I have videos too, I'll see if I can figure out the best way to post them.
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Dud Identification Collective Knowledge.
- Thread starter high life 45
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High life I am not trying to be a smart ass but didn't I read somewhere that u burnt your plants up or put them under extreme heat or water? IMO that could make nodes fall off and create what would look like a witches broom with extreme heat.
I am not saying this is what you did or claiming this is what was wrong with your plant I am just asking just because I rememeber some other member talking about either your plant which I am almost positive or someone else that did it to there GG#4 duds
I am not saying this is what you did or claiming this is what was wrong with your plant I am just asking just because I rememeber some other member talking about either your plant which I am almost positive or someone else that did it to there GG#4 duds
The videos... the second one shows them better.
The first video is when I first noticed them today. I guess you just gotta choose the sickest most diseased portion of stem to find a lot of them. I'm sure there were thousands upon thousands on that 1" section of diseased stem.
Last 30 seconds of the first video also shows a buncha them. I think I zoomed in for the second video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jj3m_lOzak
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfJfMgmIiTs
The first video is when I first noticed them today. I guess you just gotta choose the sickest most diseased portion of stem to find a lot of them. I'm sure there were thousands upon thousands on that 1" section of diseased stem.
Last 30 seconds of the first video also shows a buncha them. I think I zoomed in for the second video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jj3m_lOzak
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfJfMgmIiTs
That's a crazy video whatthe215. Wow U must have a really nice setup for magnifying these little nasty bastards good work.
Yes all of the above will make roots as well as Callus roots easy as well, I never made roots on single cell cultures but yes on anything bigger. Dark seems to help, as you have seen with broken branches they root more from the side touching the ground.
-SamS
Pretty sick yet cool, What power magnification did you use for the photos and the video?
One question did the plant look all DUD?
I think plants can have them and not show symptom's, maybe some plant varieties are much more resistant?
Are you sure it is not BM or Phytoplasma's?
Just joking.....
Well, at least 2 sources of Cannabis DUD's are confirmed now, BM & Nematodes. We will find more, like Bacterial and Fungus.
If you read my post #1300 it and the link gives better ways to find Stem Nematodes, but just on seeds, I bet if you made a bunch of small thin slices of the suspect plant stems the same method in water would work as on the outside of seeds. Someone should try!!
And let us all know.
One thing is for sure you need good eyes and a strong microscope to grow Cannabis today!
Thanks for the photo's and Video, priceless...
-SamS
Methods of killing nematodes:
Formaldehyde is routinely used in hot water treatment for the control of narcissus basal rot (caused by Fusarium oxysporum f. sp. narcissi) and stem and bulb eelworm (Ditylenchus dipsaci).
http://www.academia.edu/5689069/A_C...ospores_of_Fusarium_oxysporum_f._sp._narcissi
So are the fusarium a secondary infection, entering the wounds caused by Ditylenchus dipsaci?
And, might a formaldehyde (formalin) drench kill them?
Someone needs to try it, but I wouldn't go over 1%.
Same thing with hydrogen peroxide.
Heat Treatment
http://books.google.com/books?id=LT...ydrogen peroxide, Ditylenchus dipsaci&f=false
The use of microwave radiation for treatment of soil against nematodes has been demonstrated. Nuke your medium, no more nematodes.
Steam has also been used to control nematodes, as have solar radiation. All are explained in previous link, which is a book called: Plant Nematology: , 2nd Edition.
Can't copy & paste from that link, hence the capture of "HeatTreatment" section.
Peracetic/peroxyacetic acid (Hydrogen Peroxide)
http://www.ces.uoguelph.ca/water/PATHOGEN/PeroxyaceticAcid.pdf
Safety concerns and handling information:
Concentrated hydrogen peroxide should not be mixed with any pesticides or fertilizers, due to its nature
as a strong oxidizer (Fisher, 2011). It may also eventually cause breakdown of plastic greenhouse
structures via oxidation
(Stewart
-
Wade, 2011).
Due to its low pH, concentrated peroxyacetic acid is
corrosive (Fisher, 2011), and proper safety measures must be taken when handling.
Peroxyacetic acid tends to break down fairly quickly and as such,poses no danger to the environment.
(EPA, 2002).
Critical levels for pathogens
The optimum hydrogen peroxide level to treat common plant pathogens is
100 to 135 ppm (Fisher,
2011).
Refer to the below table for a list of critical levels for different pathogens.
As peroxyacetic acid disinfectants contain both hydrogen peroxide and peroxyacetic acid as active ingredients,levels of both compounds at the critical dose are reported where possible.
