Discussion about LED diodes

[Ipotato]

Cheap diodes are cheap for a reason. You may get the same output but you will not have longevity.


Powerful, Cheap, Reliable, Reality allows you to pick TWO!

Cheap and powerful will not be reliable.

Cheap and reliable will not be powerful.

Powerful and reliable is never cheap.

They are not powerful but there is 756 of them and it makes the light powerful . It is made by an industrial floodlight manufacturer I doubt they get away with bad reliability

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Considering the output necessary for commercial floodlights, I would definately want to see the spectrum chart. I'm not saying your light is no good, I'm saying you can expect the diodes (or ballast) to die much more quickly than a quality (and more $$$) horticultural light.

The pick two law applies to engineering in general, not just lighting. Facts are facts.

 

[f-e]

Oh I don't want to get into an argument I am just saying that lots of cheap diodes can do same or better job than few expensive ones. Besides i doubt Shane from Migro would make up a fake test for a pretty unknown company that is competing with his won. (they added a variant with a dimmer instead of wi-fi controls which is the one i bought)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxJqqRzabRI

That's a migrow post?
That's quite an eye opener. It explains why the person doing the testing didn't particularly care. Adding more than considerable weight to the facts you presented.

Hows the radio?
Making LED's light up can require as little as one or two components. Such a design has almost no losses or radio noise. Light unit efficiency is better without that 7-8% loss, so it seems like a huge win. Such designs won't last though. Some sort of regulated driver is nearly always used. They are very cheap. I wound think you have one. The decent one's are really quite expensive though. Bigger boxes with a lot more in them. Nearly all of which is made with radio noise in mind. A problem that's haunted our lights since electronic ballasts first appeared.
A well known brand who advertised here landed themselves a ban. In part, for selling such lights. They didn't care, and when hounded into speaking to their designers, they didn't seem to have a clue.

Be sure to test this aspect of your lighting. I have personally bought commercial lights, struggled to get them up to spec, and taken them out of service after figuring the design was beyond saving. They were my first LED lights. The next one's I made myself.

 

[Mars H.]

Oh I don't want to get into an argument I am just saying that lots of cheap diodes can do same or better job than few expensive ones. Besides i doubt Shane from Migro would make up a fake test for a pretty unknown company that is competing with his won. (they added a variant with a dimmer instead of wi-fi controls which is the one i bought)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxJqqRzabRI

The par tested report is impressive for a 150W light. which diodes they used?

 

[Mars H.]

From what I can see, Philips teamed with HP in 1990 to form lumiled, then bought out HP in 2005 (well an HP spin off, agilent). Then sold 80% to Apollo, so the brand is now just Lumiled. They source from a few places, but also claim to be the only people actually making horticultural lights, from parts made for horticultural use. They actually develop the phosphors needed to make the LEDs which says to me Philips are still in there somewhere. Though I'm not sure the website speaks of them.

Trying to buy a reel of Philips smd led's seems futile. I just get old Philips Lumiled links. Mouser may have some but won't load for me.

Philips did make those nice Luxion LEDs when Lumiled.

It's all a little cloudy. To be honest, I don't see there name on many semiconductors these days. A branch does deal with electronic components specifically, but long gone are the days when nearly every TV had a Philips jungle of some sort.

It is true that few light suppliers use philip chips now. Maybe they have switch their main business into other field like electric razor?

 

[Ipotato]

The par tested report is impressive for a 150W light. which diodes they used?

I have tried to find out the best reply I got was they are their own diodes that they use for their industrial floodlights, here is a close up (there are 3K 5K IR and far red). I am not saying that it's better I am just saying it's a different approach worth examining. They also daisy chain and clip into each other to make a bigger light which is what sold the light to me.

 

[Mars H.]

I have tried to find out the best reply I got was they are their own diodes that they use for their industrial floodlights, here is a close up (there are 3K 5K IR and far red). I am not saying that it's better I am just saying it's a different approach worth examining. They also daisy chain and clip into each other to make a bigger light which is what sold the light to me.

cool, let's see these chips' longevity.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

With the diodes being very much less than one watt each, the canopy penetration will be minimal. Without scrogging... puffball city.

 

[Mars H.]

With the diodes being very much less than one watt each, the canopy penetration will be minimal. Without scrogging... puffball city.

it makes sense. but more chips could strengthen the penetration. and the longevity of each chip would be extended because there will be no overdrive issue.

 

[zachrockbadenof]

.. puffball city.

i have a small tent , 4x3.5ft - i am using '2' 315's with phillip bulbs, with some cheap leds as side lites, and my buds are 'puffballs'.... would one of these mars led's, i'm thinking of a fce4800 give me more solid buds??... thanks

 

[Ipotato]

With the diodes being very much less than one watt each, the canopy penetration will be minimal. Without scrogging... puffball city.

Do you have any proof of this?

Grown under 150w Maxisun (450 diodes). Buds look fine to me

https://www.autoflower.net/forums/threads/my-low-budget-grow.86831/

 

[zachrockbadenof]

Do you have any proof of this?

Grown under 150w Maxisun (450 diodes). Buds look fine to me

in a word...WOW...

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

You posted the proof yourself, notice how the purpling stops halfway down each plant? That's what you get with low power diodes. A professional grade LED ($$$) would have purpling all the way down.

Physics.
Your light is a soft (though dense) downpour, while high power LEDs are more firehose in output.
Pick two.

Edit: Ok, so halfway is way too much credit, you can literally see how weak the light is by the coverage and color changes.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

i have a small tent , 4x3.5ft - i am using '2' 315's with phillip bulbs, with some cheap leds as side lites, and my buds are 'puffballs'.... would one of these mars led's, i'm thinking of a fce4800 give me more solid buds??... thanks

I ran a 1000w HPS in a 4x4 tent for several years. A barely 600w system in a slightly smaller space could grow puffballs in comparison, yes.

I know I'm liking the FCE-3000 I have, yet it is still an economy light compared to the more professional Mars Hydro lights. With this in mind I do not know. I do know any SP series rated for your space will grow very well.

 

[Mars H.]

i have a small tent , 4x3.5ft - i am using '2' 315's with phillip bulbs, with some cheap leds as side lites, and my buds are 'puffballs'.... would one of these mars led's, i'm thinking of a fce4800 give me more solid buds??... thanks

wow, you offered a lot of lights for your plants. 630W+side lites. i suppose the fce4800+side lites could be the replacement.

 

[exploziv]

wow, you offered a lot of lights for your plants. 630W+side lites. i suppose the fce4800+side lites could be the replacement.

FCE4800 + 1 x 315 in the middle of it!

 

[zachrockbadenof]

FCE4800 + 1 x 315 in the middle of it!

how would u mount the 315 under the fce4800?? - thats the lamp i am looking it, but it would take up most of the 4x3.5 space

 

[exploziv]

Under? I would put it right between the bars brother!!
But, once u get the light, you'll see how overkill this is.. more like a joke because that light is probably good enaugh for the space it covers, but can be done for sure!

 

[zachrockbadenof]

Under? I would put it right between the bars brother!!
But, once u get the light, you'll see how overkill this is.. more like a joke because that light is probably good enaugh for the space it covers, but can be done for sure!

got ya - 4got the bars are moveable.... i'm sure the 4800is enough light, just worry about the penetration

 

[exploziv]

Now u know u can "fix" that too if you want. But I would say to just not treat them as other lights, but learn to grow to their advantages. A uniform canopy in the sweetspot will do wonders. Feeding alse needs to be up to par if you want to see plants perform under higher wattage on the dimmer as well..