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Cloning Failing? Tried Everything? Found the missing link?
- Thread starter Herborizer
- Start date
I get 100% off most strains.
how long does a 1 gal container of this blend last?
1 gram calcium hypochlorite in tap water in a capped gallon jug. Is it based on exposure to air and the duration of the container being open?
Anyone know the science behind it?
its an equilibrium reaction... mostly driven by ph. when you lower the ph more hypochlorous acid is held in solution with less elemental chlorine being lost to the atmosphere.
if you lower the ph of your solution it would last longer, but not forever. just use sodium hypochlorite though.
its already ph stabilized and if kept in dark relativly cool places it should last a very very long time.
i have like 3 books under my desk that go over this in extensive detail... if you are really interested i can photocopy a few sheets for you.
DEATH BY SNUSNU
Member
Cloning is not natural,
Really? So Mr deer or bear comes along and starts chowing down on a patch of
Gange or hell rabbits , they leave a mess ( lol) , you don't think any of those downed but still living stems on a lush humic surface could could sprout roots. I feel if it wasn't natural it wouldn't be a thing. Have you ever known someone with tamarisk trees aka salt cedar? This tree has the ability to regenerate rhizomes from the most beat up of looking chunks. Example a piece of firewood left behind and boom roots from dead chunks.
The cut wants to live, its part of the plan man!
Really? So Mr deer or bear comes along and starts chowing down on a patch of
Gange or hell rabbits , they leave a mess ( lol) , you don't think any of those downed but still living stems on a lush humic surface could could sprout roots. I feel if it wasn't natural it wouldn't be a thing. Have you ever known someone with tamarisk trees aka salt cedar? This tree has the ability to regenerate rhizomes from the most beat up of looking chunks. Example a piece of firewood left behind and boom roots from dead chunks.
The cut wants to live, its part of the plan man!
Cadfael
Active member
Great idea. and great thread. I used to be on the edge of the tap water system, so had a bunch of friends on well water. They called me "The clone King." I had no idea why.
Moved to a place on a well. Been having a problem with cloning ever since.
Don't have shock laying around. Took out my Clorox (8%). Read the clorox website. trying 1/2 teaspoon (tsp) to 5 gallons. This is the recommended dosage for disinfecting water for drinking. Let stand 30 minutes for residence time. I can always increase the dosage. Will post findings when I have more info.
At the above rate, 1 gallon of 8% clorox would treat 6500 gallons of water.
Thanks
PS. On lighting: I found that T5's and T8's were too light intense. Had better results when I went back to good old T12's.
Moved to a place on a well. Been having a problem with cloning ever since.
Don't have shock laying around. Took out my Clorox (8%). Read the clorox website. trying 1/2 teaspoon (tsp) to 5 gallons. This is the recommended dosage for disinfecting water for drinking. Let stand 30 minutes for residence time. I can always increase the dosage. Will post findings when I have more info.
At the above rate, 1 gallon of 8% clorox would treat 6500 gallons of water.
Thanks
PS. On lighting: I found that T5's and T8's were too light intense. Had better results when I went back to good old T12's.
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people on wells should be dosing chlorine imho. its quite trivial, just a 100 dollar pump coupled to the relay that drives your well pump.
peace of mind imo. shallow wells can become contaminated, old wells too, but its mostly old shitty plumbing allowing water infiltration during periods of no water pressure.
peace of mind imo. shallow wells can become contaminated, old wells too, but its mostly old shitty plumbing allowing water infiltration during periods of no water pressure.
CoCoColaClassic
Member
This is an old post, but for those struggling, I solved all my problems w/ PermaClone collars and methods. Here's some pics for the skeptics. You can see my shit on cococolaclassic on IG if you want more proof.
https://www.permaclone.com/blogs/news/the-3-reasons-clones-fail
https://www.permaclone.com/blogs/news/sterilizable-collars-permaclone-has-your-answers
https://www.permaclone.com/blogs/news/advanced-cloning-tips-tricks
https://www.permaclone.com/blogs/news/the-3-reasons-clones-fail
https://www.permaclone.com/blogs/news/sterilizable-collars-permaclone-has-your-answers
https://www.permaclone.com/blogs/news/advanced-cloning-tips-tricks
Pool shock does work wonders for hydro. Improved my roots health in RDWC more than anything...and I tried just about everything fighting iron bacteria in my well water.
