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Best MH on the market.
- Thread starter Mr Celsius
- Start date
NamelessCitizen
Member
My choice would be...
My choice would be...
Go here...
EYE 400W Clean Arc 6500K Horizontal Metal Halide Lamp
EYE Clean Arc MT400D/HOR horizontal position 400 watt metal halide lamp produces light similar to sunlight. For commercial applications where natural light is critical.
* Operates on a M59 400 watt ballast
* ET18 clear bulb with E39 nickel plated base and ceramic insulator
* High color temperature 6500° Kelvin and very high color rendering 90 CRI
* Horizontal ±15° Operating position
* 29,000 initial and 22,000 mean lumens
* 12,000 hour rated average life
* 1-year lamp warranty
$69.90
Clean Arc 6500K
CMH
Hortilux Blue Mh
My choice would be...
Go here...
EYE 400W Clean Arc 6500K Horizontal Metal Halide Lamp
EYE Clean Arc MT400D/HOR horizontal position 400 watt metal halide lamp produces light similar to sunlight. For commercial applications where natural light is critical.
* Operates on a M59 400 watt ballast
* ET18 clear bulb with E39 nickel plated base and ceramic insulator
* High color temperature 6500° Kelvin and very high color rendering 90 CRI
* Horizontal ±15° Operating position
* 29,000 initial and 22,000 mean lumens
* 12,000 hour rated average life
* 1-year lamp warranty
$69.90
Clean Arc 6500K
CMH
Hortilux Blue Mh
simba
Sleeping Dragon
**DANGER DANGER**
DO NOT USE A BULB THAT REQUIRES A ENCLOSED FIXTURE without one
(some of them are rated Open Fixture but you better be sure)
why? because if u notice the small outer shell vs Older style MH (and MH open fixture lamps) that smaller tube cant handle the pressure and blows also (most times) which is very dangerous for u.. it will Be like a grenade going off.
with HPS you can foiler feed and Open fixture rated MHs but as soon as u spray with a enclosed fixture rated lamp BOOOM.!!
Philips is the only Company with a patented COIL to Prevent Outer Shell Rupture..while using a ED18 casing
i have a few videos of MH blowing up.. Scary.. HPS just goes poof and arc tube goes to shit..
but MH uses higher pressure.. and goes BOOM.
MH and CMH both have Pressure but Philips has that safety coil
and even if we did find a MH lamp that competes with CMH the life would never be there nor will lumen maintenance.. CMH overcomes both of those while adding Nice red
Namless Great input but
Eyes best lamp for Hort use is the cera arc red..
but cost and is not rated for open fixture a few other isues and PRICE>>
so lets compare, the bulb u listed
..................... 400 Clean Arc..........................~.........Philips 400 CMH
M59 ballast (not most growers)............~............S51 standard 400 HPS BALLAST
6500° Kelvin a 90 CRI..............................~......... 4000K 85CRI+
Horizontal position (ENCLOSED FIXTURE)..........~.........HOrizontal No Encloser needed
29,000 initial and 22,000 mean lumens........~.........34,800 Init 29,600 Mean
12K Hour life (low lumen maintance= 7k usefull)........~.........15k Hour Life 85%+ Lum maint. 13K Usefull
^$69.00 Plus shipping....................................~...........$53.00 Plus shipping
So going off those comparisons..
you get 5,800 - 7,600 More Lumen (Most of its in useable energy)
the lumen maintance IS HUGE you need min of 85% for these spd lamps.. well the MH Versions caue there Overall life Sucks (cmh fixs that also)
also rember not all of what makes up the CRI range is for Growing.
so that makes it better to not having to many ranges LOL hard to really explain.. but the cri its mainly missing is 400- and 700+ where the clean arc and MH blue have those that Totaly Arent needed/wasted energy/takes away from good energy
if u look at the chart u have given it drops in the 460 range that we want
that far left peak is not in Par range..(usless/wasted energy)
for us we are using it as a one bulb grow.. As its best for it or any way u look at it..
but in flower u Want/NEED more red than Blue
The philips CMH is the only CMH or MH that can do this..
MH that have these SPDS have super low life High cost, and low lumen maintence
Trust me i have gone threw Every Bulb Possible.. .
the SDW and New version are in the MH,CMH,HPS Lineup but CMH Destroys AL>>If i could find a better one i would Recommend it in a heartbeat..
But going back to the bulb u have listed.
its a MH only.. most of us are HPS users..these go directly in 250,400 watt ballasts..
Philips makes CMH for Pulsed MH ballasts and they Perform even better than the retro whites but require enclosed fixture.
