Guerilla Soil Revelations

[D.S. Toker. MD]

Some of you know that ive been looking at different soil compositions in realtion to water retention and overall plant health. A few years back i had several late plants planted in native soil while most of my plants were in organic soil. I noticed during the dry spells that year the plants in native soil required far less watering than did my plants in organics.

This rear the roles were reversed. All but 3 of my plants were planted in clay- heavy native soil. The results are as clear as day.

Organic soil does not retain moisture any where close to the levels seen with clay based soils. Plants grown in organic soil will requrie nearly 3 times the amount of water that the same plant would require in clay based soil. The organic soil is airy and allows evaporation much faster than clay based soil. The additional moisture required by the organic soil isnt a problem if youre growing in your back yard, but if youre a mile into the bush its a different story.

We had good rainfall this year. The only plants i had to water were the plants grown in organic soil.

Its a mistake for guerillas to grow in organic soil if watering is going to be an issue. It will work you to death trying to keep plants watered during dry periods while the plants in native soil continue to thrive.

I wont be carrying anymore compost through the bush. Ive invested the money i would have spent on that for a ph meter that will allow me to determine ph. Once ive established that, i can operate. If compaction appears to be a problem i get a bag of perlite.

Organics may help taste, but if the plants die from a lack of water they wont have any taste at all. No more for this guerlla.

 

[skullznroses]

Hey Dr,

Geology 101- Clay can be both inorganic and organic. Both types hold water extremely well.

Also, What do you mean when you say Organics? Compost, bat shit, there are 1001 soil amendments that you could call "organic" and they all hold moisture differently.

 

[DuskrayTroubador]

I've heard clay has a lot of nutrients in it if you break it up, have you found a way to do so?

Also, on a 1-10 scale, if organic soil mixes have water retention of 1 and native clay soil has water retention of 10 (just to put them on opposite ends of the spectrum) where would native sandy soil fit in on that scale? More specifically entisol soil because that's the native soil I will be using.

 

[bozga]

As a guerilla grower I noticed that too. My guerilla spot is very far from any tracks and I cannot access the spot via car or bike. It takes me a lot of time to even get to the spot and when I get to the spot there is some more effort to go through the bush.
Carrying 70L soil bags is not very easy task and practically I cannot do it. I can only take couple of bags with organic fertilizer and some humus/wormcastings to amend to the soil.
I decided for the next season to prepare spots without buying many bags of soil.
So my idea is to use black soil from the woods with old decomposted leaves an branches together with mulch from old tree logs.
Raised beds and growbags are also not an option because plants would eventually die of drought because I cannot visit them often.

So my idea is to dig holes, add best forest soil in it, add some leaves and old branches for water retention, some wormcastings, chickenshit pelles and a good layer of mulch from an old logs.

NExt thing is to check pH and I think we're ready to roll!

This year I haven't watered my plants, only couple times with nutrients. But Next year, I'll add everything to the soil. Will try without watering and feeding.


Also my concern is pH so I think I will buy myself one too!

P.S. And of course, it's very important that the plants get some shade during hottest summer months because if they are on a very intense sun all day long I think they would not survive...Maybe smaller plants yes, but bigger plants could not.

 

[THC123]

lol so you just add clay pellets or water chrystals and problem solved

My organic soil has clay in it to retain water


i see no reason to grow in native soil unless it would be a really good soil

and clay is also organic

 

[Brother Bear]

Your recommend to mix about 30% of the native soil back into your hole, which would give you your clay and EWC.
And if you use soil crystals, don't mix them into the entire batch of soil. Add them to the bottom of the hole so the roots still grow deep

 

[KSP]

lol so you just add clay pellets or water chrystals and problem solved

My organic soil has clay in it to retain water


i see no reason to grow in native soil unless it would be a really good soil

and clay is also organic

Same here, it's a no-brainer, or I thought it was. I plant over perched water tables, and because of the winter\spring rains, I've had to water very little this season, in my "organic" holes. Thick layers of mulch will help out a great deal also. Don't need a pH pen either; a bottle of pH test indicator and a small glass or plastic vial w\ cap is just as good and much cheaper.

 

[LouDog420]

Your recommend to mix about 30% of the native soil back into your hole, which would give you your clay and EWC.
And if you use soil crystals, don't mix them into the entire batch of soil. Add them to the bottom of the hole so the roots still grow deep

Do bear's shit in the woods?? I'm not sure, but this bear at least knows his way around a guerrilla grow


Water polymer crystals (at the bottom of the hole!), slow release ferts, and some coco/perlite to provide some aeration is all that goes into my holes (aside from the native soil of course). Visit in the spring, put out clones, come back to harvest in the fall, that is all

 

[KSP]

Do bear's shit in the woods?? I'm not sure, but this bear at least knows his way around a guerrilla grow


Water polymer crystals (at the bottom of the hole!), slow release ferts, and some coco/perlite to provide some aeration is all that goes into my holes (aside from the native soil of course). Visit in the spring, put out clones, come back to harvest in the fall, that is all

Wish I could get by with that, but I have to visit to spray for PM and pests through the season. You must have some resistant OD strains.

 

[D.S. Toker. MD]

Same here KSP. I sometimes have to go 2x a week.

Hey Dr,

Geology 101- Clay can be both inorganic and organic. Both types hold water extremely well.

Also, What do you mean when you say Organics? Compost, bat shit, there are 1001 soil amendments that you could call "organic" and they all hold moisture differently.

