DIY LED CXB3590 2700K 32VDC X 6 (grow light)

[acespicoli]

DIY LED CXB3590 2700K *36*VDC X 6 (grow light)
I was looking for some community support
Q&A for the DIY construction and use of High Power LED,
the one im building just happens to be
CXB3590 2700K 36VDC X 6

History
I used two (2) Area 51 RW-150 LED Grow Light for the last 2 years
Now im trying to upgrade to a dedicated flowering light.

Area 51 RW-150 LED Grow Light Review

If you’re looking for the holy grail of high-end led grow lights, Area 51 is a company that’s worth looking into. One of their latest releases, the RW-150 grow light panel utilizes all of the most recent technology to produce some of the most impressive yields, all while using the least amount...

ledgrowlightguide.com

I want to continue to use the,(2) Area 51 RW-150 LED Grow Lights,
just for vegetative growth in a separate location.

The first question I had was what
COB (chip on board) LED (light emitting diode)
I wanted to select for this purpose and why?


Three (3) letter acronyms are terrible when people try to learn?


Please use caution
You requested clarification of OSHA's electrical guarding standard at 29 CFR 1910.303(g)(2)(i).

Question 1: Does the electrical guarding requirement at 29 CFR 1910.303(g)(2)(i) apply to voltages below 60 volts DC?

Response: The provision in question, 29 CFR 1910.303(g)(2)(i), generally requires "live parts of electric equipment operating at 50 volts or more" to be "guarded against accidental contact by use of approved cabinets or other forms of approved enclosures" or by other specified means. The guarding requirement does not distinguish between AC and DC voltages. Therefore, the requirement applies to live parts operating at 50 volts or more AC or DC.

 

[acespicoli]

So to select my light source I looked into Photosynthesis

Not all wavelengths of light can support photosynthesis.
The photosynthetic action spectrum depends on the type of accessory pigments present.
For example, in green plants, the action spectrum resembles the absorption spectrum for
chlorophylls and carotenoids with peaks for violet-blue and red light.


So now I knew the peaks at 440nm and 660nm so what is nm (nanometers )
How do I convert to kelvin?
I was looking for it in kelvin units so I decided from the chart below I wanted 2700K (Kelvin)

 

[acespicoli]

The measure of photochemical efficiency
is made by meauring the amount of oxygen produced by
leaves following exposure to various wavelengths.

It is evident that only the red and blue ends of the visible part of the electromagnetic spectrum
are used by plants in photosynthesis.
The reflection and transmission of the middle of the spectrum
gives the leaves their green visual color.

You may have noticed in the image above,
Photosynthetically active radiation, often abbreviated PAR,
designates the spectral range (wave band) of solar radiation from 400 to 700 nanometers that
photosynthetic organisms are able to use in the process of photosynthesis.

That's enough science for now!

 

[acespicoli]

Here is the LED (light emitting diode)
Anyone else have any ideas about needing to add blue light with the red light?


CXB3590 2700K 36VDC

 

[acespicoli]

Chlorophyll a is a specific form of chlorophyll used in oxygenic photosynthesis.
It absorbs most energy from wavelengths of violet-blue and orange-red light.
It also reflects green/yellow light, and as such contributes to the observed green color of most plants.

Chlorophyll b is a form of chlorophyll.
Chlorophyll b helps in photosynthesis by absorbing light energy.
It is more soluble than chlorophyll a in polar solvents because of its carbonyl group.
Its color is yellow, and it primarily absorbs blue light.

 

[acespicoli]

Chlorophyll A is sensitive to spectral peaks at 430nm and 660nm while chlorophyll B is sensitive to spectral peaks at 460nm and 630nm

This equation is called Wien's law (simplified KISS) convert nm <> K
446 nm (nanometers)= 2,897,768 / 6500 K (kelvin)

So should I also have 6500K in a flowering room? on 12/12hr (hour) cycle?

 

[OranguTrump]

Covering all the bases here. I'm curious to see where this goes.

