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Club Bio Box
- Thread starter LadyLargely
- Start date
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otherwhitemeat
Lady, great way to kick off a thread!
When they legalize weed, you and this merry bunch of tinkerers will have to get back to the business of curing world hunger or cancer. In the meantime, rock on!
This is very creative stuff. I am glad to see folks taking things in different directions and experimenting. I am really looking forward to your findings on the OBBT/composter thingy...
I am never an early adopter, so I will be hanging out lurking and learning.
What I am most interested to see is a comparison of results in a control using the same square footage, lights, soil, clones etc. and comparisons of yields: traditional soil planter vs/ OBBT. My thinking is that you and DM and others might just be on to something here, but would love to see some comparative results with photos.
The part that I can't seem to understand is why your pots have to have an 'offset'? Why is the main stem so eccentric to one part of the vessel? It would seem to be a more efficient design for small scale growers if it can be adapted to a perfectly square space/container.
I like the idea of automating watering a bit, but am concerned over the loss of space...I am just a small scale self sufficiency grower with a cab. But for now, I'll keep my mind spinning on this. We stoners are known for ingenuity after all.
When they legalize weed, you and this merry bunch of tinkerers will have to get back to the business of curing world hunger or cancer. In the meantime, rock on!
This is very creative stuff. I am glad to see folks taking things in different directions and experimenting. I am really looking forward to your findings on the OBBT/composter thingy...
I am never an early adopter, so I will be hanging out lurking and learning.
What I am most interested to see is a comparison of results in a control using the same square footage, lights, soil, clones etc. and comparisons of yields: traditional soil planter vs/ OBBT. My thinking is that you and DM and others might just be on to something here, but would love to see some comparative results with photos.
The part that I can't seem to understand is why your pots have to have an 'offset'? Why is the main stem so eccentric to one part of the vessel? It would seem to be a more efficient design for small scale growers if it can be adapted to a perfectly square space/container.
I like the idea of automating watering a bit, but am concerned over the loss of space...I am just a small scale self sufficiency grower with a cab. But for now, I'll keep my mind spinning on this. We stoners are known for ingenuity after all.
She does this to accommodate her heavy supercropping. Start at the edge and work toward center.
LadyLargely
Member
Hey there OWM! Glad you like what you see! This thread is all about making a brief and interesting introduction to Bio Box concepts. While it is a garden showcase the idea is for it to be a colorful and example-filled guide to the Bio Box way of thinking.
Oxygen + Organics = Awesome
Definitely can't fault you for just lurking for now. While the successes have been heartening this is still quite an experimental technique; we're just starting to get to know it.
rrog mostly has the idea as to why I grow offset. Because I mount my ScrOG screen 3 inches above my soil line it helps to place the plants in a zig-zag. As they get woven in and the screen fills out they tend to 'fit' better this way. You say you are just in a little cab and try to save space. If you can believe it, this practice actually helps to make better use of space. My grow used to be in an itty bitty cab. Why do you think I grow in this mad, floro-driven, 6-inch tall style???
The more I experiment though, the more I think my 4+ gallon containers are far too big for the small plants I grow. I bet I could get away with half the volume. Works for me though, I do plan on ditching my floros and growing bigger plants.... Someday.
Thanks for stoping by! This should be a fun place to lurk well into the future, so long as I have anything to do with it
LadyLargely
Member
Recent OBBT-generated nug porn.
White Widow:
Angry stems!
Mega-thick supercropped main stems go hand-in-hand with the hilarious root densities attainable with an OBBT.
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olddrifter66
What about using just: Blood meal, Bone meal and garden lime? Should there be more in the mix or would this be a good baseline?
Old66, there is a recipe that can be followed. Includes those three things, plus the balance that's required.
The medium itself is so key. Though without direct nutrient value, the medium is the lattice work, the scaffolding for the whole system. The medium needs to allow the percolated air from below to pass easily. So first is the establishment of the medium for both roots and microlife. This means the super chunky varieties of Vermiculite, Perlite and Coco. To this you add active compost.
This gives the springiness and fluffiness to handle the air. Accommodates the huge micro-life of bacteria and fungus which feed and protect the roots.
Then you add the amendments such as bone and blood meal, kelp, etc. Each amendment provides a key nutrient or two. These macro-nutrients get digested by micro-life to become bio-available for the roots.
