"Curing" Resin - The Next Wave? (& Cherniak's new pamphlet)

[gaiusmarius]

the only thing i believe happens with a cure is the chlorophyl evaporates. sizer hash is another prime example of hash that gets better with a cure.

bubble hash on the other hand doesn't seem to change much a all. in fact i found the bubble had lost some taste with 1 years time.

maybe your kief was already so clean that there was no vegetable matter left in it that needed to dissolve its chlorophyl chiefsmokingbud?

pressing hash is another thing that needs to be explained more too. why does it change the taste when i press my bubble in the piecemaker. why does it bubble and melt more when i have played around with a piece of bubble for a while first?

 

[Chiefsmokingbud]

This is a verfy safe way to watch and see the hashish resin merge into a beautifully condensed harvest. (Dough style material)
=========================================================
The natural humidity in the fresh resin is already enough for the curing to happen.
1. Meld with the other particles.
For example: This can be done with resin intended to make hashish that has dried too quickly.
However: With plants that have dried too fast and taste green they can not be revived in this way.
This pen was subsidized by the Nederland Government which was given to Alan by a nice girl.One of the most significant thoughts about curing is the simple reality as first metioned in Volumbe One, Book One of The Great Books of Hashish was having and knowing what the just right and exactly right thing was when it came to have a perfect piece of hashish.

I honestly don't think he's speaking of chlorophyl. honestly if it is chlorophyl wouldn't it just be easier to dry sieve properly in the least amount of time to get "uncontaminated" kief...............instead of all this curing mumbo jumbo.

BTW, my kief is pretty clean....i'm more concerned with quality.

 

[gaiusmarius]

good point, sounds more like he's talking about pressed hash and the trichome heads busting up and melding?

i think in the traditional and commercial hash making way, you do end up with quite a lot of plant matter in the end product.

even when making pollinator hash in any commercial form will mean some plant matter gets in to the final product.

but i actually think you are right, there must be some thing more to it, then letting the chlorophyl evaporate? it doesn't explain the exotic tastes some of the old school hash had, which i have rarely found duplicated, good scissor hash has it too, when you leave it for a half year or so, but even after 3 months it starts to taste and smell like real old school hash.

 

[Dkgrower]

Wait, wait, wait...isn't kief supposed to be resin only?

keif, is a old word fore crused up femal cannabis flowers after they have dryed/cured. In marok(old pepol) and south india they smoke it, in marokko they smoke it in a jibsi or pound with sticks over a screen to produce hasish powder.

In denmark it´s allso youse as a term for bad hashish.


I think that heating induced by pressing/rubbing removes many of the terpentens- cannabis flavors and it must also burst open the glandsheads so the lovely cannabinoids conten fuse together and produce that more
ductile type of hash compared to cold pressed haish that are britte in strukture. But what happens on the chemical reaction scale would be nice to
know

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

So, here are a couple direct quotes to get the conversation rolling:

“...the quality of hashish is determined purely by its genetic background.”

“...it becomes clearer that heavy presses with high temperatures are not needed any more if the resin is well cured.”

“Our research has shown that at a stable temperature of 37 degrees C, it still takes about 3 months for most resins to mature.”

“Super quality hashish needs to be cured slowly (with a warm temperature) over a period of at least 3 months. During this time it should be kept in an enclosed container. This container should be air tight. Then it must be opened approximately every three days to prevent mustiness from starting). This is a very safe way to watch and see the hashish resin merge into a beautifully condensed harvest. (Dough style material)

"Very little hashish resin can be extracted from plants and smoked (very happily) within a month of creating.
Even marijuana buds and vegetative parts like only the calyxes should be cured for several weeks as well, in lower temperatures.
Curing resin into the state that it would be called a perfect ball of hashish, on the contrary requires warmer temperatures.
Most of the time when people winning the resin from the dried plants the humidity in the extracted material is sufficient for this curing to function properly.
It is mostly recommended that the resin be stored during this part of the process in an air tight enviroment like a sealable glass jar, or any sealable container.
When storing the fresh resin it must be approximately 50% dry and placed in an air tight environment like a sealable glass jar, or a vacuum sealed container or seal pressed bags but not zip lock bag (or any other kind of plastic bags) s which do not really seal to the degree that we are suggesting here and now, especially the zip-locks that are not for food."

