Going with Gavitas but need some advice

[FatherEarth]

Off to see the wizzard!

Off to see the wizzard!

You will want to grab an Apogee quantum light meter this way you can make sure your canopy is @ 1000 umol and evenly spread with no hot spots. These guys have not steered you wrong, whazzup is whats up on these lights. And 7ft ceiling is super restrictive trying to run these lights. I would reformulate my plan if I was in your shoes.

See the light wizzard before you proceed...go ahead, click him...

 

[Skyrancher]

These guys have not steered you wrong, whazzup is whats up on these lights. And 7ft ceiling is super restrictive trying to run these lights. I would reformulate my plan if I was in your shoes.

See the light wizzard before you proceed...go ahead, click him...[URL="https://www.icmag.com/ic/image.php?u=11022&dateline=1246529747&type=profile"]View Image[/URL]

Gavita is the lighting system I'd like to use, but I also have 7' height restrictions. The solution might be the Gavita Pro 600w 400v remote ballast with vertical bare bulbs (Phillips GreenPower)??

Have you thought about going vertical? Although you wouldn't be able to use the 1000w bulbs, you could still use Gavita and Phillips bulbs. The 600w bulbs are more efficent, have a broad spectum, and are specifically designed and matched to run with the Gavita Pro ballast.

Sent Whazzup a PM on September 2nd asking about the Gavita Pro 600w 400v in a vertical grow application, what the minimum bulb spacing is, and recommended bulb height. Gavita doesn't specifically test for vertical grows, so I may not get much, if anything, from Whazzup?

Saw a post on another site about Gavita helping customers with equipment positioning and setup. Asked Whazzup about this too. Will pass on what he says.

 

[Stonefree69]

Gavita Pro I believe is double ended and can't be used in a "vertical reflector" like say as in the OG reflector or Luxor. Gavita Digilux ballasts & bulbs yes you can with bare bulb or put in a vertical reflector.

I don't think Gavita makes vertical fixtures and Whassup has said: "Why would you want to ever use a lamp in true vertical application? Horizontal use with a reflector is much more efficient for distributing even lighting at the best operating temperature of the lamp. You will lose light when you operate your lamp in cooler conditions. The burning position of this lamp is horizontal btw, so it can not be used in a verical application anyway. Also, the ballast should be used vertical for optimal cooling (air running up through the ribs). Also you would need to run a wire down to the other end as you already noted (or run it over the ceiling, walls and floor ). Many reasons why it should be used as designed. "

 

[Skyrancher]

Gavita Pro I believe is double ended and can't be used in a "vertical reflector" like say as in the OG reflector or Luxor. Gavita Digilux ballasts & bulbs yes you can with bare bulb or put in a vertical reflector.

I don't think Gavita makes vertical fixtures and Whassup has said: "Why would you want to ever use a lamp in true vertical application? Horizontal use with a reflector is much more efficient for distributing even lighting at the best operating temperature of the lamp. You will lose light when you operate your lamp in cooler conditions. The burning position of this lamp is horizontal btw, so it can not be used in a verical application anyway. Also, the ballast should be used vertical for optimal cooling (air running up through the ribs). Also you would need to run a wire down to the other end as you already noted (or run it over the ceiling, walls and floor ). Many reasons why it should be used as designed. "

You're right...the Gavita Pro 1000w DL is double ended only. The Pro 600w EL is a single ended bulb, available for any E39 or E40 fixture. This bulb has an operating postion "U" designation for "any or universal" mounting positions. This may be a relatively recent modification?

http://www.ecat.lighting.philips.co...essure-sodium/horti/61396/cat/?t1=ProductList

I've read Whazzup's quote as well. ""Why would you want to ever use a lamp in true vertical application?" His short sighted statement seems to have overlooked that Gavita reflectors cannot be used in applications with low ceilings, where a vertical bare bulb would find itself at home.

