Growroom Electricity and Wiring

[schwagg]

No... It depends on the voltage of your timer as to what voltage you'll need for the relay coils.

That realy is a DP relay so you can switch 2 hot's. As per my light controller example, even tho I'm only using 120v ballasts, I still used both hots (MWBC) so I needed the DP relay... If you want to just use a 12/2 branch circuit and a 20A relay to run 120v ballasts, then a SP relay is what you want.

Are you running that 6/3 into a sub? You decided not to do that correct? If your still planning on building a light controller because your moving, then I would buy a subpanel rated for atleast 60A and one that has enough room to mount a relay inside.

Then you really would have a light controller such as the one that was for sale and posted back a few pages. You would have OC protection along with builtin receptacles and a 120v timer controlling a relay which in turn controlled some of the receptacles.

MP, is that what i need to have 120 input on the light controller. i want to build my own but i'm confused. i want a 120 relay/timer to run one 400 lumatek. i seem to have issues with getting it to light on these cheap timers. i'm not sure if it's the timers or being a digi ballast. after all my work on running wire and plugs, my light still isn't firing. any ideas? i read somewhere that the digi's draw quite abit more then cap and coil on startup but i wouldn't think it would be an issue.

 

[inphu510n]

Ok here goes nothing...

I realize what I'm about to ask is probably IMPOSSIBLE to wire to code. The reason I'm asking is if you think there's any safe way of wiring it.

I'm planning on building a cab with wheels so that if I move, it can move with me. This means the thing is plugged into a wall socket and cannot be hard wired via sub panel/conduit/nm etc...

It's going to be pushed fairly close to a wall and because of this, I want to put the light timer on the front of the cabinet so that it's easy to get to as well as easy to see when the lights are on/off.

I'd like to wire a lighting timer meant for in wall installation so that it controls a 400w mag ballast. I'd like to wire it into the main door of the cab. Power would be drawn from a power strip.
Initially I'd thought of simply using a 25ft #14 extension cord cut in half. In my research I've seen that it's illegal to use extension cord for the purpose of wiring something permanently, mostly because the jacket degrades over time. I then thought to use armored cable terminated with plugs at one end. Obviously I'd use a gang box for the timer.
It just seems ridiculous to set up a gang box for the timer and then set up two gang boxes for power in/out to the timer.

Yeah.
I have the distinct feeling that you're palming your face right now and asking why god makes such moronic humans.
It's because I'm a perfectionist.
It's because I refuse to believe that what I'm suggesting is any more dangerous than running an unattended 1kw light in a plastic tent filled with tanks of spraying water in a carpeted bedroom.
Also, I'm planning on employing two methods of fire suppression if that eases your mind about what kind of person I am.

 

[mrgoldmund]

I am in the process of converting a room in my basement into a grow room. This is in the same room that houses my main electrical panel, and I am tearing down the drywall on the walls and ceiling and building back up from bare walls, so I will have full access to the panel. When I am finished building, the room will be 8'x9' and the panel will be outside the room in essentially a hallway.

There are currently two 120v outlets and a light fixture in the room that run to a 15amp breaker. Since my main panel is so close, and it has plenty of room on it yet, I figure a subpanel is unnecessary. My plan is to run one line to a 20 amp breaker for my 1000w flowering light, and a second line to a 20 amp breaker for my 600w veg light and portable AC (which depending on temps I may not be running at all). The existing wiring would be used for pumps, fans, etc.

Does this sound like it would work ok?

I have zero plans for expanding the size or number of lights, and will be reinsulating and drywalling the entire area, so I'd like to get it right the first time.

 

[madpenguin]

Guys, I have a service call I need to go on and it'll probably take me quite a few hours, but I can answer the last 3 posts when I get back.


FYI, on the homemade flip flop, it doesn't work with digital ballasts as I fully suspected. Going to need to employ a delay on make timer. This may mean that the 6x6x4 enclosure will no longer be big enough.

However, I see absolutely no reason why it wouldn't work flawlessly with magnetic ballasts.

I got one flip to occur about 2 seconds after the relay switched but after that, when flipping, they wouldn't fire. Just barely glow orange.

So anyway, for anyone following the choppy tutorial I was doing earlier, it'll only work with mags right now. I'm building another bloom room so the heat is on to get this flip flop working with my galaxies.