"When Nederlandishe Polm will still easily crumble after having been in a warm oven for a few months then it still is not ready to be pressed into anything like the temple balls you see in the photos in this book.
After three months the resin has changed properties and you can basically form it into balls by hand. This material already has the properties of flowery hashish. This material can still be processed by rubbing and or pressing into darker hashish varieties. Some genetics however are so oily that they can be rolled into your hands right away, into dark oily temple balls like those that you see on the front cover of this book, without the rubbing or pressing.
This again is related to its genetics because the famous hashish varieties of the world are what they are, not because of the region that they come from nor because of climate, soil and growing method.
The quality of all hashish is determined purely by the genetics. All the genetics of the great hashishs that we have known and enjoyed are still being grown all around the world.”

- Butte

The potential of hashish is determined by genetics. Grow the best plant poorly, or harvest it immature, or process the hash badly, etc etc etc. And the best genetics in the world will not help.

Resin that is clean and pure enough will press easy. Curing has nothing to do with pressing. I do agree that high quality resin presses easy, I would also say that pressing does not contribute to potency in any way. I prefer aged, cured, dry sift resin and I never press it. Unpressed dry sift resin is the best.

I agree about the three month cure but I think it is done best on the plant, meaning box the buds and cure for a few months before the resin extraction. Works better then trying to cure the resin after extraction.

Storing any resin that is 50% dry in an inclosed container is wacko, even if you open the jar every three days the resin will spoil and mold. Storing resin in a warm oven for three months is also wacko. I do not believe that LC even knows the moisture content of fresh resin off a living plant, so how do you tell when it is 50% dry? I find that resin is best kept at 5% moisture content, any more is asking for problems. Resin that is 5% moisture is safe in a closed jar at room temps. But I would not keep it unfrozen for very long.

Once your resin is made keep it out of light, heat, moisture. The best way to keep for long storage is to freeze in an air tight container.

If you made your dry sift with dry buds that were cured for a few months then the resin should not be very high in moisture. I would not store resin in an air tight container without freezing. Curing should be done before the resin is extracted from the plants.

Not sure I would take advice from LC, I have known him for 30 years and he is always smoking my resin. I have never seen resin from LC that was superior in any way. If he is smoking Afghani then it is 10-20% THC at the most, and full of resin that was from seeded plants, sun dried, full of dirt and debris, as well as added adulterants. What he calls ROYAL TEMPLE BALLS are also made from seeded plants, and full of dirt and debris. It was some of the best hash in the 60's and 70's but that was a long time ago. The best hash today is made from Sinsemilla, free of dirt and debris, and is made in the West, with water sifting or dry sifting. If you are in the third world the goal is quanity, in the west it is quality.

I look forward to the book, but I do have my doubts about the so called facts.....

-SamS

 

[Guest]

I find that resin is best kept at 5% moisture content, any more is asking for problems. Resin that is 5% moisture is safe in a closed jar at room temps. But I would not keep it unfrozen for very long.



-SamS

Why is going above 5% moisture content asking for trouble?.

I ask because mold can't grow if the moisture content is under 15% and it seems to me that if you want as much flavor as possible, adding as much humidity as possible, without problems, is the best way to go such as using a tobacco humidor.

This is why the tobacco industry has humidor product such as humidification beads and Propylene Glycol to be able for the cigars and cigarettes to absorb as much moisture as possible without going high enough for mold to develop.

Cannabis like this is tasty and easy on the throat. 5% would seem to low to get as much from hash especially when considering you're aging it because you need moisture if you want your curing to be sped up or else it would take a long time if the moisture is low.

A temperature of 65f-70f and relative humidity of 70% will speed up the process of curing and also allow the smoke to be tasty and smooth. Peace.

 

[Dkgrower]

A temperature of 65f-70f and relative humidity of 70% will speed up the process of curing and also allow the smoke to be tasty and smooth. Peace.

Year but the tobacco industry spray there leafs with many differnt nasty chemicals to keep the bacteria down in there curing process, I think you would have a high risk of getting mold in your pollen, specialy if you are working with outdoor plants where there always will be some kim of bacteria

They humidity is just to high even for my indoor room when flowering is ongoing I try to keep it under 50 % becouse of the fear of mold

I think that you preseve the flavors best by yousing strain that have a fruty pheno and dont heat and press the pollen.

 

[Guest]

Regardless of the tobacco industry using bacterial inhibitors or not, mold can't grow when the relative humidity is under 70%.


