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Guerilla Underground Thread
- Thread starter MountainBudz
- Start date
MountainBudz
⛽🦨 Kinebud and Heirloom Preservationist! 🦨 ⛽
I have dropped plants from seed vegging at 24/0 outdoors as well no problem, in fact i almost always usually do. The thing is, its usually at 2 or 3 weeks veg time before the plants reach sexual maturity.
In all honesty that is the key, the most important factor is the age of the plants... How old are these plants you place outside with 14 plus daylight hours and have no issues with them going into flower mode after being vegged indoors under a 24/0 schedule ? The ones I inquired about are anywhere from 2 to 4 months old. Definitely past sexual maturity. If they were only a few weeks in, I wouldn't care at all to throw them out from a 24/0 lighting schedule...
Clones are usually always sexually mature. I have taken clones vegged on both 24/0, 20/4, and even 18/6 light cycles and threw them out in middle of may when we are receiving 14 hours plus sunlight and they always went straight into flower and took forever to revert and some didn't. That happens with clones 95% of the time when I used to try it. So strain dependability comes into play as well as the most important factor, them being sexually mature.
I then started throwing them out after or at the end of the first week in June and never had an issue regardless of the current light cycle they were in, usually 24/0 or 18/6 in my experience.
Basically to simplify what I am saying here, I can sit clones out right now and they 95% for sure will start flowering, this is from experience. However, I can sit plants from seed out before reaching sexual matuirty even at 3 to 4 weeks in, as long as no sexual expressions are showing and be golden, they will continue vegging with zero issues. So in my situation, having plants even being from seed, that are 2 to 4 months old, that is no different than sitting out a clone, same situation even though they are from seed, they are sexually mature.
I just dropped my light scedule down from 24/0 yesterday evening to 22/2 and from here I will drop it an hour per night till I am on about 15/9 and then proceed to sit my plants out.
Now what I am going to do, since I have more than enough plants to work with is perform an experiment just for peoples own peace of mind, for future reference... This needs to be here in my thread so we can all see how this goes and things like this is critical information to the guerilla growers. I am going to place out one Hindu Kush Pakistani x 69 Skunk #18 plant, which is very indica dominant. Then I am gonna place out one Bullet Train (Arcata Trainwreck x SSH) which is very sativa dominant and we are all gonna see what happens. This will confirm how much the light cycle matters as well as it being sativa dominant strains or indica dominant strains and see if either, at all, have a trigger to start flowering.
This is the only way we will learn and know, and take advice as a fact, is by experimenting and documenting the experiment.
I will post photos later of the two candidate's...
MountainBudz
⛽🦨 Kinebud and Heirloom Preservationist! 🦨 ⛽
Actually I am gonna go ahead before daylight sits in, here in about 2 and a half hours, and sit the two plants in the holes. I am fucking dying to get my first plants of the season sit out anyway lol. Should have some huge plants this year considering the age of them and how long they have been vegging. This experiment will be conducted on the 2 month old plants as I only have a handful of the 4 month old seniors, those I dont wanna waste on an expirement in case things dont go over too well. I have plenty though that are 2 months in to work with.
wish me luck fellas!
wish me luck fellas!
Ibechillin
Masochist Educator
^Great additions MountainBudz, thanks.
Now what I am going to do, since I have more than enough plants to work with is perform an experiment just for peoples own peace of mind, for future reference... This needs to be here in my thread so we can all see how this goes and things like this is critical information to the guerilla growers. I am going to place out one Hindu Kush Pakistani x 69 Skunk #18 plant, which is very indica dominant. Then I am gonna place out one Bullet Train (Arcata Trainwreck x SSH) which is very sativa dominant and we are all gonna see what happens. This will confirm how much the light cycle matters as well as it being sativa dominant strains or indica dominant strains and see if either, at all, have a trigger to start flowering.
This is the only way we will learn and know, and take advice as a fact, is by experimenting and documenting the experiment.
I will post photos later of the two candidate's...