So look for a complete tutorial soon. If your using mags then what I have built now will be perfect. If using digi's, then you need the same thing only a delay on make timer needs to be added to it so the power is completely killed momentarily before the flip occurs. Just one extra component and wont complicate things too much.

 

[Avenger]

How long did you give it after the flip?

Your elec. ballast may have a delay built in it to prevent hot restrikes. The momentary open circuit as the relay flips, could trigger this built in delay.

Just a thought.

 

[Dr. Green Thumb]

ok so I have an other thread on here about my receptacle just going out in my growroom but the other 2 in the room still work....well thats just one problem....Someone at my house today noticed weird ticking sounds occasionally coming from my breaker box, its a 15a breaker. And due to the other electrical problem i stated earlier im only running a 150hps now. I live in a old condo...do you think things are starting to go wrong? ....and by the way I've been unplugging everything in the house when im not using it....I've just been very paranoid about this electrical stuff and would appreciate your advice.


-Dr.GreenThumb

 

[schwagg]

green thumb, are the other two outlets on the same circuit? do you have a tester?

 

[Dr. Green Thumb]

green thumb, are the other two outlets on the same circuit? do you have a tester?

yes they are on the same circuit , i had a buddy of mine who use to do electrical work come out and check some things out. He looked at some things and couldn't figure out why that receptacle wasn't working, he even went into the attic to check things. Keep in mind I would rather get a full blown license electrician out here but don't have the money right now( i do trust my buddy though, he worked with electricity for a couple years) and I wont trust some random stranger in my house. We thought maybe the receptacle was dead so I replaced it with new one....still no power for that receptacle. He is going to come back out in a couple days to look at it more in depth....so now im here asking for help, i know a lot of you have super knowledge on this. I look forward to more replies

-Dr.GreenThumb

 

[madpenguin]

MP, is that what i need to have 120 input on the light controller. i want to build my own but i'm confused. i want a 120 relay/timer to run one 400 lumatek. i seem to have issues with getting it to light on these cheap timers. i'm not sure if it's the timers or being a digi ballast. after all my work on running wire and plugs, my light still isn't firing. any ideas? i read somewhere that the digi's draw quite abit more then cap and coil on startup but i wouldn't think it would be an issue.

To be honest, I have no idea what's going on with your setup. It really sounds like a timer issue. I'm going to assume that you have tried multiple timers with this 400w?

It really doesn't make sense. I've been using 2 - 600w digi's on one cheap 15A timer for a year now. No problems.

If you haven't tried any other timers then that most certainly should be your next course of action. Sounds like you got it working for just a little bit but then it started doing the same thing again?

 

[madpenguin]

Ok here goes nothing...

I realize what I'm about to ask is probably IMPOSSIBLE to wire to code. The reason I'm asking is if you think there's any safe way of wiring it.

I'm planning on building a cab with wheels so that if I move, it can move with me. This means the thing is plugged into a wall socket and cannot be hard wired via sub panel/conduit/nm etc...

It's going to be pushed fairly close to a wall and because of this, I want to put the light timer on the front of the cabinet so that it's easy to get to as well as easy to see when the lights are on/off.

I'd like to wire a lighting timer meant for in wall installation so that it controls a 400w mag ballast. I'd like to wire it into the main door of the cab. Power would be drawn from a power strip.
Initially I'd thought of simply using a 25ft #14 extension cord cut in half. In my research I've seen that it's illegal to use extension cord for the purpose of wiring something permanently, mostly because the jacket degrades over time. I then thought to use armored cable terminated with plugs at one end. Obviously I'd use a gang box for the timer.
It just seems ridiculous to set up a gang box for the timer and then set up two gang boxes for power in/out to the timer.

Well... All that sounds fine actually. I would use an old work box on the front of the cab so you have something to put the timer in. Make the power in a 14/2 MC cable. Wire a plug onto the end of it that will be sticking out the back or side so you can easily plug it into the wall. Then take a short run of MC cable out of the box to feed your light/ballast....

This isn't premise wiring so you aren't strictly bound by the NEC at every turn. Just use the armored cable so you don't accidentally damage it. Your plan sounds fine to me. Just don't use the powerstrip. If you need receptacles for a fan and what not, then hard wire a junction box inside the cab that has a receptacle in it. Then continue on with the 14/2 MC until you hit your timer.

