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First Man Arrested With Drone Evidence Vows to Fight Case

LazLo

Member
Court must decide if police are allowed to use drones to help make arrests
By Jason Koebler
April 9, 2012

The tiny town of Lakota, N.D., is quickly becoming a key testing ground for the legality of the use of unmanned drones by law enforcement after one of its residents became the first American citizen to be arrested with the help of a Predator surveillance drone.

The bizarre case started when six cows wandered onto Rodney Brossart's 3,000 acre farm. Brossart, an alleged anti-government "sovereignist," believed he should have been able to keep the cows, so he and two family members chased police off his land with high powered rifles.

After a 16-hour standoff, the Grand Forks police department SWAT team, armed with a search warrant, used an agreement they've had with Homeland Security for about three years, and called in an unmanned aerial vehicle to pinpoint Brossart's location on the ranch. The SWAT team stormed in and arrested Brossart on charges of terrorizing a sheriff, theft, criminal mischief, and other charges, according to documents.

Brossart says he "had no clue" they used a drone during the standoff until months after his arrest.

"We're not laying over here playing dead on it," says Brossart, who is scheduled to appear in court on April 30. He believes what the SWAT team did was "definitely" illegal.

"We're dealing with it, we've got a couple different motions happening in court fighting [the drone use]."

Repeated calls to Brossart's attorney were not returned. Douglas Manbeck, who is representing the state of North Dakota in the case, says the drone was used after warrants were already issued.

"The alleged crimes were already committed long before a drone was even thought of being used," he says. "It was only used to help assure there weren't weapons and to make [the arrest] safer for both the Brossarts and law enforcement."

"I know it's a touchy subject for anyone to feel that drones are in the air watching them, but I don't think there was any misuse in this case," he added.

While there's no precedent for the use of unmanned drones by law enforcement, John Villasenor, an expert on information gathering and drone use with the Washington, D.C.-based Brookings Institution, says he'd be "floored" if the court throws the case out. Using a drone is no different than using a helicopter, he says.

"It may have been the first time a drone was used to make an arrest, but it's certainly not going to be the last," Villasenor says. "I would be very surprised if someone were able to successfully launch a legal challenge [in Brossart's case]."

Villasenor points to two Supreme Court cases—California v. Ciraolo in 1986 and Florida v. Riley in 1989— that allow law enforcement to use "public navigable airspace, in a physically nonintrusive manner" to gather evidence to make an arrest.

By summertime, there may be many more cases like Brossart's—on May 14, the government must begin issuing permits for drone use by law enforcement.

Currently, about 300 law enforcement agencies and research institutions—including the Grand Forks SWAT team—have "temporary licenses" from the FAA to use drones. Currently, drones are most commonly used by Homeland Security along America's borders.

Bill Macki, head of the Grand Forks SWAT team, says Brossart's case was the first and only time they've used a drone to help make an arrest—they tried one other time (to search for an armed, suicidal individual), but gusty weather conditions made navigation impossible.

With a population of less than 70,000, it doesn't make sense for the Grand Forks police department to own a helicopter, but the ability to call in a drone when necessary can provide a similar purpose.

"The terrain we were working with was very large and agricultural—several hundred acres of very flat farmland made it difficult to set up a perimeter to ensure people didn't make it off the property," he says. "I think drones are definitely a useful tool, their effectiveness in rural operations is exceptional, they keep tactical operations as safe as possible."

Macki is confident his team is trained to legally use drones.

"We've had a relationship with Predator operations for three years, we've provided training for them and received training on the basic capabilities of the predator," he says. "We've established a relationship with [Homeland Security]. Through that relationship, we've learned drones' capabilities and when we can or cannot use a drone."
 

Harry Gypsna

Dirty hippy Bastard
Veteran
Remember the Jessica Alba show Dark angel...remember those hover drones.... coming soon to a police force near you.
 

rootfingers

Active member
As much as I don't like drones being used for general surveillance and evidence collecting, in this case, it seems, like the cops already had evidence enough to make an arrest and were using the capabilities of the drone in a proper way. And seriously, the ranch owner, sounds like a total dickhead.
 

Maj.PotHead

End Cannibis Prohibition Now Realize Legalize !!
Mentor
Veteran
As much as I don't like drones being used for general surveillance and evidence collecting, in this case, it seems, like the cops already had evidence enough to make an arrest and were using the capabilities of the drone in a proper way. And seriously, the ranch owner, sounds like a total dickhead.

wow chalk one up for the cops eh


{As much as I don't like drones being used for general surveillance}
{were using the capabilities of the drone in a proper way}
a little contradiction of yourself there eh
 

rootfingers

Active member
I don't think my statement is contradictory at all. In this case, the drone was not being used for general surveillance. The police already had reason to be there and then, after 16 hours of armed standoff, used the drone to locate the people on the ranch so they could make a safe arrest. Seems actually, like the drone was used very appropriately.
 

resinryder

Rubbing my glands together
Veteran
With the advanced infrared tech these drones have privacy is a thing of the past. But then again if you're not doing anything wrong why would you have anything to worry about? Right?
Sounds like things are only gonna get worse.
Dept Homeland Security=Dept of Domestic Spying
 

HUGE

Active member
Veteran
As much as I don't like drones being used for general surveillance and evidence collecting, in this case, it seems, like the cops already had evidence enough to make an arrest and were using the capabilities of the drone in a proper way. And seriously, the ranch owner, sounds like a total dickhead.