The clay i have is brown and i estimate it makes up 40% of the soil. Corn, soy, sunflowers and tobacco are grown locally without soil modification so it doesnt compact to badly

By organic, i mean peat based or other based compost added to the planting hole until the material is primarily compost.. I had used the same holes for many years and each year at chop, i would add 2 gallons of compost to overwinter. Over 15-20 years the holes had become black and deep. Icall that organic and some water sucking shit..

 

[supermanlives]

when i was back east i planted in clay areas. all i added was perlite and ferts. i stopped adding compost and stuff.

 

[KSP]

So my idea is to use black soil from the woods with old decomposted leaves an branches together with mulch from old tree logs.
Raised beds and growbags are also not an option because plants would eventually die of drought because I cannot visit them often.

So my idea is to dig holes, add best forest soil in it, add some leaves and old branches for water retention, some wormcastings, chickenshit pelles and a good layer of mulch from an old logs.

I like this idea and I've been thinking about this for a season or two. Probably won't add branches though but I'll include a significant portion of native in-situ soil. Later this fall and winter I'm going to prep a few new holes this way and see how it goes next year. I may carry a few bricks of coco to add to the mix, along with organic ferts and some perlite.

 

[TACOE]

Get the beat of both worlds.. Do ur peat mix but instead of using say 50%. Do 30 peat 20 native. Or vice versa. Oh and dig holes. Skip pots.

 

[g0vnaa]

Thank you for that info man.
I tend to agree with you too. This year I dug holes and filled them with some horse manure. Used many water cristals too.
But I mixed them in the soil..
Plant were dry all season...
What can I do to prevent that dryness next year ?
I`m thinking off adding lots of perlite and maybe some chicken manure.
Mixing it with whats left in the wholes from this year.
Maybe digging them a little deeper and mixing some of the native soil in the mix.
What else do you advice me to use ?

 

[Afghankush420]

does anyone know of any soil that is light in weight? My guerilla trail is very dangerous and I don't want to fall carrying bags of soil out to the garden as that would get me caught. Also, I can't use natural soil because it is too hard. I would post this on a new thread but I'm not allowed to start new threads for some reason, maybe cause I'm a newb? idk. But I need some help guys. thanks.

 

[gorilla ganja]

does anyone know of any soil that is light in weight? My guerilla trail is very dangerous and I don't want to fall carrying bags of soil out to the garden as that would get me caught. Also, I can't use natural soil because it is too hard. I would post this on a new thread but I'm not allowed to start new threads for some reason, maybe cause I'm a newb? idk. But I need some help guys. thanks.

I don't think there is a light weight soil. But as some above have pointed out there are light weight additions you can add to loosen up native soil, coco bricks ( just add water), perlite, vermiculite, dry peat moss.
These things may help you, but they can also be a pain to carry in, depending on the amounts.

Best of luck and may all your Buds be Huge.

Cheers GG

 

[DuskrayTroubador]

I don't think there is a light weight soil. But as some above have pointed out there are light weight additions you can add to loosen up native soil, coco bricks ( just add water), perlite, vermiculite, dry peat moss.
These things may help you, but they can also be a pain to carry in, depending on the amounts.

Best of luck and may all your Buds be Huge.

Cheers GG

Right on. I've been thinking about this a lot recently; soil compaction and overall makeup was one of my weaknesses this past season.

I'm going to be filling up buckets with top soil from a densely forested area. That topsoil in forested areas without much undergrowth is super loamy and fertile.

In addition to mixing in forest topsoil, I'm buying some other amendments that help aerate the soil and add nutrients: gypsum pellets, basalt rock dust, pulverized lime, and insect frass. Maybe some vermiculite as well, we'll see. The less space in the pack an amendment takes up, the better.

 

[HIMALAYAN GANJA]

i have been preparing for next year guerilla season. i grow in a place where hauling in soil is out of the question.so i have to make my soil from what i find in the woods. first i remove the first layer of the foresst floor which has the recently fallen leavres and tigs. i rake this layer to the side. the next layer is half decomposed leafe matter and twigs, wood, barkk. i feel on big bag with this layer. then the next layer is really black fully decomposed organic matter. it is realy light and fluffy and airy, thus providing me the bulk of my soil mix. i mix the second and third layers(the half decomposed and the fully decomposed layers). the half decomposed layer has lots of wood matter that provides more airation and drainage. then i search around in the woods and sometimes find litlle spots where there is sand. i will take this sand and add it to the mix as well. so now i have a soil that i fairly light and drains well enough. since its from the forest floor it definately has plenty of microbial life and soil fungi that are good for the soil.

and then come nutrients. i use granular fertillizers organic or mineral either way. now think about this. what is good soil? to my understanding good soil has 1: GOOD FLUFFY STRUCTRE THAT SUPPORTS AERATION AND GOOD ROOT DEVELOPMENT AND DRAINAGE
2: GOOD NUTRIENT SUPPLY FOR THE PLANTS ENTIRE NEEDS AND PH BALANCE

so these two point structure and nutrients. these conditions can be abtained without hauling bales of soil. a few backpack loads would be enough. the dry granular nutrients are light. a 10KG bag would be enough for many many plants. 10 kg in a backpack is really not that haevy and could be carried quite faar into the wild without fully exhausting ones self. another second 10kg back pack load with tools, other minor additives, grow bags,.
A third 10kg bacpack load with some rolls of chicken wire and whatever other items that one may need.

i am sure lots of people are in a situation like me where we cannot make fifty trips to the site with 60lb of peat moss on our backs. the forest can provide all kinds of amendments just got to find them and gather them