 

[madpenguin]

I am in the process of converting a room in my basement into a grow room. This is in the same room that houses my main electrical panel, and I am tearing down the drywall on the walls and ceiling and building back up from bare walls, so I will have full access to the panel. When I am finished building, the room will be 8'x9' and the panel will be outside the room in essentially a hallway.

There are currently two 120v outlets and a light fixture in the room that run to a 15amp breaker. Since my main panel is so close, and it has plenty of room on it yet, I figure a subpanel is unnecessary. My plan is to run one line to a 20 amp breaker for my 1000w flowering light, and a second line to a 20 amp breaker for my 600w veg light and portable AC (which depending on temps I may not be running at all). The existing wiring would be used for pumps, fans, etc.

Does this sound like it would work ok?

I have zero plans for expanding the size or number of lights, and will be reinsulating and drywalling the entire area, so I'd like to get it right the first time.

All of that sounds good. You might not want to have the AC on the same circuit as that 600 tho. The starting/inrush current of the AC could screw with that lamp.

I would probably run one 14/2 for the 1000w. One 14/2 for the 600w. And probably one 14/2 for the AC. Then use the existing circuit for pumps, fans and whatnot.

 

[madpenguin]

ok so I have an other thread on here about my receptacle just going out in my growroom but the other 2 in the room still work....well thats just one problem....Someone at my house today noticed weird ticking sounds occasionally coming from my breaker box, its a 15a breaker. And due to the other electrical problem i stated earlier im only running a 150hps now. I live in a old condo...do you think things are starting to go wrong? ....and by the way I've been unplugging everything in the house when im not using it....I've just been very paranoid about this electrical stuff and would appreciate your advice.


-Dr.GreenThumb

Stuff like this is almost impossible to diagnose without being there in person. I would take a multimeter and get readings at the receptacle that is "dead" and go from there. By taking a volt reading you can determine whether it's completely dead or maybe your just getting a little bit of voltage there.

Just ran into this last week. Measured 25v from hot to neutral. Had to go downstream and find out where the neutral was good and then fish a new wire. The neutral must have gotten nicked somewhere or something happened....

At the receptacle in question, take a reading from ground to hot, from ground to neutral, and from neutral to hot. Give me the readings and we can go from there.

 

[mrgoldmund]

All of that sounds good. You might not want to have the AC on the same circuit as that 600 tho. The starting/inrush current of the AC could screw with that lamp.

I would probably run one 14/2 for the 1000w. One 14/2 for the 600w. And probably one 14/2 for the AC. Then use the existing circuit for pumps, fans and whatnot.

Thanks for the suggestions madpenguin, I will definitely run that third line. Just got demo finished up this morning, and am writing up my materials list for the home center. I picked up the Black & Decker wiring book yesterday, and after reading through it I am pretty confident in what I'm doing. Construction starts in earnest tomorrow, and I can't wait to get going.

 

[wolfeman]

Very basic question...

Very basic question...

I will be running an "extention" cord I made from 10 AWG romex. It plugs directly into the dryer outlet in my garage. From there it runs about 40 feet to the grow room.

I just want to double check with the experts that this is satasfactory. In the breaker box are two tandem 120/240 breakers connected together as one. They are marked 30 on each. So, I'm assuming that 2x30@120v equals 30@240.

I have 4 x 1000W lights I will be running. From the calculator I see I have a 16.6 amp demand. Seems like I have more than enough. Correct?

This is a great thread, THANK YOU!

 

[inphu510n]

Well... All that sounds fine actually. I would use an old work box on the front of the cab so you have something to put the timer in. Make the power in a 14/2 MC cable. Wire a plug onto the end of it that will be sticking out the back or side so you can easily plug it into the wall. Then take a short run of MC cable out of the box to feed your light/ballast....

This isn't premise wiring so you aren't strictly bound by the NEC at every turn. Just use the armored cable so you don't accidentally damage it. Your plan sounds fine to me. Just don't use the powerstrip. If you need receptacles for a fan and what not, then hard wire a junction box inside the cab that has a receptacle in it. Then continue on with the 14/2 MC until you hit your timer.

