Droopy leaves, serrated tips pointing up, dry leaf texture

[BusinessFactory]

-2nd round of 15 gallon no-till pots w/ coots mix
-Blumats maxi carrots for auto-watering with tap water
-COBs at least 18" inches away
-Temp range about 66F to 78F in night vs day.
-rH dropped to 20-30% for a week and a half near when issues started, since then I have been keeping it at 50%+

Originally I figured this was just a humidity / VPD issues but since raising the humidity for 5ish days I have not seen a noticeable improvement.

I top dressed at the start of this grow and I highly doubt there is not enough nutrition in the soil. I also gave them an aact at the start of this round.

I have been told it's over watering but the leaves literally feel rough and dry compared to healthy plants I've grown in the past.

I have also noticed that they are droopier in the morning, perk up most of the day and then start drooping again around lights out (18/6). Maybe that is normal, I've never paid that much attention to it.

Too much light perhaps? I have 400w of COBs in a 11 sq ft tent.

Any help would be appreciated, I'm starting to fear I won't be able to solve this! The first two pictures are in the evening (a little perkier) and the third pic is the next morning.

 

[MostlyMe]

It looks fine to me to be honest. Maybe try a little less water and a foliar spray. The drooping at lights out is normal.

 

[BusinessFactory]

I actually gave them a Agsil 16h, (light) neem, aloe foliar last night. These pics were from 2 days ago though. Didn't notice much improvement.

I think my next step is shut off the blumats, give them another aact (or just plain water) by hand and let them dry out. That would at least tell me if it's a watering / bluemat issue or something else.

 

[JohnKimble]

Not sure, still deciding on this. But I get an intuition, drooping leaves means wrong ph in the soil or it can mean the classic overwatering ( Not enough fresh oxygen around roots). Reason I think this is becuase many times I seen the drooping, so I did a flush and runoff was acidic, after the flush watering them again with ph 6.0 and full nutes, next day they are praying. Also with drooping leaves, the first defiency I usually seen is nitrogen, the leaves start going lime green, then light green, then yellow. The nutrient chart does say that N becomes less available when the soil is acidic. It does make sense also the leaves would wanna drop to reduce photosynthesis if there is less nitrogen becuase nitrogen is vital part of photosynthesis..

 

[DONAJTHEIII]

It looks fine to me to be honest. Maybe try a little less water and a foliar spray. The drooping at lights out is normal.

definitely not fine which is why he posted here my man.



TBH ive ran blumats an i dont have the results people have here I went back to drippers with runoff and wont be changing anytime soon. I think runoff is essential and I also do check runoff.... it should read whats being poured in when using a soilless mix which im guessing is coots mix ?



You messed up by putting them in 15 gals.

I wouldnt go over 3 in a soilless mix ever.


Im in 1 gals right now and there 3-4ft DTW.

the blumat with 15 gals are a bad combo its too big of a pot and there constantly staying moist the roots arent having the dry sessions it needs to fill that pots size. I dont think they will unless you plan on veggin 4 months. next time smaller smart pots and youll be happy. if this is a soil mix your not letting it get dry sessions that it needs i dont think soil does the best when moist/wet like coco you need the dry out sessions especially since you used such a big pot.

 

[BusinessFactory]

Not sure, still deciding on this. But I get an intuition, drooping leaves means wrong ph in the soil or it can mean the classic overwatering. Reason I think this is becuase many times I seen the drooping, so I did a flush and runoff was acidic, after the flush watering them again with ph 6.0 and full nutes, next day they are praying. Also with drooping leaves, the first defiency I usually seen is nitrogen, the leaves start going lime green, then light green, then yellow. The nutrient chart does say that N becomes less available when the soil is acidic. It does make sense also the leaves would wanna drop to reduce photosynthesis if there is less nitrogen becuase nitrogen is vital part of photosynthesis..

This all great info, thanks for your time!

