BigTokes ~ "How-To" Of The Bio-Buckets 101

[Guest]

you said you use straight tap water? doesn't the chlorine in the tap water kill some of the bacteria that you are trying to keep, I know it does in my fish tank, what about using some fish tank water to start the bacteria,kind of like yeast in bread. or is it the wrong kind?

 

[BigToke]

BigTokes -- Bio-Buckets!!

BigTokes -- Bio-Buckets!!

Hillbilly – how’s it going dude, let’s brake the ice and get right down to it and get the hands dirty:

doesn't the chlorine in the tap water kill some of the bacteria that you are trying to keep, I know it does in my fish tank, what about using some fish tank water to start the bacteria

the answer to your question is yes & no

let me explain: after filling your Bio-System up with fresh tap-water the chlorine is a bit to high for the Beneficial Bacterium to forum, that is the reason that I encourage people to let the Bio-System set and run 24/7 for two weeks before putting there plants in the system, (depending upon the size of your Bio-System and the amount of fresh air you have circulating in the grow/room,) after the Beneficial Bacterium has colonized throughout the Bio-System what little tap-water with chlorine gets into the system will not effect the Beneficial Bacterium, because that it has already established a foot hold throughout the Bio-System and is deeply colonized in the pores of the lava rock: I have personally overseen Bio-Grows in other grow-ops than mine, I have witnessed as they have done parcel Bio-System flushes plus a complete full flush of the Bio-System (Noobe’s!!! they panic to easy!!) the systems would have failed if it were not for the safe guards that I implemented (8” net-pots) within just 24 hours of refilling the Bio-System back up with fresh tap-water the Beneficial Bacterium were able to overcome the chlorine refill because of the deep colonization within the 8” net-pots and wile that I have NEVER lost a crop or failed to produce great yields, I do believe that it is due to the fact that these singled-cell microorganisms; having a well designed Bio-Bucket System to fall back on helps play a roll in there speedy recover, if the system is designed right, it well provide plenty of oxygen in such a raped pace that the Beneficial Bacterium will be able to overcome most any root-rot dieses. Btw if you are wondering how to tell when your Bio-System has sufficient enough Beneficial Bacterium established or colonized, simply put your fingers into the water to test: by dipping your fingers in the water and rubbing them together, if they fill slick or slimy, you are ready, and if not you are not ready, don’t expect a great deal of slickness just a little will do.
photo:


Now let’s discuss the good and the bad of using plane old tap-water, after that the system has now been established and the Beneficial Bacterium has a foot-hold in the system, let’s look at what happens when a little amount of chlorine-tap-water is added on a daily basis, first the chlorine is going to assist the BB in fitting off the bad fungi (algae) and here’s how it does that, first we need to understand that chlorine manly attacks the multi-cell bacteria such as algae, the Beneficial Bacterium that we are harboring and colonizing is a single-cell bacteria that not only lives in the pores of the lava rock but because of there microscopic size can even penetrate the fibrous roots themselves, thereby the chlorine that is introduced into the Bio-System will attack the multi-celled bacteria first and thereby using up what little chlorine is introduced to the system. Now on the other hand if you use something like H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide) in the Bio-System you will be successful in killing all bacteria in the system, hydrogen peroxide will penetrate the lava rocks and the fibrous roots and kill even the roots also!!

I use nothing to jump start my Bio-Buckets, simply fill them up and turn on the fan’s to circulate fresh air in the grow/room, let set for one to two weeks and your ready to go; no need to get complicated with this thing but if you wont I suppose there are products out there that would do the trick for you but most importantly hillbilly remember were not raising fish were growing huge mj plants!! This changes every thing.
Photo:


Chloramines or Chlorine? Different water companies uses different stuff, let’s discuss:

Chloramines?​

OVERVIEW
When chlorine is added to a water supply containing certain organics, the formation of halogenated organics occurs. Called "trihalogenated methanes" (THM's) these reaction products are suspected carcinogens and maximum allowable limits in municipal supplies are imposed by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA). To reduce the potential for the formation of THM's, many U.S. municipal supplies are converting their chlorine (Cl2) disinfection method to chloramine addition. Chloramines have a low potential to form THM's.

