Controlling the damn Caterpillars this year

[nomaad]

Sideways... Wjich strain of BT are you using? BT israelisis is suited for controlling fly family pests while BT kurstaki which is found in Safer Caterpillar Killer and Dipel DF is suited to controlling caterpillars. Lots more white butterflies in the garden this year. Just started the Dipel and have been doing monthly Spinosad treatments.

Also, what time of day did you apply the BT? It doesn't last long in sunlight. I hope you have better success this year controlling the pest.

 

[Yesca73]

thanx.
i have had problems the last 2 seasons with these little f%#?ers. i have seen Safer caterpiller killer at my local nursery. is this the stuff i want? I talked to a rep from Dutch Master and she said to use penatrator/zone mix. i have a couple of Mazar that have started to flower already about 4 weeks in and then PK,Green cush,Afgoo that have not.
I had them bad last year. spent hours in the hot sun picking em off. it sucked and lost some to mold cuz of the shits they take.

 

[straintester]

Great thread.
I am seeing evidence of caterpillars also.
They make little tiny holes in the leaves.
I've been using neem oil but it really doesn't seem to do much for them

 

[nomaad]

yesca: i would never use penetrator outdoors. saw it do some weird damage last year, even when applied in the early AM.

Use Safer Cat Killer or Dipel DF (more cost effective by far).

straintester: first off, i dunno how anybody could have thought you were a dude with that avatar. My 6 year old daughter loves the big green eyes and asked me "who is that lady?"

IME caterpillars, when eating leaves do not do so in a random pattern leaving small holes as you describe. They eat away at sections of leaves and leave nothing behind. They are very efficient eaters. Ever read "the Hungry Caterpillar" by Eric Carle?

The caterpillars we're worried about are probably still in egg form on the underside of your leaves. They will hatch and worm into your buds where they will eat and shit to their hearts' content... leaving you with buds that are rotten from the inside out.

The small holes in your leaves, I THINK, are more likely to be from grasshoppers and crickets.

Anybody with a differing opinion, please chime in.

 

[straintester]

straintester: first off, i dunno how anybody could have thought you were a dude with that avatar. My 6 year old daughter loves the big green eyes and asked me "who is that lady?"

IME caterpillars, when eating leaves do not do so in a random pattern leaving small holes as you describe. They eat away at sections of leaves and leave nothing behind. They are very efficient eaters. Ever read "the Hungry Caterpillar" by Eric Carle?

The caterpillars we're worried about are probably still in egg form on the underside of your leaves. They will hatch and worm into your buds where they will eat and shit to their hearts' content... leaving you with buds that are rotten from the inside out.

The small holes in your leaves, I THINK, are more likely to be from grasshoppers and crickets.

Anybody with a differing opinion, please chime in.

Haha! Well thank you Nomaad. I 'm not sure how people can get confused either.
Any dude using an avatar like this might be considered......
umm....never mind.

Plus I'm most chick like!

I love the green eyes also.

Ok then I probably don't have what you are referring to and we do have a lot of grasshoppers and crickets in our area.
These are leaving little holes in my bud forming leaves only and only on certain strains. The one that it is affecting the most is Laughing Buddha. The thing is it never did got back to veg so has been flowering early which is just odd.
I spend a couple of hours today thinning the bottom of this plant down as I topped it and really probably shouldn't have. It's one of those overly dense strains, prone to bud rot . I'm also pulling down the main branches to let more light and air circulation in which is helping greatly.

I wish my camera were working so i could take a picture and show what this looks like.
Its not a strain I would normally pick for my area but I had a clone taken from one I had grown indoors and it was growing so well that i wanted to experiment with it.
Well this is an experiment alright! I haven't read that book but it sounds interesting. These really are eating away at this particular strain.
I am however planning to build myself a temporary greenhouse to cover most of them until they finish.

I'm going to dig up my 'Garden Saver' and check it out.
Thanks Nomad.
Smart 'girl' you have there.

 

[nomaad]

so you are actually seeing caterpillars eating your buds on strains that a flowering early? or am i missing something? The caterpillars will live inside the buds, eating and shitting and causing mold. Are you actually seeing caterpillars?

 

[straintester]

so you are actually seeing caterpillars eating your buds on strains that a flowering early? or am i missing something? The caterpillars will live inside the buds, eating and shitting and causing mold. Are you actually seeing caterpillars?

No! I am not seeing any caterpillars and i have looked through my 'Marijuana Garden Saver' and do not see anything in there that looks like this does.

