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Big plants outdoors. Start and veg time

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CrushnYuba

Well-known member
I can't find anything on this. When do you start clones for big outdoor plants? What size containers do you do your preveg in? What's your routine?

This is more for clones then seed. And for norcal. It seems like clones started to early run out of steam and don't do as well as healthy well rooted small clones put out June 1st. Time and time again I see small clones passing by big clones veged for months. The guys I know putting out babies are getting bigger plants then the guys veging forever. But then every once in a while you just nail the transition and get a big plant veged in a big 20g+ container and it just blows up when put out June 1st.
I have heard various theories one why small clones do better. They never reach sides of pots and their roots just grow straight out. They have less transplant shock. Yada yada.
What is your perfect routine and when do you start your clones for outdoor. This really doesn't apply as much for seed.
 
Wolfshadoe

Wolfshadoe

Member
CY..

There is a art to this method.. I been doing it for years.
In my sig is a link to thread over a decade old that will give you some insight.
Moon phases,equiknox ,solstice ect do have effect. This does apply to clones only..

June is solstice month..Not sure y area,but soil temp changes from may to june in most areas..Soil temp matters when it comes to ROOT sytem outside,

Pants that are planted sooner do struggle abit bc of soil temps..When a nice healthy clone
planted later at right soil temp hard to slow down and will pass other plants that's been there longer..

I fixed my problem long ago by letting the ones struggle finnish EARLY.Leave just a bottom branch and watch it get really/ugly weird growth thru june and eventually reveg and start to regrow and some even pass the ones that passed them. These pots are all 1 gal pots planted right in ground and roots grow out holes in bottom..
Ps..Gotta run... Will chek bak later..
Good luck
<ws>
 
theJointedOne

theJointedOne

Well-known member
Veteran
I take clones off my own mothers for outdoor full term gardens around the first of April.

After it takes about 10 days to root they are transplanted to one gallon containers and vegged inside under a 1000w bulb for 10 days.

On April 20th I transplant them into 3 gallon containers in a simple hoophouse outside which is setup with supplemental lighting to interrupt dark cycle.

On May 7th I transplant the 3gallon containers into the plants full time home in the ground under the sun and a supplemental lighting setup.

Last year I averaged about 7 pounds per plant across the board with those clones.
 
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CrushnYuba

Well-known member
Thejointedone: you are pretty much on the same schedule as me. I take my clones early to mid April. I veg in a greenhouse to. I think that's important because it's getting them used to the blazing sun. I have had the best luck with plastic 3s. they slide out easy. I have tried those smart pots that velcro and plastic bags but root balls always seem to get damaged with both.
I plant the first week of June.

I had some big plants in 10s last year that were supposed to be for a dep. They didn't do as well as smaller plants.

I have had such weird luck with seeds but I might do some this year. Last year the variation of the seeds I did were way off. I had to number all my plants because phenos were so drasticly different. They were TGA. When are y'all starting seeds?
 
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calaveras

Member
March 15 start seeds indoors under 13 hours light . 2 weeks after sprouting bump light to 13 1/4 hours. 4weeks after sprouting bump light to 13 1/2 hours.Put outside 3rd week of april if your weather is good. Protect with frost cloth or greenhouse if needed.Plants will sex naturally by early may but stay in vegetative growth. The key is starting at 13 hours light and doing a 15 minute bump 2x so plants are seeing light conditions similar to outside and they don't skip a beat.
 
theJointedOne

theJointedOne

Well-known member
Veteran
calaveras said:
March 15 start seeds indoors under 13 hours light . 2 weeks after sprouting bump light to 13 1/4 hours. 4weeks after sprouting bump light to 13 1/2 hours.Put outside 3rd week of april if your weather is good. Protect with frost cloth or greenhouse if needed.Plants will sex naturally by early may but stay in vegetative growth. The key is starting at 13 hours light and doing a 15 minute bump 2x so plants are seeing light conditions similar to outside and they don't skip a beat.
Click to expand...

no, see there is no reason to start seeds inside if you have a simple hoop house or greenhouse.