WHAT ARE THEY?
Chloramines are biocides. Like Cl2 they are oxidants and kill bacteria by penetrating their cell walls and disrupting their metabolism. Chloramines are, however, much slower to "react". They remain as residual ("unused") in water being consumed as they come in contact with bacteria or break down over time as a matter of course. As with chlorine, municipalities aim for I to 2 mg/l (ppm) chloramine residual in the potable water supply.

THEIR CHEMISTRY
Chloramines are typically generated on-site by the addition of ammonia (NH3) to water containing free C12 (HOCl or OCl depending upon the pH of the water). The optimum reaction pH is on the alkaline side, pH 8.4 (i.e., NH3 (aq) + HOCI NH2Cl + H2O) Three forms of chloramine can result as well as undesirable but unavoidable interference reactions.
Organic chloramines cannot be distinguished from the other forms of chloramines with standard methods of chloramine analysis.
Chloramines are not highly disassociated (in other words only minimally ionic). That fact and their low molecular weight make them difficult to remove via RO. The monochloramine form is the best biocide, and as is noted, is the dominant specie at pH 7 and greater. Since slightly alkaline waters are less corrosive, municipalities in many cases maintain the monochloramine form and reduce corrosion potential at the same time. Note that at these alkaline pH's, chlorine exists as the hypochlorite ion (OCl) which has a higher oxidative potential than hypochlorous acid (HOCl), but is 80 to 100 times less effective as a disinfectant.
In Conclusion: The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), loves this stuff and they say it’s more safer for the environment, which mines it’s not as strong as chlorine, which is better for you, so to answer you question: Yes I thank you will be ok with your treated water.

Btw my water plant treats there water with chlorine, and that’s what my float valve it connected to, just plan old tap-water, and they do just fine.

Ps…….if you must have further proof of people using plain old tap-water look no further than my grow……..I have not begin to touch the surface of the benefits of using tap-water in the Bio-Buckets and on the other hand to use tap-water in any other system I may not recommend.

 

[pistillwhipped]

Big Toke.......You oughta be a teacher!

 

[sunnyside]

Hey Pistill....he is a teacher! I just hope he doesnt get mad at us for talkin in class. lol

 

[BigToke]

pistillwhipped – Thanks for the kind words.

Sunnyside – LOL!!!

For those of you how might still be reading this thread I have just made a very important up-date in the Reservoir Section.

 

[Roaddog]

BigToke!
I'm Roaddog. Nice to meet you!
This is great work you are doing.
I am currently about to harvest my first soil grow in 25 years and it has been fantastic. I am learning SO much from you, and others like you.

Thank You!

I am about to start my 1st ever hydro grow in 2 waterfarms I purchased,
and I know that if I get the principles down pat it will be great!

I can already tell that Bio-Buckets and your system are in my future
and i look foward to posting back and forth with you.

I will probably do 2 12 bucket systems in a basement.
Or maybe 2- 4 bucket to get the first grow under my belt, and then expand.

Good Karma to you all.

This website is awsome!!!

 

[BigToke]

How’s it going Roaddog good to meet you, glad you like the Bio-Buckets it is a fantastic hydro system to grow in, the Bio-Buckets is the first hydro system that I have every built or grown in, only one piece of advice for ya, build as many as you have room to hold because you will be amazed!! The Bio-System is so of low maintenance that you will only need to spend 5 to 10 minuets every other day and that’s only to raise your lights from the rapped growth, and bump-up your nutrients. When the time come give me a buzz and I’ll see if I can’t help ya, until then good luck with your grow and stay safe.