Why is he a dickhead? I'm all for everything he did. Cops shouldn't trespass.
 

Growcephus

Member
Veteran
With the advanced infrared tech these drones have privacy is a thing of the past. But then again if you're not doing anything wrong why would you have anything to worry about? Right?
Sounds like things are only gonna get worse.
Dept Homeland Security=Dept of Domestic Spying


Not true.

ANY technology can be defeated if an individual truly wants to maintain privacy. However, most are unwilling to take the necessary measures to defeat technology, or they are simply unaware of what they need to do to maintain privacy.

A drone is just a platform. There isn't anything that can be mounted on a drone that hasn't already been mounted, and used, on a plane, a helicopter, or a wheeled vehicle.

When it comes down to it, the biggest threat to privacy is NOT technology, but the human associates of the individual/s that want to protect their privacy.

You don't have to trust a piece of equipment. Either it works, or it doesn't, and you get instant feedback. A human, on the other hand, requires trust, and you can never be sure of that trust, or that your privacy is actually being safeguarded, until it is too late.
 

CannaBunkerMan

Enormous Member
Veteran
Remember the Jessica Alba show Dark angel...remember those hover drones.... coming soon to a police force near you.

SO hot, anyway, they kind of look like the "flying keg" drone that came out a few years ago. Either that, or a giant roomba.

Dark Angel drone:
dark-angel-drone.jpg


Flying Keg Drone:
3-26-08-honeywell-drone.jpg
 

OrganicBuds

Active member
Veteran
I am going to start walking around in my back yard naked, that way they wont want to record my area again!
 

PoopyTeaBags

State Liscensed Care Giver/Patient, Assistant Trai
Veteran
As much as I don't like drones being used for general surveillance and evidence collecting, in this case, it seems, like the cops already had evidence enough to make an arrest and were using the capabilities of the drone in a proper way. And seriously, the ranch owner, sounds like a total dickhead.


that kind of thinking right there is why we NO LONGER have ANY rights... stand up for the shit. its not aloud in any situation. once used in ANY situation they'll be used in ALL situations... keep your freedoms stop handing them over.
 

MadBuddhaAbuser

Kush, Sour Diesel, Puday boys
Veteran
Ill be following this closely, the most important case involving privacy going. If he loses, expect mj busts to at least double starting may 16.

And seriously you must be broke in the head if you think we need million dollar drones to combat six wandering cows. Or you think the gov wont be using this to bust every grow they can find. They make more from fines than they would from legalizing and taxing it.

I'm becoming more of a fan of this family every day.
 

Yes4Prop215

Active member
Veteran
i already knew this was gonna happen.....if the wars in the middle east end thousands of drones will come back to the homeland to spy on us. if americans rise up against their illegal government they will use drones to sort out the freedom fighters..
 

OrganicBuds

Active member
Veteran
i already knew this was gonna happen.....if the wars in the middle east end thousands of drones will come back to the homeland to spy on us. if americans rise up against their illegal government they will use drones to sort out the freedom fighters..

Yup, 2012 is going to be a year for the record books!
 

pearlemae

May your race always be in your favor
Veteran
first up the guy in N.Dakota being a "sovereignist whack job" The cops used a drone to locate the guy rather than walk into an ambush. As for looking for weed etc, I think that probable cause is still going to be needed. BUT the right will make it worse than the left if they are in charge, after all the right brought us that wonder document the PATRIOT ACT nuff said.
 

HUGE

Active member
Veteran
first up the guy in N.Dakota being a "sovereignist whack job" The cops used a drone to locate the guy rather than walk into an ambush. As for looking for weed etc, I think that probable cause is still going to be needed. BUT the right will make it worse than the left if they are in charge, after all the right brought us that wonder document the PATRIOT ACT nuff said.

Jesus man wake up. We are all sovereign. That's what a republic is. What this guy did was take care of himself and tell the nanny state to piss off. That makes him a hero not a whack job. The fact that you are unaware of your own sovererignty and actually think there is a left and right tells me you have already lost. The sleeper must awaken.
 

Mrgrowem

Active member
Why not put up antidrones of your own ? Arm your drones and have a drone war ? This sounds like it could be fun. If they can arm their drones, which they soon will, then just arm your drone. Or create wolf packs of drones that destroy government drones. In the beginning must of the government drones will be unarmed and sitting ducks for air to air fighting. Oh well, I'm sure some of you get the idea ?
 

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