Sub'd

 

[acespicoli]

Ordinary sunlight is composed of a spectrum of colors that grade from violets and blues at one end to oranges and reds on the other.
The wavelengths in this spectrum range from .47 um for violet to .64 um for red.
Air molecules are much smaller than this --- about a thousand times smaller. Thus, air is a good Rayleigh scatterer.
But because air molecules are slightly closer in size to the wavelength of violet light than to that of red light,
pure air scatters violet light three to four times more effectively than it does the longer wavelengths.

Based on the image above it seems blue 5700K may be up to 3 times more effective in photosynthesis than 2700K so I want to have it also.
I will add it at a ratio of 1 to 3.

 

[acespicoli]

Covering all the bases here. I'm curious to see where this goes.

Sub'd

haha thanx,
let me know if I make any mistakes, please!

 

[acespicoli]

In land plants, leaves absorb mostly red and blue light in the first layer of photosynthetic cells because of Chlorophyll absorbance.
Green light, however, penetrates deeper into the leaf interior and can drive photosynthesis more efficiently than red light.
Because green and yellow wavelengths can transmit through chlorophyll and the entire leaf itself,
they play a crucial role in growth beneath the plant canopy.

So my question now is, do I need to add a green light also ?

 

[acespicoli]

Primary Colors of Light
The subject of color perception can be simplified if we think in terms of primary colors of light.
We have already learned that white is not a color at all, but rather the presence of all the frequencies of visible light.
When we speak of white light, we are referring to ROYGBIV - the presence of the entire spectrum of visible light.
But combining the range of frequencies in the visible light spectrum is not the only means of producing white light.
White light can also be produced by combining only three distinct frequencies of light,
provided that they are widely separated on the visible light spectrum. Any three colors (or frequencies) of light that produce white light when combined
with the correct intensity are called primary colors of light.
There are a variety of sets of primary colors. The most common set of primary colors is red (R), green (G) and blue (B).
When red, green and blue light are mixed or added together with the proper intensity, white (W) light is obtained.
This is often represented by the equation below:

R + G + B = W
In fact, the mixing together (or addition) of two or three of these three primary colors of light
with varying degrees of intensity can produce a wide range of other colors.

As you can see above with three (colors) we have a nice white light?

 

[Dion]

DIY LED CXB3590 2700K *36*VDC X 6 (grow light)
I was looking for some community support
Q&A for the DIY construction and use of High Power LED,
the one im building just happens to be
CXB3590 2700K 36VDC X 6

History
I used two (2) Area 51 RW-150 LED Grow Light for the last 2 years
Now im trying to upgrade to a dedicated flowering light.

I want to continue to use the,(2) Area 51 RW-150 LED Grow Lights,
just for vegetative growth in a separate location.

The first question I had was what
COB (chip on board) LED (light emitting diode)
I wanted to select for this purpose and why?


Three (3) letter acronyms are terrible when people try to learn?

there is a thread called DIY LED FAQ or smth, plenty of peeps helping out in there

So to select my light source I looked into Photosynthesis

Not all wavelengths of light can support photosynthesis.
The photosynthetic action spectrum depends on the type of accessory pigments present.
For example, in green plants, the action spectrum resembles the absorption spectrum for
chlorophylls and carotenoids with peaks for violet-blue and red light.
[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=70564&pictureid=1685953&thumb=1]View Image[/url]

So now I knew the peaks at 440nm and 660nm so what is nm (nanometers )
How do I convert to kelvin?
I was looking for it in kelvin units so I decided from the chart below I wanted 2700K (Kelvin)
[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=70564&pictureid=1685954&thumb=1]View Image[/url]

this was disproved in the 80's by mccree

In land plants, leaves absorb mostly red and blue light in the first layer of photosynthetic cells because of Chlorophyll absorbance.
Green light, however, penetrates deeper into the leaf interior and can drive photosynthesis more efficiently than red light.
Because green and yellow wavelengths can transmit through chlorophyll and the entire leaf itself,
they play a crucial role in growth beneath the plant canopy.