 

[So Quick]

Bio Buckets sounds so good together...sorta rolls off your tongue...BiO b-u-c-k-e-t....your doin an excellent job here Big!! *gives big a football smack on the ass*

SQ

 

[Ron Gotti]

hey bigtoke, how is everything goin fella? I have been reading everything on every forum for the past six months trying to figure out what system i'm goin to start with and I have to say that you make a good case for the bio bucket. I have a couple questions for you and hopefully you can help me out. I plan on growing in the low plant numbers so originally kbs growing was what i was looking at, but i have decided to mix and match some of the things that i think would work for me and this is what i came up with. I will be doing a bio bucket grow with vertical hanging lights and high wattage, the way i figure it, i should be able to pull a yield on par with a kbs system per tree with a lot less maintenence which is something that is important to me. Am i wrong in assuming this? I know you don't like to discuss yield but i recall you only using somewhere in the range of 3-4000 watts. I will be using a 6 bucket setup with 5000 watts, configured somewhat like the way that hurtback had his original design setup but with a little more spacing. I have 12 foot ceilings so the area has plenty of room, the room will be supplied with ac to keep the temps down, i vented the central ac directly into the room. I know there are some loose ends that still need to be tied up but this is my basic plan. And as you know, you are the foremost authority on this type of setup so i figured i would run it by ya to see what you thought and any and all advice would be appreciated. I look forward to seeing your reply as i'm going to be getting up and running within the month. One of my main goals is to be able to pull atleast 1lb off of each plant, I await your wisdom, peace.

 

[BigToke]

SQ -- you are to @!%&* funny dude lol, there are lot’s of good thing’s that I have in store for the Bio-Buckets in this new year.

Ron Gotti -- It looks like this is your first post here at IC so I think a welcome is in order, now that that’s out of the way, it sounds as thou you have been doing your home work, but I am a little confused what exactly your after so maybe you could brake it down a little more for me, and btw the KBS and the Bio-Buckets do not operate in the same manner, you did not machine any thing about the Beneficial Bacterium do you plain on utilizing there benefit to the system? But as far as getting 1lb per plant that’s pretty ambitious if you ask me, but I guess that would depend on the growers ability’s and skills as a grower, you know what mine. If your looking for a system that you can push to the max with the leased amount of maintenance the Bio-Buckets are for you, if designed right the BB system will perform above and beyond what you could imagine.

Ps…….if you would still like my help, brake it down for me.

 

[sunnyside]

hell yeah BT...you just got smacked on the ass by SQ!!! I think someone needs to be added to the list of mentors...why your not on there is a mystery to me....HEY Dutchgrown, over here!!!

 

[Ron Gotti]

Hey bt, thanx for replying so quickly fella. In regards to your question, I plan on using everything the exact same way that you do except with more power and the configuration will be a little different as far as setup and spacing. I have one 1000watt mh and 4 1000 watt hps. Ac is direct to the room from a central setup, I plan on putting the res in the middle and spacing the plants around the res with the mh in the middle and the hps on the sides. I will be growing tress though, probably longer veg than you do, but I'm not exactly sure how long you veg yours just that i think my plants will be bigger from what i have seen in your pics. After the first harvest i plan on setting up a seperate veg room so i can cut some time out of turnaround. I just want to make sure everything is running smoothly first. If i get the chance i will post a diagram of what i have planned for you to take a look at. Like i said in my above post, you have the knowledge so anything that you notice or think would work better for me in the system i have mentioned to increase my yield and make everything work like clockwork, let me know. Thanx for the welcome fella, holla back.

 

[BigToke]

Lol Sunnyside thanks for the suggestion but I do believe that honor could fall to someone like yourself, I see you all over this board helping peeps do the best they can and encouraging good vibes good job Sunny!! Btw do you think that SQ is getting just a little bet carried away with that paint ball stuff? For God sack man he just gave me a vertical smack on the ass!! That was the best dame laugh I’ve had in weeks, you see back in day I use to play a little foot ball and well it just brought back some good old memories, thinks for the laughs SQ I needed that!!