For me, the missing link with cloning turned out to be humidity. Fought slime in my aerocloner etc. before I had the water squared away, but still didn't have 100% success rate. Added a fogger and literally haven't lost a single clone, other than from neglect. For any strains that are giving me problems in rockwool, I also root successfully in plain ozone treated RO rotor. They need transplanted asap though. I don't use any gel now, seemed to have a % that would 'damp off'.
In an ideal scenario, i'll soak the cubes in a 5.5pH solution with some IBA&NAA. If I dont have time, i'll simply soak them in some of my (fairly week) recirculating veg solution, which has all of the goodies.
Bottom line, if you are growing and trying to clone outside of ideal growing conditions, that may well be your problem.
For me, the missing link with cloning turned out to be humidity. Fought slime in my aerocloner etc. before I had the water squared away, but still didn't have 100% success rate. Added a fogger and literally haven't lost a single clone, other than from neglect. For any strains that are giving me problems in rockwool, I also root successfully in plain ozone treated RO rotor. They need transplanted asap though. I don't use any gel now, seemed to have a % that would 'damp off'.
In an ideal scenario, i'll soak the cubes in a 5.5pH solution with some IBA&NAA. If I dont have time, i'll simply soak them in some of my (fairly week) recirculating veg solution, which has all of the goodies.
Bottom line, if you are growing and trying to clone outside of ideal growing conditions, that may well be your problem.
Can of Bliss
Member
I had lots of problems with cloning too. For me there was no magic bullet. Mostly it came down to knowing how much to poke at them. Poke at them too much they die, ignore them too much they die. Had the same problem with seedlings when I first started, it just takes some trial and error.
If your well smells like sulfur that is what is killing your clones and would also be screwing up your grow. I switched to my well I had in a backyard for two grows and that was my introduction to crop failures and not to fucking change anything if it isn't broke. Get the water tested it could be lots of other things as well.
I struggled with cloning for years, from aero to rw to peat plugs o rapid rooters.
Everything mushed and died.
I found that using one product has changed the game for me. Nearly 100% success now.
I use a product by the Flying Skull called Z7. Its a 2 part enzyme product.
1st part is he enzymes, 2nd is Citric acid.
I use it @.5ml/gallon of each part every 3-4 days in the aerocloner and no more snot or mush!
I tried the sterile route, Heisenberg tea route and every other trick in the book.
This shit works for me and everybody with the same problems that I turned onto the product.
I haven't used any pool shock in forever , I even dumped my stock solution if it because I nverr need it anymore.
Shit, I go months in between cloner cleanings now , it's almost criminal.
Srsly tho, y'all know me, I'm no shill.
But this shit works to keep th nasties at bay.
Everything mushed and died.
I found that using one product has changed the game for me. Nearly 100% success now.
I use a product by the Flying Skull called Z7. Its a 2 part enzyme product.
1st part is he enzymes, 2nd is Citric acid.
I use it @.5ml/gallon of each part every 3-4 days in the aerocloner and no more snot or mush!
I tried the sterile route, Heisenberg tea route and every other trick in the book.
This shit works for me and everybody with the same problems that I turned onto the product.
I haven't used any pool shock in forever , I even dumped my stock solution if it because I nverr need it anymore.
Shit, I go months in between cloner cleanings now , it's almost criminal.
Srsly tho, y'all know me, I'm no shill.
But this shit works to keep th nasties at bay.
Sorry to Unearth a very old thread but i really need to know to answer to this! did your 400 Mv result in repeatable cloning? 780 mv gave me rock hard stems but no roots and what looked like serious chlorine phytoxicity. I see other members maintaining orp of roughly 400 through flower with ozone. Any of you guys have any cloning knowledge to lend with ORP management?
When you said that the dose of clear rez set you at 400 mv that got me really thinking. Hopeful to hear back
orp is just a proxy for free chlorine.
you are better off just using cheap reagent test kits to read free chlorine.
you are better off just using cheap reagent test kits to read free chlorine.
