compared to 120,000 lumens for the 1k's. Now that sounds pretty impessive thinking that the 600's which are nearly half the watts, perform nearly as good............

That is until yo look at the PAR watt ratings. Lumens don't mean jack shit to plants, PAR watts is what they want. And the PAR watts for the 1K's are nearlly double the 600's.

No, lumens don't mean shit to plants, lux does. It seems that a basic update on light and lumens is needed. PAR stands for Photosynthetically Active Radiation, with other words the kind of (light) radiation needed for photosynthesis. As well informed growers know, there exists today CFL's with better PAR ratings than both High Pressure Sodium and Metal Halide bulbs. They do not put out more lumens (and Cannabis likes a lot of light), but the (light) radiation wavelenghts are more precisely the ones plants need for photosynthesis. Depending on whether your run MH or HPS, hortilux or classic lights, PAR values will vary depending on the quality of the bulb. The PAR per watt value (a ballpark calculation of useable light per watt), will of course increase as the wattage increases.

In two separate 3000w growrooms, one running 3X1000w bulbs, the other running 5X600w bulbs, the 5X600w growroom will have better light distribution (more point sources of light, which means a more even canopy, better spread of bud sites, and in theory a higher yield. If the canopy is even, you can optimize the distance between bulb and plants) and less heat issues. If everything apart from the light is the same, the 5X600w growroom will produce better growth and a higher yield, and save you money on your electricity bill. As to light penetration, the higher the wattage the higher the penetration. The problem with the 400w bulb is that it hardly manages to provide sufficient light penetration on a mid-sized indoor Cannabis plant, let's say 1.5m (5 feet) and up. The 600w will, and the 1000w will even better. But in a SCROG or SOG grow, where bud growth are spaced out horisontally with little depth penetration needed, 10X400w bulbs will be a superior set-up to 4X1000w bulbs, for the above mentioned reasons.

No matter how you turn it, the 600w wins (the credo "bigger is better" isn't always true). With a digital ballast, it's even better. If that near 1000w capacity of a 600w digi still isn't enough, then go for 2X600w, and knock the socks of your 1000w bulb grow.

 

[Bermyboy]

One thing I'd like to point out, that in my research I learnt that alot of 600's now are giving you 90,000 lumens compared to 120,000 lumens for the 1k's. Now that sounds pretty impessive thinking that the 600's which are nearly half the watts, perform nearly as good............

That is until yo look at the PAR watt ratings. Lumens don't mean jack shit to plants, PAR watts is what they want. And the PAR watts for the 1K's are nearlly double the 600's.

Where do u find the PAR ratings?

 

[ft100]

i am in the market for one of those homeboxes because i like how easy they are to move and setup etc. they have one that is 4x8 and one that is 4x4. I know i will spend the cash on the digital ballast whether it is the 1000 or the 600. I want to buy both the 4x4 and the 4x8 and i am having a hard time deciding if i want to use 600s or 1000s. any input?

great thread and good conversation. peace and smoke.