Gavita malfunction

[theother]

Have a friend going through this right now, and I have zero de experience so was hoping maybe one of you de gurus could help.

Two gavita fixtures in a room with some 1k and 600 single ended digis as well. He noticed that one of the gavitas didn't fire last night. When he turned off the other lamps in the room he found that the remaining gavita that did fire was super dim. He has had some real weird stretch problems lately and this may explain it.

He swapped the bulbs between the gavita that wouldn't fire and the one that would and the non functioning one still wouldn't fire and the one tst was dim before was still dim with the bulb from the non functioning fixture.

Both fixtures are like 6 months old. To the best of my knowledge everything is hooked up properly, this guy tends to do stuff correctly, so I'm doubting it's a simple problem in the wiring of the room. He is using a 30 amp light controller.

Open to any suggestions here as this seems to be an unexpected setback given the perceived reliability/longevity of this equipment. Honestly if it was me I would be super pissed as I don't recall ever having a single ended fixture to down so quickly.

 

[The Doktor]

If the problem was just happening with one fixture then I would agree that the problem was with the bulb or fixture. However with both of them having problems then I am definitely going to call out the problem is the wiring/breaker/controller being compatible with the Gavita lamps. IIRC, Gavita's are not recommended to be used with any other controllers besides the EL.

 

[theother]

If the problem was just happening with one fixture then I would agree that the problem was with the bulb or fixture. However with both of them having problems then I am definitely going to call out the problem is the wiring/breaker/controller being compatible with the Gavita lamps. IIRC, Gavita's are not recommended to be used with any other controllers besides the EL.

I was thinking something similar, however their is nothing to a traditional light "controller". It is basically just a series of outlets wired to a service disconnect. If the gavi's wont work on this, then they wouldn't work just plugged into a 240v outlet, which seems ridiculous.

 

[dansbuds]

have you tried running them from just a 240 volt outlet ??? try that first , some controlers have had weak contactors in them . they use the cheapest parts available when building them , which is why i build my own .

 

[The Doktor]

Then the problem is the "controller" thing. You cannot treat those fixtures like you would most conventional lights and your logic trying to troubleshoot the issue isn't doing you any favors. If you search these forums, 99% of grow failure is because of poorly made DIY attempts. This sounds no different. Tell your "friend" that he needs to buy the right device for it to work the way he wants it to.

 

[theother]

have you tried running them from just a 240 volt outlet ??? try that first , some controlers have had weak contactors in them . they use the cheapest parts available when building them , which is why i build my own .

I build mine too, don't like that there is no over current protection for each individual outlet. I'll hit him up to try and get him to just pull the 30 amp coming into the controller and wire up a couple of 240 volts to it. Have never been in this room myself so no idea how it is set up. Fwiw I hunk we need a sticky in the equipment forum outlining the proper wiring for a timer and subpanel. Rives is the one that got me to see the light as far as what was appropriate.

Then the problem is the "controller" thing. You cannot treat those fixtures like you would most conventional lights and your logic trying to troubleshoot the issue isn't doing you any favors. If you search these forums, 99% of grow failure is because of poorly made DIY attempts. This sounds no different. Tell your "friend" that he needs to buy the right device for it to work the way he wants it to.

You sir are unpleasant and not at al helpful. I would challenge you to look at my activity on this forum. Personally I try and make the world a better place, much like I am doing here. I am literally trying to help a friend, and here you are clogging the three with your perceived bullshit agenda.

Fwiw I do not like the pre made light controllers because of exactly what dans buds brought up. Not at all sure were you are getting the diy grow room failure thing from. Also a quick aside I do not think these fixtures are the e series that can be controlled by the new gavita controller. I can only assume you run the e series and also the controller and are busy feeling superior to anyone who doesn't. That is not helpful.


This is not my room and believe me if it was I would say that it was. I have never been one of the swim crowd. Enjoy the holidays.

