Ceramic Metal Halide (CMH)

[adilerr]

area? they both will be in roughly a 4x4 area....
as for no match.... I'm gonna be the judge of that, what are your expectations, stoogots?

What are YOUR expectations, sir?
1000w HPS provides ~2000 umol/s, where the Agro 315w provides 600 umol/s.
Sure, numbers are just numbers - but do you really think the 315w can come close?

I'm beginning to doubt my choice of 315w CDM for a 35" x 20" tent, would you suggest going with 210w bulb instead?

 

[redclover]

What are YOUR expectations, sir?
1000w HPS provides ~2000 umol/s, where the Agro 315w provides 600 umol/s.
Sure, numbers are just numbers - but do you really think the 315w can come close?

I'm beginning to doubt my choice of 315w CDM for a 35" x 20" tent, would you suggest going with 210w bulb instead?

A 1000w Horti gives you a touch over 1000 umol/s with VERY LITTLE CRI! Are you talking about the Philips DE 1000w Greenpower?

 

[Avinash.miles]

What are YOUR expectations, sir?
1000w HPS provides ~2000 umol/s, where the Agro 315w provides 600 umol/s.
Sure, numbers are just numbers - but do you really think the 315w can come close?

I'm beginning to doubt my choice of 315w CDM for a 35" x 20" tent, would you suggest going with 210w bulb instead?

i'm suspending expectation and doing a comparison for the simple sake of comparison.
as for coming close, I'd have to defer to people who have run the 315w before before making my up my mind whether they can perform similarly.

perhaps if I chose a 600w hps to compare to y'all would like that better?


I do what i do, and will share the results and my experiences to the best of my ability with y'all.
I"m here to learn and share, not to prove anything.

 

[rives]

For those of you who already run the PGZX18 lamp, I need your help! On the bulb itself, which of the contact points is considered "center" (meaning, red wire from ballast) and which is "outer" (blue wire from ballast)?
I ask because the lamp holder I got isn't color coded (both wires are white), and the wiring diagram (#9) refers to mogul/Edison base:
View Image

The red wire will go to the electrode with the flat on it, and the blue to the round one. I don't think that it would make much difference with a PGZX18 socket - on the Edison sockets, the center electrode is hot because it is harder to accidentally touch. It's easier to come into contact with the screw-in shell and give yourself a jolt if it was connected to hot wire.

 

[bigshrimp]

Having some lack of stretch problems with the 860w lol

I'm either going to go for a more stadium type grow or have to stop topping my plants.

View image in gallery​

Same strain - first one has gotten its whole flower so far in mixed spectrum and the second really only has finished under the cmh.

View image in gallery​

View image in gallery​

 

[adilerr]

redclover - I wasn't referring to the DE GreenPower directly, but yes - it produces ~2100 umol/s
Other lamps such as the 1000w Lumitek or Sunmaster 2100K produce ~1800 umol/s

Avinash.miles - I was just trying to figure out your motive, curiosity is a wonderful thing!

rives - exactly the info I was looking for, thank you!

 

[redclover]

Avin...You'd have to compare it to a 600HPS to make it fair. I'd assume two 315s would crush one 600.

Bigbulb Bigshrimp! I'm waiting on my replacement due to the coil coming loose around the core. It'll be too much for me in the summer though.

So before I go ordering, I have some more stupid questions. I'm stuck on vert growing as the kits cost too much atm. What are better bulbs for bloom...elite 930, the elite agro T12, or the 315w greenpower? What ballasts, besides the kits, use 120v?! I'd appreciate any help!

 

[rives]

I think that AM's experiment will be very interesting. I know that Tenthirty had been using 600w HPSs before switching to 315's, and he found that a single 315 would outproduce a 600, with higher quality.

I'm convinced that our current set of performance metrics for assessing lights does not accurately reflect the whole picture. I've expounded on this a bit in another thread, but it seems to me that we are measuring a variety of things that don't really capture the essence of the plant's needs. PAR is a step in the right direction, but our understanding of plant's ability to process light is still so rudimentary that I think that we are happily chasing down things that match our paradigm rather than what is really taking place.

 

[adilerr]

So before I go ordering, I have some more stupid questions. I'm stuck on vert growing as the kits cost too much atm. What are better bulbs for bloom...elite 930, the elite agro T12, or the 315w greenpower? What ballasts, besides the kits, use 120v?! I'd appreciate any help!

Agro=GreenPower, same bulb - 2 names.
That will be your best choice since it is marketed as horticulture bulb (not talking from experience, just logic).

 

[redclover]

The 120v ballast kit should be available by end of this week or early next week. Think Tom told me around $220 for ballast kit with 930/942 bulb. http://advancedtechlighting.com/
You could always use me as a reference

 

[Avinash.miles]

Avin...You'd have to compare it to a 600HPS to make it fair. I'd assume two 315s would crush one 600.

thanks for your input.
I never said it was a fair comparison, just a comparison.

matched wattage would def be in the CMH favor i assume as well.