He indirectly points with out on OpenGrow, where Whazzup is an administrator, where he states,

"Would you do only 8x600W (a bit much but very doable) in 2 rows of 4:"

at 0.5 meter height 958 umol s1 m-2 avg
at 0.7 meter height 1030 umol s1 m-2 avg
at 0.9 meter height 1107umol s1 m-2 avg
at 1.1 meter height 1177 umol s1 m-2 avg
at 1.3 meter height 1266 umol s1 m-2 avg

"All at >90% uniformity, except when coming higher than 1.2, then uniformity drops and you will come too close to the lamp with light levels directly under the lamp at 1.3 meters >1700 umol s1 m-2, so well over saturation level."

The Gavita Reflector is inefficent at low ceiling heights and gains in uniformity with increased height up to about 1.3 meters. But without the proper ceiling height, it is impossible to attain the needed light overlap. This is where bare bulb could work. I'd like to see the bare bulb numbers, but it really doesn't help in my case, or for PeterWB. Not enough ceiling.

I have an attic space with low ceilings and a sloping roof line, so bare bulb is realistically my only choice. I would like to use the Gavita reflector, but I wouldn't have much room for plant growth. Peter seems to be in a similar place.

 

[Stonefree69]

Very informative Skyrancher! PeterWB's idea though seems ingenious - mount reflector INSIDE ceiling & that would give his 7' ceilings another 1-2' to work with. Bet a lot less heat goes into room as well...

Info on Pro 600 watt EL bulb:

Description

HPS 600w 400v Philips Master Greenpower EL Single Ended. (EL-special designed for electronics)

Only use on commercial grade 400v Gavita systems!!!

Highest Micromole output in the industry.

http://www.gavita-holland.com/index...item/son-t-pia-greenpower-400-volt-600-w.html

* Alleen i.c.m. Philips GreenVision system
Specifications

Brand: Philips
Type: Master GreenPower T EL 400 Volt
Power: 600 Watt
Lumens: 90.000
Growlight (µMol): 1170
Voltage: 400

I guess the question is what ballast & mogul socket would you use. I already have a Gavita/Micromole 600 watt ballast & Gavita Digistar 600 watt hps bulb and run that vertical bare bulb. In flower I use a Digilux 600 watt MH as well to run 1,200 watt stacked donut (balanced spectrum, I heard as little as 10% more blue can help too). So maybe Gavita has a remote ballast instead of this option (for vertical bare bulb): http://www.gavita-holland.com/index...performance-lighting/item/gavita-pro-600.html

Be interesting how Gavita Digistar & Pro bulb setups would compare in vertical.
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PS - OK BINGO!

Gavita Pro Electronic Remote Ballast 600w

Professional adjustable high frequency electronic ballasts.
Only suitable for use with EL lamps: no acoustic resonance, up to 8% more grow light compared to traditional lamps, light maintenance after 5000 hours >95%.
Microprocessor controlled with electronic safety circuit.
Driver efficiency at full power is 95-96%.
Gavita Pro 1000 has adjustable output to 600/660/750/825/1000/1150 watts.
Sealed housing with Gore-Tex ventilation plug.
Equipped with an industry standard XR505 connector for plug and play installation with your favorite reflector.
Operate at 240 volts.

Question is what mogul socket? * From MASTER GreenPower Plus 600W EL Mogul .pdf it's E39 mogul socket. Hey I'll be a customer too, as I'm expanding and need more micromols!
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Sorry PeterWB to get a bit OT but thanks too for your idea of recessed ceiling mounts. One thing I HATE though is that recessed "can" track lighting which is ridiculously inefficient to an an white semi-opaque lamp shade. Your approach is totally different though from track lighting LOL.

 

[PeterWB]

I am monitoring the heat (with a temp sensor) in the box above ceiling height where I have the Gavita's mounted. Using an 8 inch in-line fan and some central vac tubing I am blowing air off the floor level of the room up, into, and thru each box. I've found that there is on average a 1 degree increase in temp within the box. Potential problem resolved.

I don't have a uMol meter but I can tell you that my room appears to be lit up very well.

I've also added chains, which I am using to lower lights to within 1 meter of the top of the canopy. My plan is to raise it as the plants grow up.