 

[The Doktor]

You asked for help on a basic fucking issue and you want to get pissy because I didn't give you an answer you approved of? What was unhelpful really, my answer or the fact that perhaps the technology involved surpasses your approved bullshit? Edit: You REALLY over reacted and read way more into my answer than what I wrote. Perceived agenda? Buddy, you can eat a bag of flaming dicks. I posted facts straight up and down so nothing perceived there. If you don't believe me, just look through my forum history... Or you could actually read the tech info and manuals that come with your toys. Write them, call them, I don't give a fuck how but they will tell you exactly what you can and cannot do with their systems. But tell me again about that whole "leaving the world a better place" bullshit you're trying to sell?

 

[Crooked8]

Then the problem is the "controller" thing. You cannot treat those fixtures like you would most conventional lights and your logic trying to troubleshoot the issue isn't doing you any favors. If you search these forums, 99% of grow failure is because of poorly made DIY attempts. This sounds no different. Tell your "friend" that he needs to buy the right device for it to work the way he wants it to.

I have to agree this is no way to present information. Its rude to say his troubleshooting isnt doing favors. Troubleshooting is literally the exact thing that needs to be done. Its pretty shitty to assume 99% of grow failures come from diy attempts. What kind of bs blanket statement is that? All grow failure? What about deficiency? All bc of diy attempts? Thats makes up most grower error/failure and it can happen to pros, especially dedicated organic growers. Also, putting the word friend in quotes adds the vibe that you think its his personal issue. The entire response is condescending altogether. And now your most recent response about hippie bs and calling someone out for being unable to form sentences is right on target with your prior responses vibe. Please grow up and either try to help or move along with that attitude and we'll see how soon you get banned.

 

[dansbuds]

I build mine too, don't like that there is no over current protection for each individual outlet. I'll hit him up to try and get him to just pull the 30 amp coming into the controller and wire up a couple of 240 volts to it. Have never been in this room myself so no idea how it is set up. Fwiw I hunk we need a sticky in the equipment forum outlining the proper wiring for a timer and subpanel. Rives is the one that got me to see the light as far as what was appropriate.

You sir are unpleasant and not at al helpful. I would challenge you to look at my activity on this forum. Personally I try and make the world a better place, much like I am doing here. I am literally trying to help a friend, and here you are clogging the three with your perceived bullshit agenda.

Fwiw I do not like the pre made light controllers because of exactly what dans buds brought up. Not at all sure were you are getting the diy grow room failure thing from. Also a quick aside I do not think these fixtures are the e series that can be controlled by the new gavita controller. I can only assume you run the e series and also the controller and are busy feeling superior to anyone who doesn't. That is not helpful.


This is not my room and believe me if it was I would say that it was. I have never been one of the swim crowd. Enjoy the holidays.

your right we do need a good thread here on this equipment & its problems ! & Rives is THE MAN when it comes to electrical help here !!! i'm an ex sparky myself , but his knowledge well surpasses mine lol

 

[theother]

So talked to dude this afternoon, he took it into the hydro store and it fired on there outlet. Took it home and it fired on the same outlet on the same controller as before. Really it's out of my depth since I haven't run de. I have definitely seen halides fail to fire after a power outage or turning them off, and may have seen hps do it once or twice. I suppose it could be something along those lines but I sort of doubt it. Since he switched the bulbs and tried to fire it again and it still wouldn't. I know when I've seen single ended not ignite they would certainly have worked after letting it sit and changing the bulb.

You asked for help on a basic fucking issue and you want to get pissy because I didn't give you an answer you approved of? What was unhelpful really, my answer or the fact that perhaps the technology involved surpasses your approved bullshit? Edit: You REALLY over reacted and read way more into my answer than what I wrote. Perceived agenda? Buddy, you can eat a bag of flaming dicks. I posted facts straight up and down so nothing perceived there. If you don't believe me, just look through my forum history... Or you could actually read the tech info and manuals that come with your toys. Write them, call them, I don't give a fuck how but they will tell you exactly what you can and cannot do with their systems. But tell me again about that whole "leaving the world a better place" bullshit you're trying to sell?