Looking forward to the results of this, sucks i dont have mature plants under veg to put out at my lattitude to compare also! (im at 15hr days right now, rising to 16hr by june 21st)
Different strains can have different critical darkness times. If 10 week strains are "average flowering times" the strains that are on the lower end flowering times 7-8 weeks or longer flower times have lower and higher critical darkness times. 8 weekers have lower and 12+ have longer. Critcal darkness hours is the amount of hours of darkness it takes to trigger flowering. The accepted average is 11 hours. But it can vary some. That is why when growers first started growing indoors they soon set on 12/12 because that pretty much made most strains flower and didn't have much effect on yield with one hour less light. So 11 hours is a good starting point to stay under.
Outdoors 14/10 is a good starting point. In my area at 40N May 20 is a good time. The dark period is 9.5 hrs. And that is the last frost date. If I wait until June 1st there is only 9 hours of dark.
Now when you put plants outside you can do things that could initiate flowering. If they are potbound and you keep them in the same container. Also if you plant them in spots that don't get direct sunlight very near sunrise and sunset. Many guerilla growers do this because totally open spots mean totally stollen or confiscated plants. We hide stuff near the edge of fields and around bushes and trees. You only need about 8 hours of direct sunlight to harvest some great buds. But you need to keep things from flowering as soon as outside. Also you need to know your hours of darkness in your area.
Seedlings are different as I mentioned way back in this thread. You can start seeds right in the plot. They won't be triggered by critical darkness hours. They are driven by the steady decrease in darkness that normally occurs in nature when seeds start germinating in the spring when it gets warm. Inside the darkness hours are short and consistent. If you start seeds inside under 12/12 they will flower before alternating leaves because they are over their critical hours of darkness needed to flower. They don't flower right away. It takes a while. But I don't think it takes as long as it takes to reach sexual maturity (alternating leaves).
Outdoor guerilla growing isn't easy to duplicate grower to grower or season to season because we don't have the advantage of planting right in the middle of an open field. Maybe a cornfield or a remote spot but most time we are all creeping along like coyotes. Avoiding detection and prowling the edges.
That is why I always wait until June 15th to put out my clones. It eliminates the iffy lighting factors caused by shading. I also use familar clones and most are the 10 weekers. I should make that clear. I don't have problems with stuff flowering when I put it out June 15 to June 30 even from 24-0. I usually have them on 18-6 because roots grow the most during the dark period. You always want some good roots.
Outdoors 14/10 is a good starting point. In my area at 40N May 20 is a good time. The dark period is 9.5 hrs. And that is the last frost date. If I wait until June 1st there is only 9 hours of dark.
Now when you put plants outside you can do things that could initiate flowering. If they are potbound and you keep them in the same container. Also if you plant them in spots that don't get direct sunlight very near sunrise and sunset. Many guerilla growers do this because totally open spots mean totally stollen or confiscated plants. We hide stuff near the edge of fields and around bushes and trees. You only need about 8 hours of direct sunlight to harvest some great buds. But you need to keep things from flowering as soon as outside. Also you need to know your hours of darkness in your area.
Seedlings are different as I mentioned way back in this thread. You can start seeds right in the plot. They won't be triggered by critical darkness hours. They are driven by the steady decrease in darkness that normally occurs in nature when seeds start germinating in the spring when it gets warm. Inside the darkness hours are short and consistent. If you start seeds inside under 12/12 they will flower before alternating leaves because they are over their critical hours of darkness needed to flower. They don't flower right away. It takes a while. But I don't think it takes as long as it takes to reach sexual maturity (alternating leaves).
Outdoor guerilla growing isn't easy to duplicate grower to grower or season to season because we don't have the advantage of planting right in the middle of an open field. Maybe a cornfield or a remote spot but most time we are all creeping along like coyotes. Avoiding detection and prowling the edges.
That is why I always wait until June 15th to put out my clones. It eliminates the iffy lighting factors caused by shading. I also use familar clones and most are the 10 weekers. I should make that clear. I don't have problems with stuff flowering when I put it out June 15 to June 30 even from 24-0. I usually have them on 18-6 because roots grow the most during the dark period. You always want some good roots.
Hoypare.
Well-known member
Ibechillin
Masochist Educator
My best results cloning have been under a 14 on 10 off veg period under a 600w mh about 12-14 inches away, ive also had cuttings root under 12/12 on their own in around 7 days, i let them fall on the tops of pots from pruning out the inner growth then watered and had clones poking up all over.