I don't see anything like it but I am getting a bit concerned.
Yes the flowering leaf sets are getting munched but not the same as the pictures I see. They are little tiny holes but this particular plant has had bud rot right at these inner bud sites but i thought this was just an air circulation and lack of light problem.
I think i need to get out my 30x microscope to see if i can see anything.

If I do should I pick up some Bacillus thuringiensis (Bt).
I have seen several yellow moths flying away .
The thing is this grow is for my patient and I want it to be non toxic and completely organic.
It states that it is non toxic to animals and humans but some people can develope an allergic reaction.

I also checked out Neem oil and it says it is effective against this also so i will have to get them to read this.
Which would you suggest?
I suppose i have to identify it first.


Yes this strain started flowering early and the only other plant it seems to be affecting is a large indica kush. My other sativas are not infected at all by this but I don't want them to either.

Yuck. I hate bugs.

 

[straintester]

I think what I am going to do is purchase some more neem oil and spray them completely.
The Bt seems a bit confusing because although it is a bacteria in the medical marijuana growers bible, it says that commercial products do not contain any of this bacteria so then I wonder how harmful it it might become to humans.
Since I have been spaying only with a hand held spray bottle, I am now going to get one of those pressurized bottles so it has more coverage.

It appears I am dealing with a couple of things here so I am going to also get some Diatomaceous Earth to put over my soil and around my pots.

btw....totally kidding about the avatar thing.
It doesn't really matter what gender i am or anyone for that matter. I just have an odd sense of humour.

 

[nomaad]

plenty of commercial products use BT. its widely used in organic production.

"the Bible", if you're talking about the Cervantes book, is a great place to begin your learning of growing cannabis, but as a resource for advanced growing, the information on ICM is about 1000 times more up to date.

Neem will not help with caterpillars. BTk will do the trick for you and cause zero problems for your patients if used properly. Don;t be scared.

 

[angel4us]

manual supercropping crush technique

manual supercropping crush technique

no matter what somewhare i eventually get some worms in my plants . safer soap washes away and if not reapplied leaves plants vulnerable to attack.
the orange worms im dealing with in midwest are white when young and turn red/orange as they travel up stems and in and outof buds.
BUT if you inspect every branch you will see where they leave a little purple hole and a bulge where they started their development /growth. from there they travel up towards new growthtips/buds .
WHAT i do is if my spray defenses fail here and there simply find orgin hole and start pinching plant towrds top till you feel the little bastard blow up inside !!!!! hes dead and you just suppercropped your branch. one particularily wet /rainy year i was it hard ,but spent many hours and thumb cramps smashing bugs/plants and all my plants loved it . and they way these things are timed it works out very well..... peace


just visually inspect and crush get em all before major bud development otherwise they'll eat and shit half a harvest away .

 

[straintester]

plenty of commercial products use BT. its widely used in organic production.

"the Bible", if you're talking about the Cervantes book, is a great place to begin your learning of growing cannabis, but as a resource for advanced growing, the information on ICM is about 1000 times more up to date.

Neem will not help with caterpillars. BTk will do the trick for you and cause zero problems for your patients if used properly. Don;t be scared.

This is good to know Nomaad and yes i am using that book as well as many others but it seems like you guys are ontop of all this stuff.

Thanks for the vote of confidence. You are right on in that the name 'sounds' scary. Good call>
Ok my chickiness is showing now

 

[Sideways]

Nomaad- Thanks for chiming in, I have been following you outdoor thread, AMAZING.
I have been using Safer caterpillar killer as well as another brand that I cant remember off hand. Both for use in controlling caterpillars. Always applied at dusk, to help it last.
I also used a mild mix of azatrol and Pyrethrin in combo last year and had a more sucessful time of it. Only about 10% damage. I stop application around three weeks before harvest.
We plant in a garden space, lots of tomatoes,corn,herbs,peppers, and veggies flowers. I think that this is a natural buffet, if you will, for the pests, and it brings em in. I will be just started using spinosad, pyrethrin,and BT in mild combo this year.

P.S. The hungry caterpillar by Carle- my daughter loves that book.

Straintester- it is very odd that you have extensive caterpillar damage this early- My plants usually only show damage during heavy flowering, when they eat and crap to their hearts content.
Angel/strain- As I stated earlier, I was hoping people would post up pics of the different caterpillars affecting their crops- my problem is with the Cabbage looper, some other have problems with gypsy moths, others with borers. So if ya got pics of the problems or pests - post em up.