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Oh man, not even sure what to say, sorry if I over reacted, it was early and it is frustrating to me. I still say your not helping, but no worries man. SORRy if I over reacted.

I have to agree this is no way to present information. Its rude to say his troubleshooting isnt doing favors. Troubleshooting is literally the exact thing that needs to be done. Its pretty shitty to assume 99% of grow failures come from diy attempts. What kind of bs blanket statement is that? All grow failure? What about deficiency? All bc of diy attempts? Thats makes up most grower error/failure and it can happen to pros, especially dedicated organic growers. Also, putting the word friend in quotes adds the vibe that you think its his personal issue. The entire response is condescending altogether. And now your most recent response about hippie bs and calling someone out for being unable to form sentences is right on target with your prior responses vibe. Please grow up and either try to help or move along with that attitude and we'll see how soon you get banned.

It's tough out there isn't it. The struggle is real and the boards are worth it, just gotta waded bullshit. It's been this way for over a decade. Not worth getting worked up about. I probably did over react, would have been much better to just ignore. It's definitely not a problem with an e series not being on the controller so it's not worth worrying about dudes bullshit.

your right we do need a good thread here on this equipment & its problems ! & Rives is THE MAN when it comes to electrical help here !!! i'm an ex sparky myself , but his knowledge well surpasses mine lol

He's got that sort of anylitcal way of looking at things where he spots shit I didn't even think to mess with. I just think his sub panel after the timer should be standard, but it's not. Can't say how many builds I have seen just run timer to outlets. It's the same way the commercial light controllers are made, but that doesn't make it okay.

 

[The Doktor]

It's cool man. I was just offering help and got a little punchy myself. The DE fixtures are far more finicky than conventional lights and it is like learning lighting 101 all over again. But there is no such thing as going back after you have a good run with them.

 

[dansbuds]

So talked to dude this afternoon, he took it into the hydro store and it fired on there outlet. Took it home and it fired on the same outlet on the same controller as before. Really it's out of my depth since I haven't run de. I have definitely seen halides fail to fire after a power outage or turning them off, and may have seen hps do it once or twice. I suppose it could be something along those lines but I sort of doubt it. Since he switched the bulbs and tried to fire it again and it still wouldn't. I know when I've seen single ended not ignite they would certainly have worked after letting it sit and changing the bulb.


Oh man, not even sure what to say, sorry if I over reacted, it was early and it is frustrating to me. I still say your not helping, but no worries man. SORRy if I over reacted.


It's tough out there isn't it. The struggle is real and the boards are worth it, just gotta waded bullshit. It's been this way for over a decade. Not worth getting worked up about. I probably did over react, would have been much better to just ignore. It's definitely not a problem with an e series not being on the controller so it's not worth worrying about dudes bullshit.


He's got that sort of anylitcal way of looking at things where he spots shit I didn't even think to mess with. I just think his sub panel after the timer should be standard, but it's not. Can't say how many builds I have seen just run timer to outlets. It's the same way the commercial light controllers are made, but that doesn't make it okay.

sounds to me like he's got a weak ground or one of the hot legs are loose . .(240 volts is 2 hot legs of 110 volts & a ground ) have him take apart & check all electrical connections . from the panel to the ballast & everything in between .

 

[ROBDIZZ]

I Heard that the new 1000w gavitas Putin out more lumins than regular raptor 1000w lights. A friend of mine told me he pulls with 4 1000w gavitas the equivalence amount of product that he gets running 12 1000w raptors. Anyone know if this is a fact or fiction? .... Thank you

 

[dansbuds]

3 lights to 1 i wanna doubt , but 2 lights to 1 gavita yeah , i know 3 guys doing just that & are killing it with them .