The reason why I don't think a humidity level that high is good for growing herb is because it will create broad leaves due to the plant needing to expel the excess moisture since the air isn't dry and most people don't grow herb for it's leaves. Cannabis is antibacterial, at least to "bad" bacteria when it is healthy and getting an abundance of nutrients but I do agree a low humidity of 30-40% is ideal because since all types of bacteria are in the air CONSTANTLY making it hard for them to grow would be ideal.

Also, I would go as far as to say that bacteria is most likely a major part of the curing process being that bacteria is EVERYWHERE but that will probably start a debate that I don't want to start.

Herb in a tobacco humidor isn't exposed to air as much as a growing plant so the threat isn't as high.

Lastly, you can use propylene glycol and distilled water instead of humidification beads if you are really worried about bacteria because this has antibacterial effects. Peace.

 

[bartender187]

we can make a tinfoil pipe.' and yes he made a tinfoil pipe and smoked his afghan. I almost cried.

LOL. Ohh I would be laughing,,,, but crying inside. Sad sad

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

Lotty,
The reason I like 5% moisture content is because some resin is very Hydrophilic, that is it will absorb water from the air. Take dry powered resin to a hot wet environment like the equator and it will absorb enough water to make the powder a solid piece that can not be powered again. I can remember resin that was ok in a film can for a week until I opened it in a hot wet environment, then it was ruined, or at least no longer powder.
As for mold not growing at under 15% humidity, at what temperature? If you think that resin that is 15% moisture is safe to store in a closed environment, what can I say? It is no more safe then curing at 70% moisture humidity level. This is not safe.
BTW Adding humidity does not increase flavor, flavor comes from the cannabis terpenoids, not the humidity. Also when you say "mold can't grow when the relative humidity is under 70%" WTF? Mold can to grow in an environment that is 70% easy. And cut plants drying and curing can mold in a 70% humidity dry or cure. And resin cured or kept in a 70% humidity enviornment will mold for sure.
You are throwing around humidity %'s, I suspect you have a humidity guage does it also show temperature? Relative humidity is much more important then absolute humidity. And do you have a way to measure moisture content in herb or resin? Like a desiccator and scale? I do.
-SamS

 

[Guest]

Did you read my post or just skim through?. I stated the temperature will be 65f-70f, so I have no idea why you asked this unless you didn't read my post with an open mind. Also I stated I was talking about relative humidity.

Of course mold can grow in a humidity level of 70% BUT that's when you consider the temperature because obviously the higher the temperature the more water it can hold which means the plant/hash will be wet due to the excess wet air and giving mold and bacteria a chance to grow because the wet air will make the hash/plant a perfect breeding ground for growth due to the plant perspiring.

I'm not talking about a wet plant, I'm talking about just enough moisture to give added flavor and cool the smoke.

Lastly, of course I know taste doesn't come from humidity, I'm referring to the effect that the added moisture will give to the taste sensations of the mouth and olfactoy senses which are effected by smell and by adding a solvent, which water plays, the oils will be able to, for lack of a better term, spread out on the senses.



I don't want to turn this into a fight because it might seem like that being that I'm using words and can't express the meaning behind them on a computer, so please don't take it as such. Peace.

 

[3chomes]

So from reading the above posts, I gather that it's best to dry/cure the material first before making hash out of it. Does this apply to bubble or dry sift only?

 

[Guest]

I'm talking about either hash or plant material. If your making hash just cure it on it's own. The same for plant material. You should dry the plant material or hash out as much as you can by using a dessicant and a rack with a screen such as the kind used by cooks to air dry food and/or let grease drain, you can buy these things in wal-mart or target, and then cure it with the tobacco humidor so everything will be even as far as moisture content and everythign should cure at the same rate.

If you want to learn more, go to a tobacco shop and look into tobacco humidors.

What's funny is I just saw a special on wine and the specialist stated that after a taste test red wine aged and served at 50f-65f with 70%-75% humidity, gives the best flavor and anything else doesn't give it it's just due. Anything over that encourages mold growth on the cork while speeding up the aging process which won't allow the wine to develop complex flavors and under 50% relative humidity, dries out the cork which shrinks it and allows oxygen in which messes up the wine and also the low temperatures slows down aging.

It's funny how that compares to what the cigar industry says as far as temperature and humidity levels yet one is dealing with a plant and the other with liquid. Peace.