The medium itself is so key. Though without direct nutrient value, the medium is the lattice work, the scaffolding for the whole system. The medium needs to allow the percolated air from below to pass easily. So first is the establishment of the medium for both roots and microlife. This means the super chunky varieties of Vermiculite, Perlite and Coco. To this you add active compost.
This gives the springiness and fluffiness to handle the air. Accommodates the huge micro-life of bacteria and fungus which feed and protect the roots.
Then you add the amendments such as bone and blood meal, kelp, etc. Each amendment provides a key nutrient or two. These macro-nutrients get digested by micro-life to become bio-available for the roots.
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olddrifter66
where is the recipe....I have seen mentioned some ingredients that could be used, but not definitively. I am just trying to get the starter kit to test this new method, but want the best ingredients and to get an idea of what ingredients are available in my area.
LadyLargely
Member
Hey buddy, its really quite simple!! All you want are organic ferts to cover the bases for the nutritional needs of cannabis. In order to get favorable growth (bushy in veg, dense with heavy nugs in flower) we want to follow a rough nutrient ratio.
You already know N-P-K; nitrogen phosphorus and potassium, the main ingredients in cannabis nutrition. We just want to dictate the ratios of them through different stages of growth.
So! You want to pre-load your OBBT with a nitrogen-heavy load of nutes for veg. 3/1/1. That's three times as much N as P or K.
Blood meal and bone meal used in the right ratio can cover most of your nutrition needs for veg. Other than garden lime all you really need is a dash of epsom salts and a source of beneficial microbes.
I think your short-list of ingredients would do you pretty well to pre-load a reliable OBBT if you just rounded it out with one thing:
Espoma makes a line of mixed dry organic ferts. They're multi-ingredient jobbies with cool goodies like humic acid and greensand. I heartily reccomend either their Bio Tone or Plant Tone bagged organic ferts. Watch out for Holly Tone, its for acid-loving plants and has the wrong ratio of S to Mg to be very good for cannabis.
This will give you a double-whammy. A nice mild source of many beneficial organic additives AND dormant beneficial microbes!! Espoma lace most (if not all) of their bagged organic ferts with a lovely mix of dormant Aerobic Bacteria and Mycorrhiza Fungi. This is all you need to fire up a nice powerful colony of beneficial microbes in your OBBT medium. Just add a bit of a product like that and a dash of Epsom Salts to your proposed lineup and you are all set!
That mix will go into your medium, incubate, and most likely get your plants all the way through veg. Other than perhaps some supplimentary kelp extract or weak 5-1-1 fish emulsion you needn't add anything during veg. Just bubbled tap water. That's what I did.
Come flower though and you will need different nutes. Sources of potent organic P and K will be neccessary. OBBTs should be specifically pre-loaded with low K in order to encourage low-stretch growth and a high percentage of females. OBBT plants can stretch out of control if veged on the wrong nute ratio.
These:
Would be all you need to get through flower and final flush/starve. Bat guano for P, soluable seaweed extract for K and unsulfered molasses (not pictured, couldn't find it) for a little organic CAL-MAG, Iron and some great volotile carbs to make the bacteria happy.
Its not too long a list really. Bat guano and high-potency kelp extracts can be had in liquid form as well, to make things even easier!
LadyLargely
Member
Dolamite lime is different than most lime. I contains Mg, most lime doesn't. His garden lime sounds pretty run-of-the-mill, I would bet its Ca only. Epsom also contains sulfur, which you don't need a lot of but you do need some. Epsom actually contains sulfur and magnesium in the wrong ratio. 4 times as much S as Mg. Should be the other way round for cannabis. I was counting on otherwhitemeat investing in a bagged Espoma product. They always contain lots of Mg but no S (unless its holly tone, in which case theres too much S)
The Epsom was suggested to balance that out, it should go hand-in-hand with Espoma Bio Tone or Plant Tone to get a mixture that is favorable for cannabis. Epsom isn't for everyone!
The Epsom was suggested to balance that out, it should go hand-in-hand with Espoma Bio Tone or Plant Tone to get a mixture that is favorable for cannabis. Epsom isn't for everyone!
Unfortunately, I think only the Bio-Tone StarterPlus has fungus in it. The good news is that it's easy to culture your own and keep it going if you just get one bag ever.