I use 1k w hps lites primarily in my gardens, therefore I would like to see the comparison for my own knowledge and experience.

 

[staank]

The 120v ballast kit should be available by end of this week or early next week. Think Tom told me around $220 for ballast kit with 930/942 bulb. http://advancedtechlighting.com/
You could always use me as a reference

This is relevant to my interests.

 

[redclover]

I was 'told' that the elite 930s are supposed to replace the elite Agros. I see they have a very similar spectrum but the Agros have 3x's the intensity. The 930/942s also don't need a special socket. They do sell an extension for better bulb placement in a hood.

I want to do a double yoyo vert with two 315s in a 5x5 on a light mover. Just haven't decided on bulbs.

 

[Jhhnn]

The red wire will go to the electrode with the flat on it, and the blue to the round one. I don't think that it would make much difference with a PGZX18 socket - on the Edison sockets, the center electrode is hot because it is harder to accidentally touch. It's easier to come into contact with the screw-in shell and give yourself a jolt if it was connected to hot wire.

Thanks for that. Reverse polarity sockets are not uncommon in older homes, even reverse polarity through the switch, making the socket shell hot all the time. Nasty biters, for sure.

I encountered just that years ago when changing a bulb in our pre-1900 dwelling. Started out with gas lights, then ceramic tube & post, then BX, now fully modern. That particular jolt served as inspiration to finish the job.

 

[adilerr]

Let me share this info I got after many hours of googling.

The MW (medium wattage) CDM bulbs are available in 3 spectrum -
942 (the 9 digit represent the CRI rating, ~90, color temp is 4200K)
930 (3100K)
Agro/GreenPower (3100K/3200K, inconsistent info in Philips docs, some list 3100K while others list 3200K - all share the same SKU: 415216)

3 base types -
PGZ18 - unprotected, single jacket T9 bulb
PGZX18 - protected, double jacket T12 bulb
EX39 - protected, edison bulb (315w=ed37, 210w=ed28)

PGZ18 is used on enclosed luminaires, so you can use an unprotected bulb (in case it explodes).
You can use a PGZX18 bulb in either PGZX18/PGZ18 sockets, but you can't use a PGZ18 bulb in a PGZX18 socket.

The EX39 base will fit into any mogul socket (E39/E40).

942 - available in all base types
930 - available in PGZ18 or PGZX18
Agro/GP - available in PGZX18 only (and no 210w version)

PAR -
942 - provides ~550 umol/s
930 - haven't found any info on it
Agro/GP - provides ~600 umol/s


Hopefully this info will clear things up, if any of the info above is wrong please correct me.

 

[rives]

Good info. Look at the date on the spec sheets - for a while it appeared that Philips was releasing a new sheet about twice a week. Lots of different information on them out there.

 

[redclover]

Let me share this info I got after many hours of googling.

The MW (medium wattage) CDM bulbs are available in 3 spectrum -
942 (the 9 digit represent the CRI rating, ~90, color temp is 4200K)
930 (3100K)
Agro/GreenPower (3100K/3200K, inconsistent info in Philips docs, some list 3100K while others list 3200K - all share the same SKU: 415216)

3 base types -
PGZ18 - unprotected, single jacket T9 bulb
PGZX18 - protected, double jacket T12 bulb
EX39 - protected, edison bulb (315w=ed37, 210w=ed28)

PGZ18 is used on enclosed luminaires, so you can use an unprotected bulb (in case it explodes).
You can use a PGZX18 bulb in either PGZX18/PGZ18 sockets, but you can't use a PGZ18 bulb in a PGZX18 socket.

The EX39 base will fit into any mogul socket (E39/E40).

942 - available in all base types
930 - available in PGZ18 or PGZX18
Agro/GP - available in PGZX18 only (and no 210w version)

PAR -
942 - provides ~550 umol/s
930 - haven't found any info on it
Agro/GP - provides ~600 umol/s


Hopefully this info will clear things up, if any of the info above is wrong please correct me.

Thanks for the effort! After a quick double check I found the 930s are best for bloom (more deep red) @ 1.9 umol/sec...whatever that converts to.

 

[redclover]

Might be getting an irresistible deal from china town http://welthink.en.alibaba.com/prod...ast_for_Philips_Elite_Agro_315W_CMH_Lamp.html
What y'all think?

 

[staank]

Might be getting an irresistible deal from china town http://welthink.en.alibaba.com/prod...ast_for_Philips_Elite_Agro_315W_CMH_Lamp.html
What y'all think?

If you can find a ballast that is actually UL listed from Alibaba, I think lots of people would be all over that.
I know they say they are, but in my experience, its "other products, not this one, if demand is great we will get it done".

 

[redclover]

If you can find a ballast that is actually UL listed from Alibaba, I think lots of people would be all over that.
I know they say they are, but in my experience, its "other products, not this one, if demand is great we will get it done".

Philips rep is swamped. They need to hire more people. The 120v kit is all rigged up, and you'd have to splice your socket cable. I don't mind wiring if it'll save me $$$. I'll get more details this weekend.