Growing by your self sucks

[neongreen]

One start I planted out 2 1/2 weeks ago (@ 52N) has definitely started flowering, so I took advantage and pollinated it Was planning on making seeds this season anyway, so I see it as a bonus, especially as I struggled to get mature seeds last year due to a combo of bad weather/late pollination.

On soil compaction: I regularly pull up weeds here who's roots have grown straight through lumps of clay that are extremely dense, so I doubt Cannabis would have too much trouble growing through pretty well compacted soil.

On the other hand, you do want your soil to have plenty of air spaces, so soil that compacts too much is likely going to impact negatively on plants. If your soil is compacting, then perhaps the initial mix needs a rethink? Perhaps you need more worms and/or to not let the soil dry out too much? I don't know as I'm only just starting to experiment myself.

I was too late for this season, but IMO getting your soil tested, and then amending as necessary from there is probably the best way to go:
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=312208

Edit: PS. I also agree that much more than 12" deep is probably over kill. I've always dug deep holes/beds, and nearly always dig up my root systems after harvest to see how they have done. The results have been quite surprising for me as I've never found a substantial root system that penetrates deeper than about 1-1.5 ft.

These for example are the two Rombolts from my 2013 outdoor grow (see link in sig) which ended up at around 8 and 9 ft:

Ironically, those are the biggest/most bushy plants I've ever grown (though not the highest yielding!) and yet when those went into that bed I'd only just dug/amended/manured it. Since then the plants I've tried to grow in that bed have only reached a bit over half the size of the Rombolts at best! Hopefully this year will be different, but I'm going to get the soil tested to see what is going on anyway.

 

[OrganicDisciple]

One start I planted out 2 1/2 weeks ago (@ 52N) has definitely started flowering, so I took advantage and pollinated it Was planning on making seeds this season anyway, so I see it as a bonus, especially as I struggled to get mature seeds last year due to a combo of bad weather/late pollination.

On soil compaction: I regularly pull up weeds here who's roots have grown straight through lumps of clay that are extremely dense, so I doubt Cannabis would have too much trouble growing through pretty well compacted soil.

On the other hand, you do want your soil to have plenty of air spaces, so soil that compacts too much is likely going to impact negatively on plants. If your soil is compacting, then perhaps the initial mix needs a rethink? Perhaps you need more worms and/or to not let the soil dry out too much? I don't know as I'm only just starting to experiment myself.

I was too late for this season, but IMO getting your soil tested, and then amending as necessary from there is probably the best way to go:
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=312208

Edit: PS. I also agree that much more than 12" deep is probably over kill. I've always dug deep holes/beds, and nearly always dig up my root systems after harvest to see how they have done. The results have been quite surprising for me as I've never found a substantial root system that penetrates deeper than about 1-1.5 ft.

These for example are the two Rombolts from my 2013 outdoor grow (see link in sig) which ended up at around 8 and 9 ft:

View Image

View Image

View Image

Ironically, those are the biggest/most bushy plants I've ever grown (though not the highest yielding!) and yet when those went into that bed I'd only just dug/amended/manured it. Since then the plants I've tried to grow in that bed have only reached a bit over half the size of the Rombolts at best! Hopefully this year will be different, but I'm going to get the soil tested to see what is going on anyway.

Those are some very beautiful girls. I'm really up in the air with soil testing. I'm scared to get one done and then falling into being told to treat it in a non organic way. Which would be counter productive for what I'm aiming for. Are there any big organic growers around here that go without testing? Just curious. I'd like to pick there brain on maintaining there organic soil builds.

 

[plantingplants]

There are organic amendments options. Leadsled does analyses and gave me all organic recommendations.

Thanks for the photos neongreen-- that's cool. My mounds are 12-16".

 

[OrganicDisciple]

Will leadsled give me options for something mild? I don't really have the funds to get an analysis done. And I've already planted. So kind of a blind. Here you go. Or should I just wait and see if I encounter a problem?

 

[OrganicDisciple]

Got a couple more plants in the ground today. I decided to not grow the blue berry headband. I have a small garden and she just wasn't performing compared to these local breeders beans I have. It's crazy. I refuse to grow a big name breeders beans just to say I have it if it doesn't perform. Plants are beautiful. Hope I can get watering dialed in this year. I slacked hard last year and plants were def not a potential. This year new year and new me.

 

[plantingplants]

I would definitely prefer local quality genetics. I just don't know any local breeders ..actually I did but I lost their number

If you don't have the $75 or so for test and analysis then yea why not just see how it goes and correct as needed.

I'm not sure what you mean by mild amendments. You can always add less. For most organic amendments you can water them in.

 

[OrganicDisciple]

Yea I meant a mild mix. I remember coot telling me a good fix all would be 1/3 cup kelp, 1/3 crab and 1/3 cup neem meal with a top dress and ewc tea is a good fix at in case anything happens to hppen. But I'd rather nail the problem on the head then to try and fix something that may not need to be fixed.

 

[plantingplants]

Yea I meant a mild mix. I remember coot telling me a good fix all would be 1/3 cup kelp, 1/3 crab and 1/3 cup neem meal with a top dress and ewc tea is a good fix at in case anything happens to hppen. But I'd rather nail the problem on the head then to try and fix something that may not need to be fixed.

Yea I'm not sure. I guess kelp has a huge variety of minerals. But very very low Mo for example, so that cure all wouldn't fix an Mo deficiency. But I'm super new to organic growing. I agree with your sentiment though-- I'd rather be precise.