This is day 7 from cutting dipped in rooting powder and put under a humidity dome, just sprayed with water intermittently, no aero cloner!
I do believe from experience longer dark periods facilitate root development, but also believe foliage amount is much more important to growth than root mass as long as water and nutrition is kept up, (think trees in small pots). I have see some monsters vegged in short time frames from 24/0, has it been proven if cannabis even ACTUALLY NEEDS a "rest" cycle?
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TychoMonolyth
Boreal Curing
Now *that's how it's done!
Rodehazrd
Well-known member
I have always veged and cloned at 24-0 but my roots never came close to you folks . I always thought growing any thing required active transport only available with light. After seeing those roots I'm putting a timer in the veg room soon, I think the root system and the biota there are the most important development during veg.
TychoMonolyth
Boreal Curing
I'm on 24/0 and it's nothing like that. But I'm sure feeding has something to do with it.
Ibechillin
Masochist Educator
Maybe it was the 400ppm well water i was using? 
This is the guide i follow, works great. Getting clones to root is alot to do with environment, this guide has the wet/dry cycles down for them to root quick.
https://www.growweedeasy.com/cloning-made-easy/
This is the guide i follow, works great. Getting clones to root is alot to do with environment, this guide has the wet/dry cycles down for them to root quick.
https://www.growweedeasy.com/cloning-made-easy/
TychoMonolyth
Boreal Curing
My well water is a constant 6.8 and I use the drinking water tap (no conditioning).
militia420
Active member
I know this is an older post but I just came across the thread and have had many successful outdoor grows. Gonna respond to a few of these questions.
Not sure because I picked locations that already had green vegetation growing around it. I know it works well enough because it was in a park where I didn't think any one would go but some nut decided to off road and went into the area where I had 4 c99 plants about 3 ft tall at the time growing. Their tire tracks were within 2-3 feet of running over one plant and apparently the nut didn't see any of my plants because they were unmolested. Point being, my plants were close to other plants. I did minimal weeding to make sure all of their leaves and branches were clear of other plants. But the general weeds around them, not having a huge mulch pile around the base, and standing in different places around the plant to prevent damage to the growth of grass and plants around it helped camouflage the plant just fine.
what can i use that blends in and wont propagate like mad.
No clue but if you can pick a location that isn't a valley or dip where you get frequent dew it will make or break a grow. Another grow I did was in an abandoned farm field with a ton of high grass. The area would always have some mist in the morning and I should have known better from my school bus route. But I lost probably half my bud to god damned mold and bud rot. The one thing that helped save some of it was to take heavy duty scissors and cut the grass back away from the plant. Be aware of what this does to the view from above if choppers or planes are a concern.
Are you trying to get busted? They're noisy, they can be seen from a distance, they could get lost near your grow and someone could find the drone and then your plants. Just not a good idea IMHO. If you want to scope an area use an internet satellite map like google or bing. Zoom around. Make sure the areas have traits you like. Then physically go scout the area. Take notes. What's the parking like, traffic, animals, potential for aerial busts, etc?
Not sure because I picked locations that already had green vegetation growing around it. I know it works well enough because it was in a park where I didn't think any one would go but some nut decided to off road and went into the area where I had 4 c99 plants about 3 ft tall at the time growing. Their tire tracks were within 2-3 feet of running over one plant and apparently the nut didn't see any of my plants because they were unmolested. Point being, my plants were close to other plants. I did minimal weeding to make sure all of their leaves and branches were clear of other plants. But the general weeds around them, not having a huge mulch pile around the base, and standing in different places around the plant to prevent damage to the growth of grass and plants around it helped camouflage the plant just fine.
what can i use that blends in and wont propagate like mad.
No clue but if you can pick a location that isn't a valley or dip where you get frequent dew it will make or break a grow. Another grow I did was in an abandoned farm field with a ton of high grass. The area would always have some mist in the morning and I should have known better from my school bus route. But I lost probably half my bud to god damned mold and bud rot. The one thing that helped save some of it was to take heavy duty scissors and cut the grass back away from the plant. Be aware of what this does to the view from above if choppers or planes are a concern.