So my question now is, do I need to add a green light also ?

not needing to add green, but light emitter with green in them(white) produce more photons in those peaks(per watt) then single nm LEDs, why? because R&D is done on white lights, and they just keep getting better

 

[acespicoli]

**********************************************************************************
not needing to add green, but light emitter with green in them(white) produce more photons in those peaks(per watt) then single nm LEDs, why? because R&D is done on white lights, and they just keep getting better
*********************************************************************************
Hi Dion,
Glad you stopped in, I enjoyed your threads and posts on LED very knowledgeable. You had a real nice build you did props on that.

I did see some of those other DIY threads, this is my first build.
Looking into the full spectrum led's that are just coming out from Cree looked like the mini led with a focus lens attached.
Is that one of the ones your talking about or are there others?

XP-G3
MHB-B
XQ-A
XQ-E

http://www.cree. com/LED-Components-and-Modules/Applications/Color/Horticulture (copy paste)
Those above are the ones I saw so far


Cree has the widest range of white and color LEDs optimized for horticulture lighting. Cree LEDs deliver the industry’s highest Photosynthetic Photon Flux (PPF), efficiency, and reliability to enable the replacement of MH and HPS at radically lower power. Cree white LEDs deliver the full spectrum of light to mimic natural sunlight while Cree royal blue, green, photo red and far red LEDs deliver high PPF in the wavelengths best suited for the different stages of plant growth. The combination of consistent package, footprint and drive levels allow easy tuning of spectral content at the luminaire level to adapt the light exactly to the needs of various crops. Built on Cree’s high reliability ceramic package technology, Cree LEDs deliver excellent R90/L90 lifetimes, even in extreme conditions.

This one is supposed to be a dedicated flower build so its going to be mostly red, so far thats the plan. What do you think? I definitely appreciate any advice.

I do see exactly what you said in bold above white light!!!

 

[biggreg]

You're reds and blues are like your NPK, the rest of the visible spectrum is like your secondary and micros and uv and near IR are like your trace elements. Phytometric nutrition.

 

[Dion]

basically the more light the better, anything grown from seed has the genetic information inside of itself to adapt to whatever spectrum you throw at it, if there is enough of any light it will produce good bud( HPS is a great example of lots of poor spectrum delviering nice results)

so look at this example(purely fiction but approximately reality)


lets say you have 150watts and 300 dollars to spend and a specific size garden to light.


if we use those 300 bucks on red and blue diodes with a couple white in them for the green(I'm taking monos) you end up with about 100w and 500ppfd(because the monos become expensive for top bins and mounting)

now we invest that same 300 bucks in cobs and we get up to 300w and 900ppfd
or we could run them more efficiency and consume only 150w(as per target) and get 730ppfd


you see what I'm saying is that chasing the perfect or full spectrum is a fools errand.
per watt you will get more 440s and 620s (or whatever literature ur reading tells u plans need most) using white leds, because they are just more efficient.

the exception being royal blue, they get up to 300 lumens per watt, however they cost more


if you must design a light with a super spectrum id suggest you start with a 4000K cob, and to it add 620nm, 660 nm.
this will take advantage of the colder white's higher efficiency while still hitting those reds.


this imo is the best approach, and basically what cree did, only I'm suggesting to use cobs for the white, not monos

 

[biggreg]

Those white cobs usually have lots of red and blue in them.

Yes intensity is more important than Spectrum up until you start matching the DLI of the tropics and then playing with spectrum can be fun and rewarding.

A with small wattage light set up such as you describe, efficiency diffrences would be hard to see on your bill.

 

[acespicoli]

You're reds and blues are like your NPK, the rest of the visible spectrum is like your secondary and micros and uv and near IR are like your trace elements. Phytometric nutrition.

Many scientists describe a "transition metal" as any element
in the d-block of the periodic table, which includes groups 3 to 12 on the periodic table.

There are some very interesting similarities in the three (3) states of matter gas, liquid, and solids.
Light is a proton and functions as a elementary particle much like transition metals in solutions?