 

[neongreen]

But I'd rather nail the problem on the head then to try and fix something that may not need to be fixed.

Or worse still, you may add something that you already have too much of in your soil, throwing it out of wack even more.

It's only $25 for the test you need from Logan labs... IMO a small price to pay to make sure you are not making things worse. Of course you may need to spend a bit more on top for advice on what amendments would work best with your soil. If the total comes to 100 or 200, what does that matter if you get an extra lb or 2!

 

[OrganicDisciple]

Very true. How long do they take to get back to you? What exactly do I ask for? Whose the man around here? Lead them my way please lol

 

[plantingplants]

Logan Labs has a pretty quick turnaround time-- include cash with your order. They're probably busy now so 2-7 days after they receive it. If you've had plants growing in the soil for a while then you'd want the saturated paste test, and if you wanted, the Nitrogen test which tests nitrate and ammoniacal nitrogen (otherwise they don't test for N). You'll want to ask if they can test for the extras like Mo, EC, Co, Si, etc. with the saturated test. I'm not sure. I think that would come to $46 with sat paste and N. Look on their website for instructions on sampling.

Once you got your results, you would contact the user leadsled, who has a very quick turnaround time (anywhere from a half hour to a day but he'll let you know ahead of time), and he'll give you recommendations, and you can even purchase the organic amendments from him. I shopped around a little and he has great prices (the best AFAIK) and superb customer service.

 

[neongreen]

I was under the impression that you only needed the $25 test, and the others were unnecessary, but it sounds like plantingplants has some actual experience, unlike me - I've only gone through the thread that I posted the link to earlier. Either way it's still not a huge amount relative to the gains you'll make from the extra bud and the potential money saved by not buying amendments which you don't need

 

[OrganicDisciple]

I'm already stocked up for my little grow. I buy bulk. I like everything on deck. I do just want my soil to be top notch for them. I'll look into it. I just want to know what I need to be tested for. If spending 100 bucks is gonna save me a few grand in the long run I'm all for it.

 

[OrganicDisciple]

Stock pile. There's amendmenta crammed behind the bags on the floor lol

 

[OrganicDisciple]

Logan Labs has a pretty quick turnaround time-- include cash with your order. They're probably busy now so 2-7 days after they receive it. If you've had plants growing in the soil for a while then you'd want the saturated paste test, and if you wanted, the Nitrogen test which tests nitrate and ammoniacal nitrogen (otherwise they don't test for N). You'll want to ask if they can test for the extras like Mo, EC, Co, Si, etc. with the saturated test. I'm not sure. I think that would come to $46 with sat paste and N. Look on their website for instructions on sampling.

Once you got your results, you would contact the user leadsled, who has a very quick turnaround time (anywhere from a half hour to a day but he'll let you know ahead of time), and he'll give you recommendations, and you can even purchase the organic amendments from him. I shopped around a little and he has great prices (the best AFAIK) and superb customer service.

My apologies didn't see this post. I'll check out the website asap

 

[OrganicDisciple]

How would someone organicly treat a micros deficiency? Let's say thought I had one. How could I try and treat the problem before over dosing my plants? Last year I had two plants that looked weird. I tried treating it with everything that I had on hand but it never helped. I never tried treating a micros problem. All other plants were dping absolutely fantastic. So it kinda blew my mind. Maybe I had a different problem?

And is it true that russet mites will actuallyale your plant look like it may have a deficiency?

 

[plantingplants]

My soil is too high in K so that is going to lock out certain minerals. I'm going to foliar spray organic micronutrients to circumvent the lockout and add them to the soil to bring it into balance once the K chills out.

Just Google organic micronutrients and you'll see your options. AEA MicroPak for example. Here are some brands held in high esteem around here: AEA, Tainio, JH Biotech

You don't overdose your plants the same way you don't give them too much of anything else. Read the bottle lol

 

[plantingplants]

Regarding russets, leaf edges curling up is what I've seen, and weird stunted fan leaves.

 

[neongreen]

How would someone organicly treat a micros deficiency? Let's say thought I had one. How could I try and treat the problem before over dosing my plants? Last year I had two plants that looked weird. I tried treating it with everything that I had on hand but it never helped. I never tried treating a micros problem. All other plants were dping absolutely fantastic. So it kinda blew my mind. Maybe I had a different problem?

It seems that what can happen is that if you already have too much of X then your plants can no longer take up Y, even though there might be plenty of Y present in the soil - it's just un-available due to the high levels of X. The danger then is that you identify a Y deficiency and pile on extra Y, which upsets the balance further (now you have two problems - too much X and too much Y).

The solution to this is to dilute the soil you have with an amendment/amendments that have high Z, no X and low levels of Y. Deciding exactly which amendment/amendments are needed in what quantities is best left to someone who has a deep knowledge of the subject.

Without the test and someone to interpret it you're just guessing, and likely making things worse, which I would bet was the case with the two weird plants you mentioned you had last year.

 

[OrganicDisciple]

My soil is too high in K so that is going to lock out certain minerals. I'm going to foliar spray organic micronutrients to circumvent the lockout and add them to the soil to bring it into balance once the K chills out.

Just Google organic micronutrients and you'll see your options. AEA MicroPak for example. Here are some brands held in high esteem around here: AEA, Tainio, JH Biotech

You don't overdose your plants the same way you don't give them too much of anything else. Read the bottle lol

That was from Coots mix?