Microorganism Pathogen Propagule Critical Level (ppm) Contact Time (min)
Acidovorax avenae Bacteria PA: 80 (55% incidence reduction) Daily application
Ditylenchus dipsaci Nematode 100 HP, 25 PA 120 Minutes
(Hanks and
Linfield, 1999)
Fusarium foetens Spores 135ppm HP + 10ppm PA Or 37ppm HP + 24ppm PA 15 Minutes
Depending on product
Fusarium oxysporum Chlamidospores 135 HP, 10 PA (80% Decrease) 30 Minutes
Formaldehyde is routinely used in hot water treatment for the control of narcissus basal rot (caused by Fusarium oxysporum f. sp. narcissi) and stem and bulb eelworm (Ditylenchus dipsaci).
http://www.academia.edu/5689069/A_C...ospores_of_Fusarium_oxysporum_f._sp._narcissi
So are the fusarium a secondary infection, entering the wounds caused by Ditylenchus dipsaci?
And, might a formaldehyde (formalin) drench kill them?
Someone needs to try it, but I wouldn't go over 1%.
Same thing with hydrogen peroxide.
Heat Treatment
http://books.google.com/books?id=LT...ydrogen peroxide, Ditylenchus dipsaci&f=false
The use of microwave radiation for treatment of soil against nematodes has been demonstrated. Nuke your medium, no more nematodes.
Steam has also been used to control nematodes, as have solar radiation. All are explained in previous link, which is a book called: Plant Nematology: , 2nd Edition.
Can't copy & paste from that link, hence the capture of "HeatTreatment" section.
Peracetic/peroxyacetic acid (Hydrogen Peroxide)
http://www.ces.uoguelph.ca/water/PATHOGEN/PeroxyaceticAcid.pdf
Safety concerns and handling information:
Concentrated hydrogen peroxide should not be mixed with any pesticides or fertilizers, due to its nature
as a strong oxidizer (Fisher, 2011). It may also eventually cause breakdown of plastic greenhouse
structures via oxidation
(Stewart
-
Wade, 2011).
Due to its low pH, concentrated peroxyacetic acid is
corrosive (Fisher, 2011), and proper safety measures must be taken when handling.
Peroxyacetic acid tends to break down fairly quickly and as such,poses no danger to the environment.
(EPA, 2002).
Critical levels for pathogens
The optimum hydrogen peroxide level to treat common plant pathogens is
100 to 135 ppm (Fisher,
2011).
Refer to the below table for a list of critical levels for different pathogens.
As peroxyacetic acid disinfectants contain both hydrogen peroxide and peroxyacetic acid as active ingredients,levels of both compounds at the critical dose are reported where possible.
Microorganism Pathogen Propagule Critical Level (ppm) Contact Time (min)
Acidovorax avenae Bacteria PA: 80 (55% incidence reduction) Daily application
Ditylenchus dipsaci Nematode 100 HP, 25 PA 120 Minutes
(Hanks and
Linfield, 1999)
Fusarium foetens Spores 135ppm HP + 10ppm PA Or 37ppm HP + 24ppm PA 15 Minutes
Depending on product
Fusarium oxysporum Chlamidospores 135 HP, 10 PA (80% Decrease) 30 Minutes
mad props bro. you are fucking awesome for posting those. if you get a chance id love to see pics of your mic set up. what brand set up is it. is it a trinocular. are you viewing while recording?
no it's a chinese made mono with 10MP camera. Amscope makes both.. MU1000 camera. $400
the camera lags just a bit, and flares sometimes while adjusting for brightness but it works well enough.
i just view it through the computer while recording. usb and supplied software.
thanks!
whats the model on the scope?
whats the model on the scope?
No offense taken bro, I did a heat treatment but not with hot water. You can invite the other member here to clear up the confusion..
I do vert lighting barebulb and just lower my lights and turn off the ac, and air exchange fans. Then I take a laser thermometer and check leaf temps and floor temps. There was one branch that was close to a bulb, and wilted away. But all 4 of my gg4s showed this problem. It not that the nodes fell off, the nodes never grew to start with.
If you look carefully at the pics I posted at the start and the last page you can see what I am talking about... Again the big old trees also got a heat treatment and never showed a problem. I had bms at a different location and just heat treated everything everywhere I grow. I find it more effective, safer and easier for me than using cides.
Nice video and pics what the 215, brought us right back on track.
Also thanks to everyone else who confirmed the same root growths on healthy plants....was starting to get a lil noid.
