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Ceramic Metal Halide (CMH)

MostHigh

Member
Plant life goes nuts for blue photons. Blue photons are the premium octane fuel for plants. That's why they bend over backwards to reach it.
They do no such thing in the red. I've seen video of plants under LEDs growing away from red. To plants, red light is just simply there...they are not drawn to it as they are blue spectrum. (thats strictly an observation)

Indeed...more and more LED growers are stumped when they switch on the red bloom LED and begin wondering why the plant stops thriving. When just a hint of blue is added to those LEDs, the plants get back to business.

Plant's chemical engines are set-off by blue spectrum and ultraviolets...the only good red spectrum is doing a plant is the sheer wealth of it in the sky.
Consider MJ plants grown at altitude...where they are closer to the scattered wavelengths of blue & ultraviolets. Those are the strains that have become legendary in our culture.

Wavelengths...longer wavelengths penetrate better in any given media. Consider harmonics. A 100dB long wavelength hits your ears, seems like a massage. When a 100dB short wavelength hits them, it feels as if your head is in a vice. Short wavelength sound waves are absolutely brutal as they head toward ultrasonic. We've all seen what happens to glass when blasted with high pitch short wavelengths eh.
Short wavelength blue spectrum is vastly more critical, and hella more stimulating to a well balanced healthy plant than long wavelength reds. Why ya think grow light manufacturers have taken to putting blue into their higher end lamps?
Frig'n HPS...the best way to make sense out of the widespread use and dumbness of HPS grows...next time you drive past one, take a look at how many burgers McDonalds has served.
Get it?
 
G

Guest

knna -

In reading this over again I can see where you acknowledge the quality of resulting plant matter. I do run a very high light density, but have allways run at 2x400 in 6.5sq feet hps first then switched to CMH. And I have run 1,025w in 12sq feet of cmh and would not even think about throwing in the hortilux hps bulbs that I have collecting dust.
 
T

TheOneWill

Well I plan on buying a cool tube with a 250watt hps ballast so I would use a 250watt CMH Horizontal bulb right?
 

simba

Sleeping Dragon
TheOne, Yes Hor for cooltube,

im out and about ill reply to others vwhen im at full KB
 
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Laura Kush

Member
Just a warning to all of you... my husband gets cold hands(I do as well) and he likes to warm his hands by the light of the CMH. Today he had a speckeled rash over the back of his right hand that he swears is from exposure to the lamp.

I can't count how many times we've both accidentally looked right at the light for several seconds. Im going to buy cheap UV resistant Sun-glasses for the grow room as were in there looking at "our babies" often and for long periods.

I suggest the rest of you take safety precautions as well.
 

gramsci.antonio

Active member
Veteran
Laura Kush said:
Just a warning to all of you... my husband gets cold hands(I do as well) and he likes to warm his hands by the light of the CMH. Today he had a speckeled rash over the back of his right hand that he swears is from exposure to the lamp.

I can't count how many times we've both accidentally looked right at the light for several seconds. Im going to buy cheap UV resistant Sun-glasses for the grow room as were in there looking at "our babies" often and for long periods.

I suggest the rest of you take safety precautions as well.

thanx for the note!
 

Deft

Get two birds stoned at once
Veteran
Glad I got the UV0 lenses for my regular glasses lol. I tested them with my black light and light that passes through them dosen't cause any florescence on bleached paper like it normally would.
 

simba

Sleeping Dragon
Knna: i like how well your arguments are articulated the short version,
philips has more cmh lamps than public knows world wide (non released lamps all mfrs do).. i have access to lamps worldwide so i have already looked at the city's and the elites and others.. not for us YET>>the 4k are the best we gots.. and thats Better than anything else IMPHO, IMPHO (personal and professionally) id sell the best.. and found it in 4k from philips
CRI, Kelvin, CCT, PPF, PAR, lumen's, any other raiting out there
MEANS DIRT TO US>>
cri is % of Nm ranges and within that a ratio to mimic nat Sunlight, However we dont want 100% that would mean un-needed energy IE wasted energy, and it would mimic the suns SPD response wich is not what we want we want reverse..(for Pushing the plant during flower)

Kelvin is only a rating of its Overal color to the human eye,, i have a few lamps that have same K rating however the SPD is Different enough that one will grow and wont at all.. ya you can get an idea but its so variable

ppf and par (ppf is philips raiting scale) and par is general.
but both rate from 400-700nm however 500-600is almost 100% not needed so any thing in that range is wasted.a real scale would be 400-500 and 600-700 (well more accurate but thats the easy numbers.within that range most horti lamps would turn to chit overnight..
yes we covered cmh does dump in that range but overall and the red and blues cover it..
Most Horti and hps have more yellow to increase lumen rating.. (adv tech even says that and those things are Philips SON-T Plus's whats that say horti lamps are just marketed for High $$
lumen.. is for humen eye more than anything..
LPW = lumen per watt again means dirt to us.. we want PPF per watt from below.
in short we need to rate in PPF however in very custom ranges ie what i say above and withing that %'s tied into for each nm range.. IE very Specific

as far as Horizontal or vertical..90% of us want Horizontal...
yes scrog u want horizontal..
vertical is when you are hanging 4 or more lamps around your grow.. not for most small ops.. and in that its Mini grows like mpl was going to do first for Verts (Mini vert scrog IE max 150watt)

in short knna as much as i respect your knowledge of lighting and plant response i think its interfering with your total call.. (as u said choice)
as much as i believe growers have a choice,
with cmh vs hps vs mh there is no choice..
so we dont want to confuse them with lamp choices that do nothing.. (
ya we love experimenters but not at the novice and even intermediate growers expense IE letting them try another lamp that Might or might not be the cats meow)

