Can the auto-flowering thing be bred out?

[Treevly]

I am stuck this year for regular seeds because of germination failure and time constraints. However, I have some suto-flowering seeds called Cheesecake Automatic. (I have no idea what the ancestry is.) If I use these as my pollen producers and cross it with my particular Kush, should I be able to breed the auto out of it in a couple or a few generations? I have particular traits that I want in the final product, and auto isn't one of them, but I could deal with it for a couple of generations.
Thanks for any advice.

 

[f-e]

Well it takes a few generations to get the auto part to stick. I imagine half your offspring would be semi auto. Then the next gen on them, half would be fast.

Cheesecake. I think we might be able to guess. Have you tried cheese? Some regs are just a postman away.

 

[goingrey]

Yes.

First generation of the cross will have no auto flowering plants but will still have the recessive gene hiding in there.

You can breed it out entirely with plants from the second generation if you know which ones (don't) have the recessive gene, of course how do you if it does? Would have to cross to an auto and see what if any of the children are autos or something.

Anyway long story short look up Punnett squares.

 

[f-e]

Yes.

First generation of the cross will have no auto flowering plants but will still have the recessive gene hiding in there.

You can breed it out entirely with plants from the second generation if you know which ones (don't) have the recessive gene, of course how do you if it does? Would have to cross to an auto and see what if any of the children are autos or something.

Anyway long story short look up Punnett squares.

Non? I thought it might be easy to knock it back out of them, but imagined a 50/50 success rate.
I have never taken it out.

 

[AllStuff420]

I am stuck this year for regular seeds because of germination failure and time constraints. However, I have some suto-flowering seeds called Cheesecake Automatic. (I have no idea what the ancestry is.) If I use these as my pollen producers and cross it with my particular Kush, should I be able to breed the auto out of it in a couple or a few generations? I have particular traits that I want in the final product, and auto isn't one of them, but I could deal with it for a couple of generations.
Thanks for any advice.

Well, for one, the thing is that an advantage of breeding for a recessive trait is that all autoflowering plants will have been true-bred for autoflowering. Other than that, it can be bred together to produce more autoflowering seeds. I hope you take note of those things. Have a great day!

 

[brock1]

All I can say is if its got lowryder in I have never managed to breed it out so good luck.

 

[highfidelity]

I'm hoping to be able to breed out the autoflower trait from a fem cbg auto my buddy gave me seeds from and create a cbg dominant photoperiod. My plan of attack is:

1. Pollinate cbg auto with photo male of choice
2. Grow out those "F1" in 20/4 and cull any autoflowers. Switch to 16/8 and cull any semi-autos.
3. Do selection if desired theoretically looking for plants that express more traits of the cbg line than the photo pollen donor.
4. Flower out in 12/12 and open pollinate the plants that are left or flower out the males based on preflowers, gather pollen and mix it, then flowering and pollinating the females.
5. Collect seed and repeat steps 2-5 until you have things stabilized.

I've never taken on a project like this I've only done pollen chucking. I know there's also cbg photoperiods I could buy but what's the fun in that?

 

[brock1]

I'm hoping to be able to breed out the autoflower trait from a fem cbg auto my buddy gave me seeds from and create a cbg dominant photoperiod. My plan of attack is:

1. Pollinate cbg auto with photo male of choice
2. Grow out those "F1" in 20/4 and cull any autoflowers. Switch to 16/8 and cull any semi-autos.
3. Do selection if desired theoretically looking for plants that express more traits of the cbg line than the photo pollen donor.
4. Flower out in 12/12 and open pollinate the plants that are left or flower out the males based on preflowers, gather pollen and mix it, then flowering and pollinating the females.
5. Collect seed and repeat steps 2-5 until you have things stabilized.

I've never taken on a project like this I've only done pollen chucking. I know there's also cbg photoperiods I could buy but what's the fun in that?

All I am going to say is many have tried and all have failed that I am aware of so good luck with that project

 

[highfidelity]

All I am going to say is many have tried and all have failed that I am aware of so good luck with that project

Yea its much more likely to be a failure and learning experience than a sucess but it's not my main project by any means just something on the side for fun.

 

[sativaman514]

I am stuck this year for regular seeds because of germination failure and time constraints. However, I have some suto-flowering seeds called Cheesecake Automatic. (I have no idea what the ancestry is.) If I use these as my pollen producers and cross it with my particular Kush, should I be able to breed the auto out of it in a couple or a few generations? I have particular traits that I want in the final product, and auto isn't one of them, but I could deal with it for a couple of generations.
Thanks for any advice.

Auto flowering is a recessive gene. Therefore, it should not be present as soon as in the first gen F1. Eliminating the auto flowering out of the equation will be the easy part. Preserving those *particular traits* like smell or taste will be a bigger challenge. Luckily, your kush comes from a homozygously bred strain or backcross.