 

[theother]

sounds to me like he's got a weak ground or one of the hot legs are loose . .(240 volts is 2 hot legs of 110 volts & a ground ) have him take apart & check all electrical connections . from the panel to the ballast & everything in between .

I agree, it has to be something loose in that light box or maybe a loose wire on the circuit back at the panel maybe? This is where RIVES shines IMO. Hes a competent guy though, I think he is just gonna run single ended for now since they are all working. I believe he had enough gear to do it single ended. When he does get around to fixing it, ill ask him and update the thread with whatever the fix was. So strange that they had been running dim, I suspect something in that light box, those things are just sub par.

It's cool man. I was just offering help and got a little punchy myself. The DE fixtures are far more finicky than conventional lights and it is like learning lighting 101 all over again. But there is no such thing as going back after you have a good run with them.

No worries at all man, I really do agree that its something in the wiring or whatever. I have zero experience with the DE but like your saying, they are just a different kind of animal from digi ballasts, I really wanted to help him, but im stumped. I would make the change to DE in a heartbeat but I just don't have the headroom.

3 lights to 1 i wanna doubt , but 2 lights to 1 gavita yeah , i know 3 guys doing just that & are killing it with them .

I believe it. Running the fixtures high and cross lighting large areas is definitely where its at. You combine enough fixtures and that extra area really starts to add up. For me though, I would just have to have 10' ceilings, a lot of the stuff I do is pretty light sensitive.

 

[dansbuds]

yeah , same here no head room & sensitive plants , just getting into some indica hybrids for a change to try & run a shorter statured plant in my rooms .

 

[theother]

yeah , same here no head room & sensitive plants , just getting into some indica hybrids for a change to try & run a shorter statured plant in my rooms .

an incredible scrog might do it. My light sensitive stuff can handle more par early (i can run at like 24" when i flip them) but when they start to stack I have to religiously keep them at 30". I suspect they could take the par again late, just gotta watch that oil production and make sure they don't get fucked. With that in mind i guess it would be worth trying DE, full power during stretch, dimmed during stack and back to full blast late. No idea if it would work. I am under the impression that the DE holds its spectrum better when it dims than SE.

Hard for me to imagine making the jump though since Im usually fighting headroom with my SE deal. Who knows though, they are fucking awesome.

 

[ROBDIZZ]

That's cool I just want to run less watts and pull more. I just never tried gavita lights but I'm going to after my run im doing now. Thanks dansbuds..... Also one more thing does the bud quality come out as good with the gavita lights as it does with the 1000w hps light?

 

[theother]

That's cool I just want to run less watts and pull more. I just never tried gavita lights but I'm going to after my run im doing now. Thanks dansbuds..... Also one more thing does the bud quality come out as good with the gavita lights as it does with the 1000w hps light?

I hear really good things about them. Smart people love them. I've never heard about a drop in quality. This guys room did great with them until whatever this was.

There is gonna be a learning curve just like with any change. I don't mean like a mechanical setup learning curve (sure that may happen as well), but I mean like a lamp height plant health, watching for defs, making sure it's not too close kind if learning curve. But once you get over that hump I think there great.

Id make sure you had 10' ceilings honestly. 9 at the minimum and thats with small plants and you taking an active role in either manipulating the plants or rearranging them periodically. Seems these fixtures support a wide spread but they need the height to accomplish that.

 

[The Doktor]

No worries at all man, I really do agree that its something in the wiring or whatever. I have zero experience with the DE but like your saying, they are just a different kind of animal from digi ballasts, I really wanted to help him, but im stumped. I would make the change to DE in a heartbeat but I just don't have the headroom.

A lot of people are stumped with the height problems that the Gavita 1000 require. The 6/750 E is the perfect solution for lower ceilings or run the 1k at a lower setting and it kills it just as hard. These lights are so sweet that I am thinking about using my Raptor hoods as planters next run.

http://www.gavita-holland.com/index.php/products/proline/item/gavita-pro-6-750e-de-flex-us.html