Footsteps In Becoming an Expert Grower

[Biosystem]

Chopped the other strong ones today!

It's flying a little blind, but it's doing okay! I believe the size of those fan leaves can be attributed to the lack of topping on those plants by the way. The same huge leaves were on all of the specimens that had not been topped but were doing okay to begin with. The two weaker ones were not topped, but had no huge leaves, and the EHs had all been topped. The ones NOT topped that WERE doing okay before all had huge leaves before I topped them today. Much more work to be done soon. Photos to come.

 

[Biosystem]

WEEK 5 OF VEG
Mixed Seed

They were pruned a little under a week ago, and they look deficient in PK, which tracks for soil feeding, so I've hit them with some soluble PK fert. I would be flowering them this week, but I've been busy, and I know better than to flip to bloom with them being even a little unhealthy. After all this work, no use wasting it now by being impatient. Besides, the last crop is only now just almost fully cured down to 62% RH consistently. There'll be time.

 

[gedLang]

WEEK 5 OF VEG
Mixed Seed

They were pruned a little under a week ago, and they look deficient in PK, which tracks for soil feeding, so I've hit them with some soluble PK fert. I would be flowering them this week, but I've been busy, and I know better than to flip to bloom with them being even a little unhealthy. After all this work, no use wasting it now by being impatient. Besides, the last crop is only now just almost fully cured down to 62% RH consistently. There'll be time.

What signs of PK deficiency are you seeing? All I can see from the photos is that the leaves look a bit crinkly.

 

[Biosystem]

What signs of PK deficiency are you seeing? All I can see from the photos is that the leaves look a bit crinkly.

Sorry, man! Been so busy lately I haven't been on it with care and photos. Those pics don't show it very well, but the newest leaves have darker veins and very "sharp" edges on the color divides, and they look sharply crinkled. When I have seen this before, adding calcium, magnesium or sulfur didn't fix it, but adding P and K did. I'll try to get a better pic today if they aren't already too improved to show the difficulty (unlikely).

I think it's PK, but you're right, MAYBE it's not. Gotta fix it though.

 

[gedLang]

Since P and K are both mobile nutrients, I usually see deficiencies start at the lower, older leaves and work their way up. Issues that are affecting the newest leaves could be something else like lighting, immobile nutrient deficiency, or ph.

 

[Biosystem]

Since P and K are both mobile nutrients, I usually see deficiencies start at the lower, older leaves and work their way up. Issues that are affecting the newest leaves could be something else like lighting, immobile nutrient deficiency, or ph.

Hey, man! You're correct in identifying that P&K are mobile, and I don't quite have an answer for why these would be showing more symptoms on the upper leaves. In fact, I'm not even SURE if this is indeed PK def., but the only other times I saw leaves that had these features, the thing that popped them out of it was a dose of PK fertilizer.

Lighting is at ~700-750 PPFD depending on canopy height. pH is just below 7ish based on a soil slurry test and a field test, but I can't get very exact numbers. I know they were growing excellently not too long ago, so it's not absurd to me they may have exhausted some resources in the soil since then, but which one?

The photos I posted do a poor job of showing the leaf situation - I've been too busy lately. Good in many ways, but bad in this one. The garden has to take a back seat for a minute. But maybe these photos can give you some other ideas to mull over.

If y'all know any soil growers with more experience, feel free to tag 'em here. I'd like to get these girls perked up, and I'm not too proud to admit I don't know exactly what this issue is.

 

[gedLang]

I will also readily admit I am no expert and have not faced this situation before. To me the closest match is a Zinc deficiency:

If this is what is happening, it would probably be due to a ph that is too high rather than a lack of Zinc in the soil. If your PK fertilizer has the effect of lowering pH, like it has phosphoric acid, then it would help in this situation. If your pH is around 7 then you should have plenty of room to lower it.

 

[Biosystem]

I think this is a good lead. I have been doing reading, and I've decided I'll be adding very controlled doses of boron (as small of an amount of borax as I can possibly measure - perhaps 0.01-0.1g), Epsom salt, calcium supplementation, a small amount of P&K fert and pH'd down to about 6. I'll also be moving PPFD down to 600 since photoperiod is 24/7 and maybe too much light is having deleterious effects on these girls when combined with these other issues. We'll see what happens with them, but I expect a recovery from this. Small doses will be used since less is more for all of these problems.

I have 1 week before I am scheduled to bloom them, and I don't want to be behind even though so will postpone if need be. Worst case scenario, they're just bigger plants.

 

[Biosystem]

Some clearer photos of the weird shit they're doing right now. The old leaves are nice. PPFD is at like 600.