Start seeds outside, and dont deal with the hassle of supplemental lighting
 
Noonin NorCal

Noonin NorCal

Active member
Veteran
Seed plants are more heartier in my opinion, Im in Nor Cal. I will take cuts/clones in a couple weeks no later then the second week of April. The plants I'm cutting off will go straight into a light dep g.h. My clone plants did better last year then seed plants, they didn't get plugged till the second week of June. Be sure to harden them off and don't plant your clones to early...

clones go into rock wool cubes then into 4 inch pots once roots are present . then 3 gallon containers and finally into bigger pots outside. In bigger pots I'm only doing 45's but managed 1.5 pounds last year out of them
 
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CrushnYuba

Well-known member
My seeds are in my heated greenhouse right now because they are tiny. But I'll move them to an unheated frame soon. Last year I had them in an unheated unlit cold frame separate from the clones for most of their lives.
I pop them in tree starting cylinders. Then I plant them directly into a full bag of soil with the top cut off. Sometimes I do 1.5 cuft bags, sometimes 3 cu ft. No transplanting in preveg.
 
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trippn

Member
theJointedOne said:
no, see there is no reason to start seeds inside if you have a simple hoop house or greenhouse.

Start seeds outside, and dont deal with the hassle of supplemental lighting
Click to expand...

except for 4 out of 10 of my watermelon zkittlez getting munched by bugs in my greenhouse >.>
 
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CrushnYuba

Well-known member
what about getting those early plantings with seeds without supplemental lighting? how early is 2 early to pop seeds and still put them out may 1st without light strings.
was talking to a friend the other day. he pops seeds in feb. he never uses lighting at all. he puts them in an unheated unlit greenhouse with no endwalls in feb! he puts them in the ground in late April. he says as long as you never use supplemental lighting, they don't flower early. i guess it's because days get longer. he also says his plants grow slow. as i imagine they would freezing their balls off all the time. i wonder if their slow growth means slow to reach sexual maturity.
my greenhouse is heated and lit. i could probably make a dark corner for them but my growth will be significantly faster them my friend. do y'all think if i pop now without sup light the day getting longer will be enough to keep plants from flowering for a may 1st planting?
 
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~star~crash~

~star~crash~

Active member
i know u guys are west coasters , i grow east coast ...last season i did an experiment and put out seeds early as i could after last frost for an outdoor strike ... i also had starts indoors under 24/7 to compare for the season ...the ones that were out for 100% did fine , but yes they grew very slow...funny thing is that by the end of the season they were among the best plants ...the only difference was the initial rates of development
 
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CrushnYuba

Well-known member
I'm wondering more about early flowering. If a seedling is kept in an unlit but heated gh started in feb, will it flower in April or May without sup lighting.
Are the lengthening days enough to keep in veg?
 
~star~crash~

~star~crash~

Active member
how short are you days ? ur thinking they will grow a bit confused from being start so early with no supplemental lighting ???
 
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CrushnYuba

Well-known member
theJointedOne said:
no they will not flower early
Click to expand...

Are you 100% sure? I have always been to scared to test. And most people usually say to treat old seedlings as clones. I know they are still less likely to flower then a clone but how much so. If started feb 1st they are 3 months old by may 1st. 3.5 months old by May 14.
 
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caliprop215

Member
Veteran
I just planted my seeds they're sprouting right now. I'm going to let him grow for one month under 400 watt mh in 3 gallon pots.then presexing them for 5 Days 12 12 then back to 18 6. Pluck all the males at beginning of april. Plant all females in ground around 2 ft tall may 1st.under 400 watt sup lighting above the 30x30 area.. hoping for 3 plus each one....hopeing lol.....that my plan for this year....we shall see how it works
 
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