ORP is notoriously difficult to measure reliably.
its usefull in that its a easy measurement to make in a given online process( as opposed to 5 min intervals with reagent titrators)... but it is infact effected by PH and temperature hence you often see 2,000 dollar ORP sensor packages that include a thermistor and a PH electrode.
there is a reason that they still use reagent based free chlorine auto titrator analyzers for disinfection monitoring in waste water treatment.
you want to look at free chlorine only...
total chlorine is all species of chlorine both the active hypochlorous acid species and the hypochlorite AND the chlorine species you dont care about( unless you are talking about a swimming pool) like chloramines( di tri and mono).
basically free chlorine is JUST the active disinfectant residual.
combined chlorine is (usually) the chloramine species.
total chlorine is free chlorine + combiend chlorine.
sometimes people use total and combined chlorine interchangeably... so watch out for that i guess.
the reason why these test strips include combined chlorine or total chlorine is becasue in pools the presence of excessive chloramine species indicates lots of organics present.
when you have lots of chloramine you need to superchlorinte your pool by adding an excess of free chlorine to fully oxidize these organics and remove the chloramine.
chloramine species are also responsible for pool water chlorine stink, so there's that aesthetic aspect too... but chloramine is generally thought to be bad for you so it has to be removed from your pool.
I appreciate the response and obviously educated dialogue. I have to further disagree though. I find my ex tech orp meter a very useful and effecient tool for my uses. It requires no packets and self calibrates. Use in tandem with a reliable ph meter and I find this is the best way to roll. Look around the web and you'll see that CC recommends orp meter/controller with an ozone generator. This seems to be best practice, I'm hoping to baby step toward this by first using the orp with the free clorine. Not that this is best practice. Cheers!
like i was saying, orp is really only useful in online processes where you are measuring constantly.
in your case i would say that ORP is probably not that bad of an idea TBH, as im guessing you are running your ozone in a PID control scheme and your volume is probably turning over very rapidly. especially if your sensors are not that expensive.
the problem with ORP is the sensor maintenance though, its really no different from PH sensors so i dont understand how you can claim its self calibrating...
there ARE special flow cells for ph and orp instruments that can self calibrate sensors on regular intervals... but mostly these sensors are either pipe saddle mounted or mounted on retrievable masts.
calibration is usually done in the field with good quality buffers, and maintiance( far less frequent) involves electrolyte refills, washing and maby reetching the glass membranes, replacment salt bridges etc.
auto titrator analyzers on the other hand can run for months and months just needing bottle exchanges. yea eventually you need to remove the cuvette and clean it out and check out the LED and detector, replace tubing etc, but these systems are so stupid simple they tend to run unattended for very long periods without any serious maintenance.
they are not cheap btw, very espensive. im not reccomending them for sanitizing your grow system.
in my opinion you dont need a full blast automated disinfection system... IMO you can just pump bleach at set intervals with a solenoid pump and achieve more than satisfactory results. dont get me wrong... i think your system is cool, just unnecessary.
periodic cleaning of your equipment and periodic dosing up to 2-10 mg/l around twice a day should keep algae at bay provided you are not outdoors or something with LOTS of sun and heat.
in your case i would say that ORP is probably not that bad of an idea TBH, as im guessing you are running your ozone in a PID control scheme and your volume is probably turning over very rapidly. especially if your sensors are not that expensive.
the problem with ORP is the sensor maintenance though, its really no different from PH sensors so i dont understand how you can claim its self calibrating...
there ARE special flow cells for ph and orp instruments that can self calibrate sensors on regular intervals... but mostly these sensors are either pipe saddle mounted or mounted on retrievable masts.
calibration is usually done in the field with good quality buffers, and maintiance( far less frequent) involves electrolyte refills, washing and maby reetching the glass membranes, replacment salt bridges etc.
auto titrator analyzers on the other hand can run for months and months just needing bottle exchanges. yea eventually you need to remove the cuvette and clean it out and check out the LED and detector, replace tubing etc, but these systems are so stupid simple they tend to run unattended for very long periods without any serious maintenance.
they are not cheap btw, very espensive. im not reccomending them for sanitizing your grow system.
in my opinion you dont need a full blast automated disinfection system... IMO you can just pump bleach at set intervals with a solenoid pump and achieve more than satisfactory results. dont get me wrong... i think your system is cool, just unnecessary.
periodic cleaning of your equipment and periodic dosing up to 2-10 mg/l around twice a day should keep algae at bay provided you are not outdoors or something with LOTS of sun and heat.
pm when ever you want. ill get back to you soon as i can.