Ron Gotti – well I suppose the bottom line is when we get right down to it is you want to know what I think the pro’s & con’s are in growing trees in this type of system, well right off the bat let me say I would feel much more confident if you were to use the specs that I laid out, I personally have grown trees in my system with great success and with little problems, but if your dead set on using the original HurtBack design here’s what I thank you’ll be facing throughout your grow and some of the design changes that you’ll have to make or you’ll wind up with some major head aches.

I want to go ahead and put my apologies for any one who mite think that I am putting down HurtBack and his original design, that’s not what I am doing; it’s just that HurtBacks first design was more scaled to small time grower’s imo, who were looking to do some SOG style of growing, but it ran into some major problems with big time growers, that is the reason that he came up with the second bio-system that he called “The Farmer Brown Style” and even that system had some problems for the big time grower.

this was the reason that I redesigned the Bio-Buckets, to be geared more for the “Big Time Grower” the system that I designed does a great job at growing medium size to large size grows, but if I was going to do huge tree grows only I would change even a few things in my system, ever how large or small your system is changes the variables of growing in that system. Just as an example; if I was going to do mostly tree grows in my system, I would change the 1” ¼ drain to a 1” ½ drain and also instead of exchanging the buckets water 10 time an hour I would shot more for like 15 to 20 times an hour, also I would do at lest one to two, full flush of the entire system, like I said the variables change and you as the grower needs to know when to change with it, or your plants will be the ones to suffer pulse yield. So I don’t even know were to begin to advise you of the dangers of growing big time in a small time system, but I will do my best, just bear with me.

First off all of what I am about to say only applies to the system that your thinking about using, so if you change any thing other factors may come in to play. Ok I will go in the order of what I would change first.

1. I would defiantly change the exchange rate that each bucket gets from 7 to 10 times an hour to 15 to 20 times an hour. The roots are going to be massive and you will need adequate flow throughout your buckets in order to avoid dead spots, so increase your pump size!!
2. I would defiantly change the 1” ¼ drain to 1” ½ drain, the bigger your roots are going to get in the bucket the less circulation your going to get, also as the roots begin to fill up the bucket it will raise the water level in the bucket “have you ever seen over flow from the top? It’s not pretty!!”
3. I would defiantly NOT run the supply line up through the drain line as in the original design from HurtBack or your going to wish you didn’t imo.
4. I would defiantly use 8” net-pots with lava rocks as to harbor as much of the Beneficial Bacterium as possible, **Warning** let me give you a word of caution my friend, if your trying to do a mix of the KBS & Bio-System together don’t even think about it!! I’m not here to discuss the KBS style of growing and really don’t want to get into the pro’s & con’s of both systems, but don’t you think for one minute that I didn’t consider the KBS but as you can see I chose the Bio-Buckets.
5. I would defiantly cover the reservoir with some kind of heat reflecting material in the grow/room, I believe there is an example of this from LOVEBUDS over at OG if you need to look at something.
6. I would defiantly think about adding extra air to the reservoir or buckets and here’s the reason way. Those small drain sump hose do not give a large amount of turn-over or (water-fall-effect) in the reservoir to create the amount of dissolved oxygen needed to grow trees, and forget about that bio-wheel thingy that HurtBack had in his reservoir, your growing TREES!! This is the reason that I put all of my small drain hose into the large drain pip that goes back to the reservoir and the exchange rate is incredible!! I also have a DO Meter to prove it!!

Well I think that’s enough for right now we don’t want to have an over load from to much info all at once, so let me leave you this parting note: most of the growers here at IC got to were there at today because somebody else posted there knowledge or know how of how they do what they do, I have the utmost respect for those growers who will share there stuff. I am not a mentor or moderator or administrator of any site and you know what, you don’t have to be here at IC in order to share your stuff, as far as I know there’s no BIG EYE’S and LITTLE YOU’S here at this site like some of the others that I’ve encountered at other places, that’s one of the beauties of this place, were all just one big happy family here at IC so I humbly submit to you and anchorage you to contribute your growing experience here at IC so that all the growing community can benefit.