No problem highlife45 just wanted to hear your side that is all it was a while ago and I mean obvious it's not the issues going on with your dud.
On another note could u possibly get these dirty little nematodes from say a dirty kept Rez? Or maybe even in a bottle of nutrients?
For example sunset kept a dirty Rez and ran his coco and hydro off this same Rez and watered his plants wouldn't this infect everything? Ez cloner kept dirty and not properly cleaned?
What about some nutrient company bottling these things up in there product not on purpose ofcourse(don't want to act like it's a conspiracy).
For example sunset kept a dirty Rez and ran his coco and hydro off this same Rez and watered his plants wouldn't this infect everything? Ez cloner kept dirty and not properly cleaned?
What about some nutrient company bottling these things up in there product not on purpose ofcourse(don't want to act like it's a conspiracy).
http://ip144.qb.fcen.uba.ar/librosl...lant Disease Handbook 7e (Springer, 2008).pdf
Best Reading Ive come across in a long time.... Very Good Information to Bookmark to your favorites...
1,000+ Pages
Westcott's Plant Disease Handbook 7th edition
Best Reading Ive come across in a long time.... Very Good Information to Bookmark to your favorites...
1,000+ Pages
Westcott's Plant Disease Handbook 7th edition
hey Mike, I gave the hot water treatment a shot. The target temp with water is 110 degrees, and I ran into issues at 112-113. The nodes didn't fall off but the plants died over 7-10 days. It was a first attempt with this method and obviously more control was needed. Like the hot air treatments it takes a few before you really know what your doing. Water temps are cooler towards the surface, and of course with air it's the opposite.
a mechanized stirring implement would probably be helpful. im thinking a mounted drill with a paint stirring attachment.
and a barbque thermometer with a remote wall mounted digital display for ease of monitoring as youre dipping. hands free for the handling of plants.
warriorscholar
New member
Seed banks affected by this as well? I was doing research on what the best companies were( and strains), but after reading this thread I feel like I now need to know what peoples experiences were with some of the top companies . Nirvana, Barney's farm, bomb, etc..etc. And if there's a difference in feminized or regular in how easily affected.
Hate the fact I even have to look into this( always got clones) but after latest grow I can't trust that route anymore.
Having to start over 3 times now, can't afford to do it anymore. Glad I came across these threads( found the broadmites one a month back and sure enough exactly the same probs I've been having) and I'm going to take the precautionary measures needed from now on, but just trying to figure out what route to take next.
Never grown from seed, so if I'm going to go that route I want to make sure if there's any companies I should stay away from. Last thing I need is to choose the tougher route and end up with the same issue. The guy I've been getting clones from for 3 years for sure has this problem and he has no clue. And he's constantly cross breeding, creating new strains. I can't believe how many people have this yet continue to grow , accepting the much lower yields. Last thing I wanted to do was start over again, but I know the potential and will not accept less.
So house will be empty until I figure this out, chose to do that instead of treating the plants with what some of you suggest(will do that when it inevitably comes back) because it's gone on for too long and I didn't trust the strains anymore. And now I'm looking into seeds since I probably can't trust any other clones around here either(Michigan ). I know exactly what to look for, I've done more studying this past month than my years of school combined. It's a must I at least start off with a disease free clone/seed before battling this shit from here on out.
I'll leave it at that, any suggestions/experiences much appreciated.
Hate the fact I even have to look into this( always got clones) but after latest grow I can't trust that route anymore.
Having to start over 3 times now, can't afford to do it anymore. Glad I came across these threads( found the broadmites one a month back and sure enough exactly the same probs I've been having) and I'm going to take the precautionary measures needed from now on, but just trying to figure out what route to take next.
Never grown from seed, so if I'm going to go that route I want to make sure if there's any companies I should stay away from. Last thing I need is to choose the tougher route and end up with the same issue. The guy I've been getting clones from for 3 years for sure has this problem and he has no clue. And he's constantly cross breeding, creating new strains. I can't believe how many people have this yet continue to grow , accepting the much lower yields. Last thing I wanted to do was start over again, but I know the potential and will not accept less.
So house will be empty until I figure this out, chose to do that instead of treating the plants with what some of you suggest(will do that when it inevitably comes back) because it's gone on for too long and I didn't trust the strains anymore. And now I'm looking into seeds since I probably can't trust any other clones around here either(Michigan ). I know exactly what to look for, I've done more studying this past month than my years of school combined. It's a must I at least start off with a disease free clone/seed before battling this shit from here on out.
I'll leave it at that, any suggestions/experiences much appreciated.
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