 

[Dkgrower]

Personly I think that if you are making ice you can youse fresh harvest cannabis or cured, but are not big on ice, but have tryed with fresh and cured and it worked well

But when making pollen hashish it is important to cure the weed before processing it into pollen - that is if you are going fore that marok style hashish

I never make big portions and work with outdoor material and the stuff that comes out
a few week after harvest is rich in smell but it tikkels/giggels when you smoke it

Ahh have to play CS with my old clan see ya later

Love this treed and the diskussion

 

[Dkgrower]

It's funny how that compares to what the cigar industry says as far as temperature and humidity levels yet one is dealing with a plant and the other with liquid. Peace.

But dos it mean that it counts when making hashish marok styl/pollen powder.

A note, in india and nepal where they rub the plants and thereby make a concentrat (charas) of resin, They avoid plants that are to moist, it occurs when it have rained or in the moring before the sun have dryed the plant.

The reason is because the charas gets mold, you see it as white strips and you can clearly smell that the resin was to mois before it was sealed with plactic wrap.

 

[Guest]

You have to understand first that they aren't using a system that is well contrived, they are just going on what is the moisture of THAT DAY. I'm referring to a set level EVERYDAY.

Also, I'm not talking about a packaged product because common sense tells you that by wrapping something up when it's moist is not good because you will raise the temperature which causes the moisture to leach out.

I'm talking about a stored product that's meant to age at a set consistency month after month. If you have a good amount you want to store to keep it the same month after month, then of course you don't want high levels of moisture and in a light and oxygen deprived environment.

Lastly, the reason why I compared the wine and cigar industry as far temperature and humidity levels was because they both have no association with each other and they are very different products. One is a liquid and the other a fiber. Being that some people smoke hash(which is a liquid) and the others smoke plant material, I find it awesome that you have two industries who have been around longer than the cannabis industry who agree of the same thing AND it's not intentional which therefore helps people who want to enhance their products whether they are oils(hash) or fibers(bud).

I'm not going to go into this no more because no one is seeing the connections I'm trying to make BUT I appreciate your views on this. Peace.

 

[trichomefarmer]

well hash is not a liquid....

 

[Guest]

Hash is a liquid due to oils which make up the glands which is why excellent hash that is free of plant fibers melts into a screen, it just becomes a solid at room temperature like saturated fats do.

Anyway, I'm done, I just wanted to clarify that point of hash being a liquid. You all won the debate. I give up. Peace.

 

[trichomefarmer]

lmao

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

A temperature of 65f-70f and relative humidity of 70% will speed up the process of curing and also allow the smoke to be tasty and smooth. Peace.

Did you read my post or just skim through?. I stated the temperature will be 65f-70f, so I have no idea why you asked this unless you didn't read my post with an open mind. Also I stated I was talking about relative humidity.

Of course mold can grow in a humidity level of 70% BUT that's when you consider the temperature because obviously the higher the temperature the more water it can hold which means the plant/hash will be wet due to the excess wet air and giving mold and bacteria a chance to grow because the wet air will make the hash/plant a perfect breeding ground for growth due to the plant perspiring.

I read it but, the problem is that your first quote doesn't make clear if you are talking about curing resin, buds, drying plants, curing plants, or WTF?
Anyway resin or buds that are 15% moisture and cured in a 70% relative humidity at a temperature of 65-70f can and will get mold. If you think otherwise it must be your inexperience that allows you to make such statements.

Your second quoted post agrees that 70% humidity can cause mold. Or am I missing something?

Lastly, of course I know taste doesn't come from humidity, I'm referring to the effect that the added moisture will give to the taste sensations of the mouth and olfactoy senses which are effected by smell and by adding a solvent, which water plays, the oils will be able to, for lack of a better term, spread out on the senses.

I for one do not want to add any moisture to my resins, as I stated before the time to cure is on the plant, or after drying in a box, so when the resin is collected it is cured already. Simple. Giving advice to others to cure resin in a 70% humidity environment at 65-70f is NUTS!

Lastly, the reason why I compared the wine and cigar industry as far temperature and humidity levels was because they both have no association with each other and they are very different products. One is a liquid and the other a fiber. Being that some people smoke hash(which is a liquid) and the others smoke plant material, I find it awesome that you have two industries who have been around longer than the cannabis industry who agree of the same thing AND it's not intentional which therefore helps people who want to enhance their products whether they are oils(hash) or fibers(bud).

Hash is not a liquid or an oil unless you extract it with a solvent, but then you do not need to cure as the hash oil will have no materials left in them that will cure.
-SamS