Like G.I Joe says- Knowing is half the battle
And Like my boy scout leader said- "Always come prepared, and don't tell anyone where I touched you"........LOL

 

[HighonPottery]

try monterey garden spray and hand picking. i also use it on my veggies to kill the tomato worms. seems to work for me. i've got oak trees in the area, so they're the oak moths/gypsy moths.

 

[straintester]

Nomaad- Thanks for chiming in, I have been following you outdoor thread, AMAZING.
I have been using Safer caterpillar killer as well as another brand that I cant remember off hand. Both for use in controlling caterpillars. Always applied at dusk, to help it last.
I also used a mild mix of azatrol and Pyrethrin in combo last year and had a more sucessful time of it. Only about 10% damage. I stop application around three weeks before harvest.
We plant in a garden space, lots of tomatoes,corn,herbs,peppers, and veggies flowers. I think that this is a natural buffet, if you will, for the pests, and it brings em in. I will be just started using spinosad, pyrethrin,and BT in mild combo this year.

P.S. The hungry caterpillar by Carle- my daughter loves that book.

Straintester- it is very odd that you have extensive caterpillar damage this early- My plants usually only show damage during heavy flowering, when they eat and crap to their hearts content.
Angel/strain- As I stated earlier, I was hoping people would post up pics of the different caterpillars affecting their crops- my problem is with the Cabbage looper, some other have problems with gypsy moths, others with borers. So if ya got pics of the problems or pests - post em up.

Like G.I Joe says- Knowing is half the battle
And Like my boy scout leader said- "Always come prepared, and don't tell anyone where I touched you"........LOL

thanks Sideways
Yes it is a bit odd but this particular strain is a cross between thai and jamaican so it started flowering early
Whatever this is is eating away at my bud sites so yesterday I went out and purchased a big 8 litre pressurized spray bottle, einstein neem oil and some dictonaceous earth to place on top on my soil and around my pots until I can 'identiy' what this is exactly
Safer was what I was looking into getting but it seems like I might need some other stuff also

Thanks for the help sideways and I agree that the outdoor thread is awesome
I probably shouldn't even be in there with my 30 to 40 gallon pot plants next to their 200 gallon ones but I can't resist rubbing noses with the best

And Nomad i'd say the biggest difference between male and females grower posts is us chicks can be far more wordy
or at least I am
Great thread this is as it appears many are experiencing the same types of problems

 

[nomaad]

Nomaad- Thanks for chiming in, I have been following you outdoor thread, AMAZING.
I have been using Safer caterpillar killer as well as another brand that I cant remember off hand. Both for use in controlling caterpillars. Always applied at dusk, to help it last.
I also used a mild mix of azatrol and Pyrethrin in combo last year and had a more sucessful time of it. Only about 10% damage. I stop application around three weeks before harvest.
We plant in a garden space, lots of tomatoes,corn,herbs,peppers, and veggies flowers. I think that this is a natural buffet, if you will, for the pests, and it brings em in. I will be just started using spinosad, pyrethrin,and BT in mild combo this year.

I think that starting early with the BT and whatever else you're going to use is important. I don;t wait to see bugs to treat my plants. I do a weekly azatrol drench, subbing in spinosad (Captain Jack's from Bonide or Monterey) once a month. I added a weekly Dipel BTk treatment (evening) last week and will continue it.

I too hope that some folks will post up pics of the different caterpillars they encounter this season. Best of luck to everybody.

 

[Sideways]

Gypsy moth caterpillars-
http://cirrusimage.com/Moths/Gypsy_moth_caterpillar_small.JPG

Another I have had minor damage from in years past , come from the squash in the garden.

Squash borer-
http://0.tqn.com/w/experts/Pests-730/2009/06/squash-pest.jpg

 

[Kcar]

Spray BT at or just before sundown as sunlight degrades effectiveness.

 

[kannubis]

Safer pillar killer works well for me in so cal. Not very near to oak trees, but I get the same kind of pillars to kill anyway.

 

[Fat Tone]

Please keep this thread going.These worms detroy my buds worst then anything else. I think trying to engourage bats around your area would be more beneficial them birds(In two ways).Anyone used Sulfur with any luck.I had luck with Depel Dust in the past it isn't Organic.Is it?

 

[nomaad]

Safer pillar killer works well for me in so cal. Not very near to oak trees, but I get the same kind of pillars to kill anyway.

Dipel is a LOT more cost-effective than Safer Cat Killer. same active ingredient... much higher concentration.