Great observation biggreg! Science is amazing My mixing light color,
I hope takes care of some things I used to think were soil related deficiencies.

 

[biggreg]

If you want to boost your lighting, check out this paint. I contacted this hospital clean room uv reflective paint company about their product. I tested it for them and now they have just brought it to our market. They used my PAR and UVB reflectivity test as a case study. The paint has a satin finish and is cleanable. I recently talked them into offering quarts.

https://www.twilightcoatings.com/collections/coatings-for-horticulture

 

[acespicoli]

basically the more light the better, anything grown from seed has the genetic information inside of itself to adapt to whatever spectrum you throw at it, if there is enough of any light it will produce good bud( HPS is a great example of lots of poor spectrum delviering nice results)

so look at this example(purely fiction but approximately reality)


lets say you have 150watts and 300 dollars to spend and a specific size garden to light.


if we use those 300 bucks on red and blue diodes with a couple white in them for the green(I'm taking monos) you end up with about 100w and 500ppfd(because the monos become expensive for top bins and mounting)

now we invest that same 300 bucks in cobs and we get up to 300w and 900ppfd
or we could run them more efficiency and consume only 150w(as per target) and get 730ppfd


you see what I'm saying is that chasing the perfect or full spectrum is a fools errand.
per watt you will get more 440s and 620s (or whatever literature ur reading tells u plans need most) using white leds, because they are just more efficient.

the exception being royal blue, they get up to 300 lumens per watt, however they cost more


if you must design a light with a super spectrum id suggest you start with a 4000K cob, and to it add 620nm, 660 nm.
this will take advantage of the colder white's higher efficiency while still hitting those reds.


this imo is the best approach, and basically what cree did, only I'm suggesting to use cobs for the white, not monos

Great quote!
"you see what I'm saying is that chasing the perfect or full spectrum is a fools errand"

What you said in your post im in total agreement at this point.
I would like to run my specs past you as well please comment if you see anything worth mention.
Thanx

Dion btw have you seen any of those mini's on tape builds around here?

 

[acespicoli]

Im going to try to hit the optimal low, middle, and high available from CREE COBS....
Lets see how it works out ?

RGB color space that describes colors across most of the human color perception range
in terms of three monochromatic primaries at standardized wavelengths of
435.8 nm (violet), 546.1 nm (green) and 700 nm (red).

D65 target white
The commonly used 3:6:1 RGB mixing ratio is derived from this early research,
created as a tool to produce a specific white point using the CRT phosphor’s predetermined colorimetric parameters.


The image above is natural sunlight

This image above is the 3:6:1 RGB mixing ratio

3:6:1 may not apply to LEDs

Factoring LED specs
Next, you must refer to the technical datasheet for each LED,
and note the typical luminous intensity value for red, green, and blue.
In this example, we will use the typical values 0.745 cd, 1.60 cd, and 0.38 cd, respectively.
Now, we calculate the target intensity per pixel using the desired target luminance
(TL) and pixel pitch (PP) in millimeters using the formula:
Target Intensity (cd) = TL × (PP/1000)2 = 8000 ×(12.5/1000)2 = 1.25 cd.
Having determined the total required intensity per pixel,
we can calculate the respective luminous intensity required for the red, green, and blue emitters using the formula:
(R, G or B Mixing value/Sum of RGB mixing value) × Target intensity :
Red = (4.1/15.7) × 1.25 = 0.3264cd
Green = (10.6/15.7) × 1.25 = 0.84395 cd
Blue = (1.0/15.7) × 1.25 = 0.0796 cd
Next, we must return to the LED data sheet.
You can estimate the drive current required to produce the desired luminous intensity using the drive current
vs. light output graph in the LED datasheet
The drive currents required to produce the desired luminous intensities for the three emitters are approximately 8.8 mA for red, 10.5 mA for green, and 4.2 mA for blue.
These current requirements can be used to
determine the hardware component values used to bias the driver ICs and the variable values used to set the output range of the LED driver software.