In the end though untill something changes in Bulb chem again.. the philips CMH and EYE CERA ARC RED are the only two CMHS i would even look at and the philips out ranks the EYE in all ways.. and PRICE>> (eye will allways be higher priced)
EYE CERA ARC RED Is there version of Philips Retro WHite = it will fit HPS ballast but has Major drawbacks, PRICE, Enclosed Fixture requiruments (when it blows it BLOWS) and SPD output..
EYE suposedly has a new CMH due out in japan in a year but no real word on how it will compete with philips (it prob is going to be there 600,1kw versions but with same drawbacks)
So based on all that CMH outperforms at a lower price (basicly More useable Flowering and overall energy and twice the life and useable life at a lower price..
if you look at the 500-600 on both urs and the P CMH u notice the EYE dumps allot more energy in the Weakest points.. hard to explain..
heres a SPD with an overlay.. its as close as i can get without NM ref points but is acurated based on color points withing EYEs Breifs
EYE BLUE (as u notice it dont follow Plant responce vs the CMH.. nor has more red than blue
Philips CMH
DO NOT USE A BULB THAT REQUIRES A ENCLOSED FIXTURE without one
(some of them are rated Open Fixture but you better be sure)
why? because if u notice the small outer shell vs Older style MH (and MH open fixture lamps) that smaller tube cant handle the pressure and blows also (most times) which is very dangerous for u.. it will Be like a grenade going off.
with HPS you can foiler feed and Open fixture rated MHs but as soon as u spray with a enclosed fixture rated lamp BOOOM.!!
Philips is the only Company with a patented COIL to Prevent Outer Shell Rupture..while using a ED18 casing
i have a few videos of MH blowing up.. Scary.. HPS just goes poof and arc tube goes to shit..
but MH uses higher pressure.. and goes BOOM.
MH and CMH both have Pressure but Philips has that safety coil
and even if we did find a MH lamp that competes with CMH the life would never be there nor will lumen maintenance.. CMH overcomes both of those while adding Nice red
Namless Great input but
Eyes best lamp for Hort use is the cera arc red..
but cost and is not rated for open fixture a few other isues and PRICE>>
so lets compare, the bulb u listed
..................... 400 Clean Arc..........................~.........Philips 400 CMH
M59 ballast (not most growers)............~............S51 standard 400 HPS BALLAST
6500° Kelvin a 90 CRI..............................~......... 4000K 85CRI+
Horizontal position (ENCLOSED FIXTURE)..........~.........HOrizontal No Encloser needed
29,000 initial and 22,000 mean lumens........~.........34,800 Init 29,600 Mean
12K Hour life (low lumen maintance= 7k usefull)........~.........15k Hour Life 85%+ Lum maint. 13K Usefull
^$69.00 Plus shipping....................................~...........$53.00 Plus shipping
So going off those comparisons..
you get 5,800 - 7,600 More Lumen (Most of its in useable energy)
the lumen maintance IS HUGE you need min of 85% for these spd lamps.. well the MH Versions caue there Overall life Sucks (cmh fixs that also)
also rember not all of what makes up the CRI range is for Growing.
so that makes it better to not having to many ranges LOL hard to really explain.. but the cri its mainly missing is 400- and 700+ where the clean arc and MH blue have those that Totaly Arent needed/wasted energy/takes away from good energy
if u look at the chart u have given it drops in the 460 range that we want
that far left peak is not in Par range..(usless/wasted energy)
for us we are using it as a one bulb grow.. As its best for it or any way u look at it..
but in flower u Want/NEED more red than Blue
The philips CMH is the only CMH or MH that can do this..
MH that have these SPDS have super low life High cost, and low lumen maintence
Trust me i have gone threw Every Bulb Possible.. .
the SDW and New version are in the MH,CMH,HPS Lineup but CMH Destroys AL>>If i could find a better one i would Recommend it in a heartbeat..
But going back to the bulb u have listed.
its a MH only.. most of us are HPS users..these go directly in 250,400 watt ballasts..
Philips makes CMH for Pulsed MH ballasts and they Perform even better than the retro whites but require enclosed fixture.
In the end though untill something changes in Bulb chem again.. the philips CMH and EYE CERA ARC RED are the only two CMHS i would even look at and the philips out ranks the EYE in all ways.. and PRICE>> (eye will allways be higher priced)
EYE CERA ARC RED Is there version of Philips Retro WHite = it will fit HPS ballast but has Major drawbacks, PRICE, Enclosed Fixture requiruments (when it blows it BLOWS) and SPD output..