Don't be a women. Just pick what gets the job done. I've used duffle bags, black trash bags, etc. I generally only put out 1.5ft tall clones. I saw the thread starter mentioned having some 6 inch seedlings. That's too small for best chances of getting them started well imho. 1.5 ft will fit in a duffle bag. It also allows for sticking them in opaque trash bags and the trunk so you don't get busted moving them. Don't leave trash at the site. Only leave the plant.
Are you trying to get busted? They're noisy, they can be seen from a distance, they could get lost near your grow and someone could find the drone and then your plants. Just not a good idea IMHO. If you want to scope an area use an internet satellite map like google or bing. Zoom around. Make sure the areas have traits you like. Then physically go scout the area. Take notes. What's the parking like, traffic, animals, potential for aerial busts, etc?
MountainBudz
⛽🦨 Kinebud and Heirloom Preservationist! 🦨 ⛽
Well folks, today I am dropping somewhere between 100 to 150 of my own personal bred Appalachian Brainfreeze beans. My last run with this strain last year proved to be amazing, I have not come across a quicker finishing, mold resistant strain as these. Super dense, menthol eucalyptus/ earthy herbal smelling buds that packs just that, what the name suggests... a brainfreeze. This bud hits hard and is a guerilla growers dream, most phenos will finish around August 20th to the first week in September, although I have seen a few run into later Sept. Anyone from around here, in South Eastern Appalachia knows damn good and well, it is a pain to find a staple strain thalay resists botrytis, powdety mildew, etc because of the insane heat and humidity we deal with. I have grown this since I made it two years ago and never have I suffered any mold issues with this one. Also, we dont ever seem to get any pest or insect issues with her either. I believe it is something to do with her chemical, menthol type smell, honestly I a am not even sure if that is the correct term, i am not sure really what kind of smell she has but it is very different and I have never smelled the terps before. Whatever it is insects and animald don't care for it at all.
I didn't get a chance yesterday to get the two plants sit out for the experiment, we got some heavy rains, and although I dont mind working the bush in the rain, my atv is still down atm and I plan on getting her going today..... fingers crossed. I did go head and sit them out in their containers though, so really the experiment has started, just dont have em in the ground as of yet.
I will update on that later with pics.
Y'all fellars have a good afternoon! Work hard and work smart!!! Gitter done!
I didn't get a chance yesterday to get the two plants sit out for the experiment, we got some heavy rains, and although I dont mind working the bush in the rain, my atv is still down atm and I plan on getting her going today..... fingers crossed. I did go head and sit them out in their containers though, so really the experiment has started, just dont have em in the ground as of yet.
I will update on that later with pics.
Y'all fellars have a good afternoon! Work hard and work smart!!! Gitter done!
TychoMonolyth
Boreal Curing
Kicking that cat hard this year.Well folks, today I am dropping somewhere between 100 to 150 of my own personal bred Appalachian Brainfreeze beans. My last run with this strain last year proved to be amazing, I have not come across a quicker finishing, mold resistant strain as these. Super dense, menthol eucalyptus/ earthy herbal smelling buds that packs just that, what the name suggests... a brainfreeze. This bud hits hard and is a guerilla growers dream, most phenos will finish around August 20th to the first week in September, although I have seen a few run into later Sept. Anyone from around here, in South Eastern Appalachia knows damn good and well, it is a pain to find a staple strain thalay resists botrytis, powdety mildew, etc because of the insane heat and humidity we deal with. I have grown this since I made it two years ago and never have I suffered any mold issues with this one. Also, we dont ever seem to get any pest or insect issues with her either. I believe it is something to do with her chemical, menthol type smell, honestly I a am not even sure if that is the correct term, i am not sure really what kind of smell she has but it is very different and I have never smelled the terps before. Whatever it is insects and animald don't care for it at all.
I didn't get a chance yesterday to get the two plants sit out for the experiment, we got some heavy rains, and although I dont mind working the bush in the rain, my atv is still down atm and I plan on getting her going today..... fingers crossed. I did go head and sit them out in their containers though, so really the experiment has started, just dont have em in the ground as of yet.