 

[mhung420]

In the words of Dave Chapelle

In the words of Dave Chapelle

"Did you go to weed college?"

Man some of those post are endless, but so much great knowledge. Im new to IC mag, but have been a member at HC.com for 2 years. I must say I've seen a lot of grows, but this site has shown me so many different things and I'm loving it. Im a small time grower(4 plants flower max), so it's a real treat to see these big grows in action Bigtoke. Like a kid in a candy store. Thanks for sharing, Peace.

 

[Ron Gotti]

Damn bt, you honestly never cease to amaze me in your posts. So much detail and in depth explanation. Honestly though, I didn't mean doing the system exactly to the tee of what hurtback did, i knew that i will need to upgrade many things but the layout was what i was thinking about, the only reason being is that in your system i would have to put lights down the middle and on the outside of each row, thus costing me more light or i would have to turn the buckets every so often to get each side ample time with the lights.Also on the kbs side, I don't plan on doing anything with soaker hose or pumps and things of that nature all i was talking about in reference to that was the maximum light, hangin vertical lights without reflectors, a stress free environment, and growing big treeesss. To tell you the truth, If it wouldn' t be a problem I would like for you to do a design layout for me and I will follow them to a t, I like the way your system looks but i wasn't sure if this would be good for growing big, since they look a little close to each other, post me a nice layout, lighting, buckets, parts needed, etc. and i will get everything together and post my whole grow here on ic for everyone to see how the system performs starting somewhere in the beginning of next month .I can change how many buckets I have but i wouldn' want to go to much over ten for the first run, whatever you think is best for max yield and efficiency, your the professor and i'm the student. I have a standard 2 car garage with ducted ac, i can seal it if need be, I'm not exactly sure on the measurements but it is pretty big, other than that i have 4-1000 watt hps and 1-1000 watt mh lights. I can change this configuration of lights because they are brand new if need be. I plan on using spice brothers ggxgg/mt, gg x ak47/sd both feminized by sts, or a clone from a friend supposedly of some bc god bud. I have to say it is damn hard getting clones here in the us, but if it has to be from seed then so be it, maybe i will get some nice mothers anyway. I would really appreciate if you could do this for me bt, just look at how thoro you are when it comes to replies and posts, I have no doubt that you can design a kick ass system for me to utilize my space and for me to put to some huge trees in my portfolio, anyway, reply when ready, I await your knowledge, holla.

 

[rule35sub1]

LOL@mhung420 "Did you go to weed college?"

LMAO!! No doubt!

 

[bartender187]

Wow i think i now know why my DWC plants are actin' sickly..

Thank you very much BigToke for the info...

TO THE BATCAVE! (growroom...)

peace

 

[Guest]

As always Big Toke, hats off to you, another excellent thread, attention to the layout, pics, detailed information...someone should sticky this one for sure.

You got style

 

[Roaddog]

Hello all!
Here is a link to a container manufacturer.

http://www.hrind.com/dryice.htm

I have access to two of these types of containers.
Think they will work for a res.?

 

[BigToke]

mhung420 – sorry about my long ass posting, it’s just that I can’t get every thing that I wont to say in a shorter forum of saying it, and btw I see that you were a member of HC.com, at one time I tried to befriend that bunch over there but some how we got off on the wrong foot lol, anyway glad you like this thread pull up a char sit down with a good cup of coffee and do all the reading you like that’s what it’s here for, and if you have any questions about any thing let me know and I do me best.

rule35sub1 – thanks for the props bro!!!

bartender187 – I don’t have a clue as to what I may have said that helped you but whatever it was I’m glad that it helped someone.

xxbluevelvetxx – thanks for the kind words and I believe it already is a sticky, anyways I hope that what I am about to say in my next post doesn’t cramp my style for ya but it’s just got to be said.

Roaddog – Wow that would be one big reservoir if you ask me, I suppose if you were going to hook up any were from 50 to 100 Bio-Buckets it might be ok but it may just be an over-kill for the average grower.