 

[Skyrancher]

Question is what mogul socket? * From MASTER GreenPower Plus 600W EL Mogul .pdf it's E39 mogul socket.

PeterWB...really admire your inventive idea and for making it happen. Cooling was my only concern with it, but your handled it. Great job.

Look forward to seeing how the Gavita's perform for you.


StoneFree...Here's a quote from Whazzup that might answer your question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Capulator
will e40 work though?

Shit I ordered a bunch last night.


"If you bought your fixture in the US (so the US version) you will have the E 39 version. Modifying the fixture will revoke the UL/CSA certification and will revoke the warranty. An E40 lamp could be screwed into a E39 lamp base, though that is not a safe installation and also not warranted."

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?p=5943374#post5943374

 

[FatherEarth]

Im glad I have taken my time to implement the Gavita into my setup. I was originally was going to build with the ceilings @ 10' but now I think 12' would be a better option since the head space is available. I plan to go all gavita if they turn out to be as productive as the data and reports suggest.

Hey Pete, care to share a picture of your solution or maybe a diagram?


Thanks,

FE

 

[whazzup]

I'm on holiday . About Watts per square meter: we rather steer on light level. You will get 2000 umol out of the reflector, that's good for 1000 umol per square meter, or 500W per square meter. If you would use for example a 1700 umol lamp you would be able to light about 1,6 square meter with it.

Yes, distance to the lights is key to get the correct levels and uniformity. In any scenario where you light just the benches you will lose light as well, but also you lose a lot of uniformity. Lighting the room also give you the advantage that the plants are lot from the sides as well.

In a low room I would not boost to 1150, and having boxes in your ceiling does give you more height but you would certainly need to fireproof these: what if your ventilation fails? Never hang very hot HID lights close to a combustible material. Also, your ballasts would immediately overheat when your cooling fails. So I would not recommend this type of installation.

A good alternative is to grow in scrog. You get an excellent yield and quality in scrog using vertical lighting. It will take you a week or two veg more but the yield per plant is great. You can count on at least 500 grams per square meter, good growers get more than 600 grams from a square meter using 1000 umol light levels.

I personally love to scrog. There is nothing as nice as an even field of foot long buds.

 

[PeterWB]

My ventilation system to the lights is automated from the power box that feeds power to my lights. I'm also using a top quality 6" inline fan so I think the risk of fan ventilation failing and lights being on is greatly minimized. I've built 4' x 8' rolling platforms that I'm placing plants in soil on. During most of the lighting period I have eliminated the platforms are pushed into the aisles, this eliminating wasted light.

My only problem to address at this time is room heat. I have a heat exchanger that runs 24/7 plus inline fans pulling in air and pushing out air. It still can get pretty hot so I am considering an air conditioner.

 

[PeterWB]

Im glad I have taken my time to implement the Gavita into my setup. I was originally was going to build with the ceilings @ 10' but now I think 12' would be a better option since the head space is available. I plan to go all gavita if they turn out to be as productive as the data and reports suggest.

Hey Pete, care to share a picture of your solution or maybe a diagram?


Thanks,

FE

I'll get a pic as soon as possible

 

[Stonefree69]

I going to try the Gavita Pro SE w/the Gavita MASTER GreenPower T EL 600W 400V Electronic Bulb by Philips and I already have a Gavita Micromole (similar to Digistar) 600 watt ballast I'm using for MH.

Be interesting to compare a Gavita Enhanced 600w HPS Bulb on the Gavita Micromole ballast with the Gavita MASTER GreenPower SE 600W on the Gavita Pro 600 Remote Ballast. Would PAR be close? Or the GreenPower ahead?

Either way, my choice for running MH & HPS.

 

[whazzup]

The Philips gives you a better efficiency, but if you boost the enhanced lamp you will probably have the same or a little more light (at a higher power use of course, and a bit more ballast dissipation. At 110% the enhanced lamp is even a bit more efficient than at 100%.

The micromole has always performed well too.

 

[vapeking]

How many Gavitas can a 5 ton AC cool sealed? 15 Ft. ceilings currently 12 1000 watt HPS.