I'm leaning towards pH as well. My tap comes out at 8ish (Denver tap) so it would be weird if it was acidic but that's exactly what I have seen in the past. I just top dressed with some gypsum and oyster shell flour which I was planning on doing anyways this round. Hopefully the OSF really helps buffer the pH if it is the problem. I am also going to do the aact and watch it dry out with the blumats out of the equation. Hopefully I get some answers and see em pray!

 

[growingcrazy]

Have you done a foliar with magnesium? If not, some epsom salts and a little less watering and you should be fine.

EDIT: I don't see what strain you are running listed. Is it known to be a cal/mag hog?

 

[BusinessFactory]

Maybe I'll hit them with an epsom foliar.. what dosage for 1 gallon? A tsp?

There are two flo in one tent and a tangerine dream in the other. The TD is looking the best but it's also more humid in there. Not really sure... compost tea didn't show much change.

 

[JohnKimble]

My tap comes out at 8ish (Denver tap) so it would be weird if it was acidic but that's exactly what I have seen in the past.

The fertizliers itself is acidic by nature. 1 tsp of maxibloom makes my 7ph water to straight to 6.0. All it takes is some salt build up in your medium and your soil ph will start going down.

 

[BusinessFactory]

Just picked this today, what do you think?

 

[DONAJTHEIII]

Just picked this today, what do you think?

not really seeing a cal or mg def.


more seeing a phosphorus.


Either way I dont know soil amazingly well but I would def give it a feed with some sort of fertilizer if you too believe it lacks nutrition.


Not seeing a burn either. So i do agree based on the most recent photo is that shes hungry or somethings funky with nutrient uptake.

 

[BusinessFactory]

not really seeing a cal or mg def.


more seeing a phosphorus.


Either way I dont know soil amazingly well but I would def give it a feed with some sort of fertilizer if you too believe it lacks nutrition.


Not seeing a burn either. So i do agree based on the most recent photo is that shes hungry or somethings funky with nutrient uptake.

I do plain water only so the nutrition should be in the soil already. I also hit it with a compost tea so that should help make the amendments more available if that really was the problem.

Even though you shouldn't need to pH water with organic growing...I am leaning more and more towards that. Guess I'll make sure my water pH is on point the next couple weeks and see what happens.

Frustrating

 

[MileHighGlass]

Are you using composting worms, pill bugs, rove beetles, hypoaspis miles or any other critters in your soil? Just wondering if you are only relying on microbes to breakdown your amendments.

 

[BusinessFactory]

I have red wigglers, pot worms, springtails at least. Lots of movement under the mulch. Haven't seen anything on the leaves though.

 

[marrdogg]

Not an organic grower but think I just read that op uses tap in a no till living organic soil that has aact added from time to time. You have your system on drippers straight from tap? That not good for organics no? Please correct me if I'm wrong.
PEACE!

 

[BusinessFactory]

I use tap yes, but I leave the water out a day before adding it to the reservoir. The res also has a pump for circulation and aeration. I've checked my water report (Denver) and there is no chloramine, only chlorine and that should gas off quickly.

pH from the tap can be as high as 8.5 it seems. My soil should be full of life and able to buffer that.. but maybe not?

 

[marrdogg]

Chlorine is not killing your micro herd? Do you let sit to dissipate chlorine? If in organics you rely on micro herd to break down nutrient to make them accessible to the plant aren't you essentially making it harder for your plants to do this if your killing the little guys there to help? Would that not give you deficiencies seeing how the plant can't "eat" what's in soil? Wouldn't that make you "over feed" if you kept top dressing more and more food? Like said not an organic grower but want to go that way in near future so I too am looking for answers to how this shit works.
PEACE!

 

[marrdogg]

Just read ya post up above about your water.

 

[marrdogg]

Have you done a slurry test to try and get an actual ph of the soil?

 

[BusinessFactory]

Nope but I ordered a $16 soil pH tester from amazon. Should have it tomorrow. As long as it can give me an idea of if my soil is acidic or alkaline, it will be worth it.

How do you do the slurry test?