LadyLargely
Member
Ehh, I know I definitely just bought some Bonide Plant Tone for a friend and it contained the full list of fungi/bacteria featured in the Bio Tone (tweaked a little, but roughly the same). I know they haven't been doing it long but I know they are doing it now.
McDanger
Member
Damn
Damn
1st, 2 of my 3 plants went male on me, now the last one is getting hermies. I do not know what the stress would have been, and I don't have any light leaks. So I pulled off all I could find, and I sprayed with REVERSE and all the pistils shriveled and the leaves are curling under.
On top of that I have 3 buckets filled and in the inoculation stage for about a week now covered so no light gets at them, and so far no fungi growth.
I have seeds germinating now for a new round, we'll see.
Damn
1st, 2 of my 3 plants went male on me, now the last one is getting hermies. I do not know what the stress would have been, and I don't have any light leaks. So I pulled off all I could find, and I sprayed with REVERSE and all the pistils shriveled and the leaves are curling under.
On top of that I have 3 buckets filled and in the inoculation stage for about a week now covered so no light gets at them, and so far no fungi growth.
I have seeds germinating now for a new round, we'll see.
Wow, McD. You are getting all the bad juju here. I'm personally thinking the best way to go is clones. Clearly shooting for "all females" from seed in the best case scenario means you have some feminized males that may break loose and hermie later.
So you could do one of three things:
#1 Plant seeds and sex them after 4-6 weeks. The upside is you have 100% ID on sex. Downside is you have the plant growing for a month outside the OBBT. I wasn't crazy about that.
#2 Use Ethylene, Cytokinin, etc to suppress male-ness, but I'm not sure if feminized males really ever crank it out like a true female. And you don't have 100% odds. Clearly a potential there, but as LadyL has said, the total picture of what she's doing is not known.
#3 Use female clones. Start them in the fashion of your choice and place in the OBBT. You'd need to maintain mothers or have access to clones.
I'm going to try and keep a mother or two. I tried to re-veg a female after harvest and was not successful, but clearly people do it all the time.
I'm going to try and maintain a mother or two.
So you could do one of three things:
#1 Plant seeds and sex them after 4-6 weeks. The upside is you have 100% ID on sex. Downside is you have the plant growing for a month outside the OBBT. I wasn't crazy about that.
#2 Use Ethylene, Cytokinin, etc to suppress male-ness, but I'm not sure if feminized males really ever crank it out like a true female. And you don't have 100% odds. Clearly a potential there, but as LadyL has said, the total picture of what she's doing is not known.
#3 Use female clones. Start them in the fashion of your choice and place in the OBBT. You'd need to maintain mothers or have access to clones.
I'm going to try and keep a mother or two. I tried to re-veg a female after harvest and was not successful, but clearly people do it all the time.
I'm going to try and maintain a mother or two.
McDanger
Member
Thanks rrog, I used the cytokinin and made up the veg foliar spray that LL talked about. I have a real nice purple wreck plant that is almost done now in soil that I think I am going to try and reveg to use as a mother if she lives.( I've failed twice at reveg attempts) I figure there is nothing to lose by trying.
One question I have about the medium is, will the mycelium network die off if it uses up whatever it is eating? How long would that take?
I have 3 buckets that have been inoculating for at least 10 days now and I cannot see any growth. I mixed this up earlier dry and let it sit in the mixing tub until I needed it, but now it does not seem to be doing anything. This is the same mix as last time and it worked great before.
One question I have about the medium is, will the mycelium network die off if it uses up whatever it is eating? How long would that take?
I have 3 buckets that have been inoculating for at least 10 days now and I cannot see any growth. I mixed this up earlier dry and let it sit in the mixing tub until I needed it, but now it does not seem to be doing anything. This is the same mix as last time and it worked great before.
so i have been reading the threads about these systems and am very confused. I have never grown organically before and i would like to.
i am thinking of using the
5 gallon buckets with overflow protection and drain valves.
hydroton for the bath
myco madness for the microbes!
I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT SOIL TO USE!?!
are there any store bought products that i can easily use and mix easily.
sorry if i have missed some really obvious info.
i am thinking of using the
5 gallon buckets with overflow protection and drain valves.
hydroton for the bath
myco madness for the microbes!
I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT SOIL TO USE!?!
are there any store bought products that i can easily use and mix easily.
sorry if i have missed some really obvious info.
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