Thank you!
Really, it's an amazingly great thing that you're on here, giving advice like this. I can imagine it's not exactly fun answering questions all the time but then again, I do enjoy answering forum questions I have the knowledge to answer.

I now have a question about supplying power to everything.
You'd said not to hook the two lines that would be going to the in wall timer into any sort of power strip. I understand that too much current draw on a power strip can be dangerous. I'm totally ok with just plugging the mag ballast into a wall socket but that leads me to ask, what's the difference if the draw on the power strip is under 1440w? The power strip would have a circuit breaker and surge protection whereas otherwise there would only be a circuit breaker at the panel. If there's only one circuit in the room then it seems like it would kinda defeat the purpose of plugging the ballast into a wall plug, even if it's a different plug than everything else is on.

Heh. Well, so what do you suggest for supplying 8+ outlets in this cab? It'll have five separate compartments with one specifically for a fan and another for tool/nute storage. I'm figuring on using a power strip simply because it's far less expensive and possibly safer than using a 5 gang box and wiring in receptacles and 15a breaker myself. Not that I don't trust myself but I've never done that much 120v before.
Overall, I'm attempting to keep cabinet's amp draw around 10-12 so that I don't overload any circuit new or old.

Thanks again MP. You're invaluable around here.

 

[schwagg]

To be honest, I have no idea what's going on with your setup. It really sounds like a timer issue. I'm going to assume that you have tried multiple timers with this 400w?

It really doesn't make sense. I've been using 2 - 600w digi's on one cheap 15A timer for a year now. No problems.

If you haven't tried any other timers then that most certainly should be your next course of action. Sounds like you got it working for just a little bit but then it started doing the same thing again?

so far i'd like to say thanks to MP. your help is greatly appreciated. just reading past Q&A gives alot of info.

now, what i want to have is the timer and relay thing in one box to turn on one ballast. the timer kicks the relay and the relay takes all the load right? but, i need a 120V relay as all my power is 120V. right? i don't want to have to worry about timer's anymore and the boxes that you make look great. that's where i get confused. i tried three identical digi timers and all have the same issue. they wont light the ballast. one did it when i first hooked everything up but the next day, same thing. nothing...

 

[Dr. Green Thumb]

alright thanks for the advice Mad Penguin and you too shcwagg

 

[tokinafaty420]

Are relays required? I keep seeing people mention them and telling me to use em. I never have in the past. Also just so you know if I am doing something wrong I am in no danger as the panel I am about to speak of has not been connected to the main yet. I'm currently just getting the panel, receptacles, and 2x 15a digital timers (type you hardwire) installed.

Basically what I have is a 60A panel connected off of the main. From the 60A panel I currently only have 2x 15a receptacles in place to be connected. Each receptacle has its own dedicated timer installed in between it and the panel. Isn't it redundant to have both relays and circuit breakers? or should I install 15a relays between the timers and the receptacles?

 

[madpenguin]

I will be running an "extention" cord I made from 10 AWG romex. It plugs directly into the dryer outlet in my garage. From there it runs about 40 feet to the grow room.

I just want to double check with the experts that this is satasfactory. In the breaker box are two tandem 120/240 breakers connected together as one. They are marked 30 on each. So, I'm assuming that 2x30@120v equals 30@240.

I have 4 x 1000W lights I will be running. From the calculator I see I have a 16.6 amp demand. Seems like I have more than enough. Correct?

This is a great thread, THANK YOU!

Yea, if it's this your talking about then you'll be OK.

 

[madpenguin]

so far i'd like to say thanks to MP. your help is greatly appreciated. just reading past Q&A gives alot of info.

now, what i want to have is the timer and relay thing in one box to turn on one ballast. the timer kicks the relay and the relay takes all the load right? but, i need a 120V relay as all my power is 120V. right? i don't want to have to worry about timer's anymore and the boxes that you make look great. that's where i get confused. i tried three identical digi timers and all have the same issue. they wont light the ballast. one did it when i first hooked everything up but the next day, same thing. nothing...

Yea... That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Id still be trying to find the cause instead of side skirting it with relays....

But... If you want to build a light controller that employs a relay, then you would want a spst relay with a 120v coil.

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/5Z538?Pid=search

That would be for a 120v light controller. You'll still need to use one of those digital timers to send power to the coil contacts of the relay tho...