 

[brock1]

Auto flowering is a recessive gene. Therefore, it should not be present as soon as in the first gen F1. Eliminating the auto flowering out of the equation will be the easy part. Preserving those *particular traits* like smell or taste will be a bigger challenge. Luckily, your kush comes from a homozygously bred strain or backcross.

Auto flowering is a mutation not a recessive gene. Its a dominant gene thats why if your been it into a line it becomes dominant. The reason you don't see it in any F1 is because it functions like a hybrid and uses the healthy gene over the dominant mutation. Auto flowering is nothing like breeding recessive genes wich in my opinion requires a lot more knowledge in breeding.

 

[marijuanamat]

You can breed most of the auto trait out, but you might get the odd 1 pop up occasionally, once it's in the DNA it's in there. It's not a mutation, ruderalis is its own subspecies, Cannabis Sativa var Ruderalis I've messed about with it and i do not like it at all, i was gifted Mossys gem from mossy and i found it you start them in small pots they flower very quick and very small 5in but if you let the roots spread out you get plants about 1ft tall as you can see in these pics.

 

[BMG]

F1 it and then select for ones that are photo dependent

 

[brock1]

You can breed most of the auto trait out, but you might get the odd 1 pop up occasionally, once it's in the DNA it's in there. It's not a mutation, ruderalis is its own subspecies, Cannabis Sativa var Ruderalis I've messed about with it and i do not like it at all, i was gifted Mossys gem from mossy and i found it you start them in small pots they flower very quick and very small 5in but if you let the roots spread out you get plants about 1ft tall as you can see in these pics.

Yes it is a mutation. I can post a link to a document explaining it. Its a mutation that can pop up in most cannabis not just Ruderalis usually when in breed.

In Ruderalis the auto trait studied by ncbi.nlm.nih.gov photo neutral was found to be caused by. GAGANTEA (GI) binding CLYING DOF FACTOR1 causing a over expression of GI in the KKF1 mutation. This causes early flowering (photo neutral) through excessive producing of CDF protein. Hope that help the needs.

 

[goingrey]

Yes it is a mutation. I can post a link to a document explaining it. Its a mutation that can pop up in most cannabis not just Ruderalis usually when in breed.

In Ruderalis the auto trait studied by ncbi.nlm.nih.gov photo neutral was found to be caused by. GAGANTEA (GI) binding CLYING DOF FACTOR1 causing a over expression of GI in the KKF1 mutation. This causes early flowering (photo neutral) through excessive producing of CDF protein. Hope that help the needs.

Please post a link to the document if you can find it, would be interesting for sure.

Could it be a matter of semantics? I mean mutations are how new subspecies' emerge, and and the "healthy gene" being expressed over the mutation sure sounds like one is dominant and one (the mutation) recessive...

 

[troutman]

Keep selecting and breeding with plants that don't autoflower.

 

[marijuanamat]

You can get photo plants to auto if you leave them pot/root bound .

 

[Cerathule]

Yes it is a mutation. I can post a link to a document explaining it. Its a mutation that can pop up in most cannabis not just Ruderalis usually when in breed.

In Ruderalis the auto trait studied by ncbi.nlm.nih.gov photo neutral was found to be caused by. GAGANTEA (GI) binding CLYING DOF FACTOR1 causing a over expression of GI in the KKF1 mutation. This causes early flowering (photo neutral) through excessive producing of CDF protein. Hope that help the needs.

Do you perhaps mean
"GIGANTEA" (GI)
and
"CYCLING DOF FACTOR1" (CDF1)
?

 

[marijuanamat]

Yes it is a mutation. I can post a link to a document explaining it. Its a mutation that can pop up in most cannabis not just Ruderalis usually when in breed.

In Ruderalis the auto trait studied by ncbi.nlm.nih.gov photo neutral was found to be caused by. GAGANTEA (GI) binding CLYING DOF FACTOR1 causing a over expression of GI in the KKF1 mutation. This causes early flowering (photo neutral) through excessive producing of CDF protein. Hope that help the needs.

That may be the case with non ruderalis plants that will put out the auto-flower mutation from time to time as i've seen it myself. Most plants used in hemp seed, oil, fibre & CBD production have it as well as being 100% monecious, so never bred from hemp seed. The only good use for hemp seed is fishing, after it has been boiled and simmered until the seeds split. Cracking bait for roach and bang tidy for getting carp into a feeding frenzy..lol

 

[Deloris]

I am stuck this year for regular seeds because of germination failure and time constraints. However, I have some suto-flowering seeds called Cheesecake Automatic. (I have no idea what the ancestry is.) If I use these as my pollen producers and cross it with my particular Kush, should I be able to breed the auto geometry dash lite out of it in a couple or a few generations? I have particular traits that I want in the final product, and auto isn't one of them, but I could deal with it for a couple of generations.
Thanks for any advice.

You can just order any regular autoflower seeds and grow them out, pollinate those females with the male pollen and get hundreds and hundreds of new regular autoflowering seeds.