I will update on that later with pics.
Y'all fellars have a good afternoon! Work hard and work smart!!! Gitter done!
Ibechillin
Masochist Educator
I Read awhile ago that in the wild the different cannabinoid and terpene profiles are influenced by the environment, to help resist certain insects/humidity/intense light etc. I was talking with Tycho Monolith like a week ago about genetic drift potential in a strains cannabinoid and terpene profiles from being away from their home environment and bred many "seasons" with different pests/environment influences, Im no expert though, just a thought i had. From my reading, supposedly insects prefer the sweeter smelling varieties and avoid the spicier afghan smelling plants (again i need confirmation on this).
Ive tossed any plant that attracts insects, and i have witnessed personally in a 4x4 tent with ~10 different strains one plant get ABSOLUTELY RAPED by spidermites and not even look at any of the other plants in the room. Treated with neem and they come back everytime with a vengeance on that plant only, tossed it because who wants to have to battle mites regardless of how good it is/was? (i cant confidently say strain name, i was told it was "C99" but who can you really believe?
)Hope this is of some interest to some of you:
A bulbs advertised max lumen output is measured at a distance of 1 foot (12 inches) away.
A 600w HPS bulb produces 90,000 lumens, it is the same strength as the sun ata distance of 1 ft away only differing in spectrum and UV rays. CMH lights are very close in spectrum and UV output to the sun, the increased spectrum and UV help the plant express more diverse terpene and cannabinoid profiles.
(^highliting the benefits of aircooling, a 600w bulb hung vertically in the center of a 3x3 grow tent is literally like having an indoor sun dedicated to each of the plants placed around it)
Light intensity (lumens) is what increases trichome production.
From Royalqueenseeds:
"scientists have identified three categories of trichomes found on cannabis plants:
1. Bulbous trichomes
2. Capitate sessile trichomes
3. Capitate-stalked trichomes
It’s number 3, the capitate-stalked variety, that’s of interest to weed lovers because they are the largest at 50-100µm wide and produce the oily medicinal/recreational goodies.
In nature, it is believed, that trichomes facilitate quite a few essential to survival functions of the cannabis plant. The gooey surface coating of sticky resin provides a frontline defence against fungus, insects and hungry herbivores.
Some flies and certain fungi cannot penetrate the trichome barrier, while terpenes will foul the flavour of the lettuce for four-legged furry critters.
Furthermore, trichomes may also play a key role for cannabis growing in difficult climatic conditions. A layer of resin offers wild weed protection against damaging winds from the desert sirocco to the Siberian blizzard.
Trichomes even serve as organic sun block for marijuana plants, protecting them from the effects of UV rays from the sun. We shall explore the relationship between UV and trichomes a little further below.
The relationship between trichomes and light is the key to understanding the immense importance of trichomes. UV light is what gives dank weed the X-factor.
Cannabis plants feed on light and when they receive the optimal spectrum they perform best. Old school outdoor cultivator’s anecdotes about HID cultivated indoor weed lacking sometimes in flavour and in potency have been confirmed by modern science.
Trichomes respond positively to UV rays and it is now believed, that UV light is required for the trichomes to produce certain terpenes and cannabinoids.
Source: Published February 20th, 2017
https://www.royalqueenseeds.com/blog-cannabis-trichomes-importance-n430
Ibechillin
Masochist Educator
You may be very surprised of what a plant put out late in the season is capapble of!
These are from the pot size to yield 1-2lbs thread:
link: https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=258657
militia420
Active member
Probably over 10 years ago my partner and I threw out a few extra late ones in August in the Virginia area. The problem is dialing in how big these guys are. Any thing under a foot sucks for yield. The buds are so tiny and only good for maybe one smoke. If you stuck plants out that are about 1ft tall at that time you might have better luck with reasonable bud size. Our plants were 6" when we stuck them out around late August. They finished probably around the 2nd week of October, probably no bigger than a foot in most cases. Keep in mind the days are getting shorter by August. I think doing these types of grows are a great idea but like all grows I'd keep the foot print down. Maybe no bigger than 10x10 per plot and each plot spread 100' apart in case of arial, and don't make it round or square. Make it abnormal.