 

[Biosystem]

Since P and K are both mobile nutrients, I usually see deficiencies start at the lower, older leaves and work their way up. Issues that are affecting the newest leaves could be something else like lighting, immobile nutrient deficiency, or ph.

Brother, I think you're right. I think it's the damn lighting, and that I'm just not used to seeing light issues on plants this large because I have usually flowered before this point. They're on 24/7 photo right now, and have been at 700-750 PPFD, but I guess that was too much. Maybe it's my imagination but even after about a day with 100-150 less PPFD, they look nicer.

Also, one of the tops I knocked over for LST is choosing to stay sideways.
Also, the new growth ON LOWER BRANCHES looks perfectly fine.

 

[Biosystem]

Sulfur deficiency - clawing leaves, no brown tips, tips are turning yellow, veins are sharply darker.

Seem familiar? I hit them with a good bit of Epsom salt. I think that's going to do them well, and if so I'll have to make less assumption that Epsom salt can be skipped for long.

 

[gedLang]

@KIS maybe you have some thoughts about what sort of problem these living soil plants have?

 

[Biosystem]

WEEK 0 OF BLOOM
Mixed Seed (Event Horizon, Holy Grail Kush, Franco's Lemon Cheese, Liberty Haze)

I can't wait to flip them anymore - the vegging plants will be picking up too much steam soon once they get their roots under them in the repot I did recently out of necessity. Not only this, but they do appear a fair bit better after heavy application of Epsom salt pH'd to 6 and a reduction of light. I'm going to let them adjust to flowering timing and start praying for light before I increase intensity past what it is now, which is about 600 PPFD, going from 24/7 to 11/13. Very excited to see how rapid this flip is on these plants and to see how they do in bloom.

Pruned my Zamaldelica mother plant heavily as well. I think that's been a big factor in my failures with previous mother plants. I let them grow too large to easily manage on a back burner, so this time I'm pruning her like I hate her. I think she'll be a cute little bush before long. Something I can bonsai branches with. (Pic of her is post pruning).

 

[KIS]

@KIS maybe you have some thoughts about what sort of problem these living soil plants have?

Without more information I would guess this is a watering issue, but getting a runoff test of pH and EC would be useful too. These plants could use a solid trimming and I personally would have spaced them a bit further apart or reduced numbers based on how large they are relative to the container (for living soil).

 

[Biosystem]

Without more information I would guess this is a watering issue, but getting a runoff test of pH and EC would be useful too. These plants could use a solid trimming and I personally would have spaced them a bit further apart or reduced numbers based on how large they are relative to the container (for living soil).

Fair point on the spacing. They weren't supposed to be this big before flowering. Things got out of hand.

The only things left to really trim are fan leaves towards the lower parts of the branches. What's y'all's experience on taking the fan leaves off pre, early or late flower? They all go eventually, but some say it's worth it for light pen and air flow. I have found light penetration is worth it and usually drop the fan leaves around this time.


I can't get an EC measure unfortunately, but I can try to get a decent runoff pH using soil in a cup and lightly watering with a hole in the bottom, collecting, sieving and using a liquid test.

 

[gedLang]

I use the slurry method for testing pH, which I find to be consistent. I also test EC this way with a cheap EC meter.

The Ultimate Soil pH Testing Guide

This all-encompassing guide will help anyone who is just starting out with soil pH testing. (And experienced growers will be able to learn something, too!)

blog.hannainst.com

 

[Biosystem]

WEEK 1 OF FLOWER
Mixed Seed

Goin' okay. Way too busy with other things, but checking in on these gals.

Got final weight for last crop by the way. 247g. I wish I had vegged those ones more. If this crop doesn't yield too well either, I will want to experiment with other pruning methods to see about maximizing yield. These current plants are plenty large, so yield should be better. They're different strains, but I ought to homogenize my pruning for each crop and plant moving forward after figuring out the "best" way for my set up.

Anyway, this current crop should start stretching and showing pistils soon, so that's exciting. They're all looking a lot better on the new growth, and I'll be stoked to watch them grow. I don't have much time for them lately, but now that they're all set for flowering, it's basically just watering and bumping up light intensity of necessary.

The next vegging group is doing alright. They are about to dry out and will get fertilized the next watering.

 

[Biosystem]

WEEK 2 OF FLOWER (11/13)
Mixed Seed

Run. Ragged.

 

[Biosystem]

WEEK 4 OF FLOWER
Mixed Seed

Going well. Flowering quickly. Still too busy for them.

 

[OpenPollenSeeds]

nvm