Laura... ITs bright LOL J/K
ur plant is saying the same thing.. whoa full power..
ya tell him to stay away,, is he fair-skinned.. He may not tolerate UV well. or the infrared could cooked him.. (you cant go 1inch from bulb)

im under cmh allot (i dont know the hours but i use cmh for about everything and i gots no issues.. I love the sun indoors (ya bit warmer (which we want than other Full spd lamps others saying abouts)
boing people under them 8 hours a day. not as close as we are but 8hours at 30feet or 30min at 6inches..
ya thats kinda freekey,, ur not havin the luck in the desert..

AZ what u doing,, thats just gonna scare people.. LOL J/K but does educate how the light we see is Generated and the Real root of its source..
flourecent lamps emit UV light its just that Phos on the glass that Radiates into colors we can see and block most the uv light..
MH lamps DUMP UV same with Mercury Vapor. its what mainly Excites the Salts, gasses etc..
 
I just found this great article that simplifies the situation for us. Its a very informative, interesting and brief article about the subject of usable light for plants. I highly recommend it.
http://www.agriworld.nl/public/file/pdf/20060504-fltcs7.2.pdf

So after reading that, I am left wondering what this translates to usable par light for the cmh vs say, a 1000 solarmax hps? is there some formula to posibly use.

Thanks,
payn

and if possible could u dumb it up just a tad... im having trouble deciding what is relavant, to growing better bud....
 

Pinball Wizard

The wand chooses the wizard
Veteran
Laura Kush said:
Just a warning to all of you... my husband gets cold hands(I do as well) and he likes to warm his hands by the light of the CMH. Today he had a speckeled rash over the back of his right hand that he swears is from exposure to the lamp.

I can't count how many times we've both accidentally looked right at the light for several seconds. Im going to buy cheap UV resistant Sun-glasses for the grow room as were in there looking at "our babies" often and for long periods.

I suggest the rest of you take safety precautions as well.
I agree. I burned the knuckles on my right hand. One week, later, burned my left hand knuckles before I figured it out.... :noway:
 

JohnnyToke

Member
Just what i wanted for Xmas - Hermies!

Just what i wanted for Xmas - Hermies!

My current B52 clones I posted on page 18 a week ago have all hermied....I am currently growing under cmh's. I guess it was in the Nirvana seed genetics as I have no light leaks, temp or nute problems....blah :badday:

Just what I wanted for Christmas was a harvest full of seed.... :cuss:

oh well, back to the drawing board!

JT
 
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G

Guest

JohnnyToke, maybe your clones got the holiday spirit and wanted to give you a gift?
It's the thought that counts.
 

gramsci.antonio

Active member
Veteran
JohnnyToke said:
My current B52 clones I posted on page 18 a week ago have all hermied....I am currently growing under cmh's. I guess it was in the Nirvana seed genetics as I have no light leaks, temp or nute problems....blah :badday:

Just what I wanted for Christmas was a harvest full of seed.... :cuss:

oh well, back to the drawing board!

JT

were they feminised?
 

JohnnyToke

Member
nope....not feminized. I germed 4 out of the 10 pack, got 2 females, took clones from the strongest looking of the two and threw them in the hydro system. it wasn't bananas, it was full fledge hermie male pollen sacks up and down the stalks. to many to pull off. 100's of them. It was crappy genetics.

I will let it finish out, dry it and give the crap away. sterilize the hell out of the grow space and start over next month.
 
B

Blunted22

Hey simba i got another ? for ya should i run the cmh with or without a glass hood? I would like air cool the hoods if possible but not sure how the glass would effect the lumens/spectrum if at all.
 

gramsci.antonio

Active member
Veteran
JohnnyToke said:
nope....not feminized. I germed 4 out of the 10 pack, got 2 females, took clones from the strongest looking of the two and threw them in the hydro system. it wasn't bananas, it was full fledge hermie male pollen sacks up and down the stalks. to many to pull off. 100's of them. It was crappy genetics.

I will let it finish out, dry it and give the crap away. sterilize the hell out of the grow space and start over next month.


Temps? RH? Strain?
 
G

Guest

I would like air cool the hoods if possible but not sure how the glass would effect the lumens/spectrum if at all.
About a 5% loss which is easily made up by better enviro control and the ability to get the bulbs closer to the flowers.
 
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