EYE suposedly has a new CMH due out in japan in a year but no real word on how it will compete with philips (it prob is going to be there 600,1kw versions but with same drawbacks)
So based on all that CMH outperforms at a lower price (basicly More useable Flowering and overall energy and twice the life and useable life at a lower price..
if you look at the 500-600 on both urs and the P CMH u notice the EYE dumps allot more energy in the Weakest points.. hard to explain..
heres a SPD with an overlay.. its as close as i can get without NM ref points but is acurated based on color points withing EYEs Breifs
EYE BLUE (as u notice it dont follow Plant responce vs the CMH.. nor has more red than blue
Philips CMH
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NamelessCitizen
Member
Simba - you make alot of really good points. I concede that the CMH should perform better than the other bulbs mentioned, including mine. Would be great to see someone do a side-by-side-by-side grow for comparison.
simba
Sleeping Dragon
interesting stuff, I'm just about to build a cab, was going to go with a 400 sodium for flowering and run a few flouros in there while I'm vegging.. as I'm out of town a few times of year I can't keep a mother going, so I'll need to grow from seed. Will one of these 400 watt CMH compete with a 400 watt sodium for flowering? What about heat? I imagine though would produce a little more than HPS?
I just don't know if the lumen loss is worth the better spectrum, I'd like to see some finished grows with one of these CMH bulbs.
I just don't know if the lumen loss is worth the better spectrum, I'd like to see some finished grows with one of these CMH bulbs.
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Okay, question. I have a 4 - 1000 watt system using HPS ballasts. What is the best bulb I can buy for bloom? I am going tomorrow to buy new bulbs as I have been using the cheapies for the last four grows and have not changed them yet. I am sure they are pooched by now (spectrum wise). Also, do you think I would notice an increase in yeild using the bulbs you suggest compared to my cheap bulbs I have used in the past?
Thanks in advance and great thread! It's great to finally understand the bulbs we buy.
TGT
Thanks in advance and great thread! It's great to finally understand the bulbs we buy.
TGT
simba
Sleeping Dragon
shafto..
its hard for me to explain in text.. specially with lighting.
hmm.. in short the hps and CMH are putting out the same energy but the CMH is evening it out over a wider area that the plant can absorb.. therefore making it more efficient.. that is the worsted explanation i have given but it early..
call adv tech.. the guy is super cool..
but ya a 400 cmh Compete against 400 hps.. and beat it..
another thing u have to remember the cmh keeps plants short. so u don't have to have light high just cause of that.. again bad explanation to early..
tgt.. u have 4, 1kw, only option would be replace each 1kw unit with 4, 400 cmh's
for commercial there great also to but require more labor (raising many lights)
Reflectors are key to any Lighting..
its hard for me to explain in text.. specially with lighting.
hmm.. in short the hps and CMH are putting out the same energy but the CMH is evening it out over a wider area that the plant can absorb.. therefore making it more efficient.. that is the worsted explanation i have given but it early..
call adv tech.. the guy is super cool..
but ya a 400 cmh Compete against 400 hps.. and beat it..
another thing u have to remember the cmh keeps plants short. so u don't have to have light high just cause of that.. again bad explanation to early..
tgt.. u have 4, 1kw, only option would be replace each 1kw unit with 4, 400 cmh's
for commercial there great also to but require more labor (raising many lights)
Reflectors are key to any Lighting..
greenisgold
Member
Okay, so I read most of it, understood about 75 percent. You are saying that if you grow using one type of ballast (hps) then this phillips bulb is the way to go up to 400 watt? Am I correct? But lets say you have a switchable ballast, then is it better to use say a reg. mh bulb for veg and then just a reg. hps for flower? Or is this new bulb the best of both worlds (buy one bulb and keep it in all the time in the hps ballast)?
Thanks for all of your hard work.
Right now I start my seeds in a 250 watt hps fixture and use a 270 bulb. I then transplant and move to a 400 watt eye-blue. I keep that going until 2 weeks into 12/12 and then switch to a 400 hps (all on a mover). What do you think?
P.S. My gallery pics are not from my current 400 watt grows, they are from 1000 watt grows.
Thanks for all of your hard work.
Right now I start my seeds in a 250 watt hps fixture and use a 270 bulb. I then transplant and move to a 400 watt eye-blue. I keep that going until 2 weeks into 12/12 and then switch to a 400 hps (all on a mover). What do you think?
P.S. My gallery pics are not from my current 400 watt grows, they are from 1000 watt grows.
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simba
Sleeping Dragon
Yups this bulb is for HPS ballasts...
your switchable ballast will power the lamps on the Links i post..
when its on the HPS side. when u flip to MH your Basically disconnecting the Starting Circuit that sends the Pulse. and that pulse is needed)
theres 2 typs of MH theres standard MH and Pulsed start MH.. (most mhs are standard) all hps are pulsed start (only 1 type hps ballast, the way it starts)
but a MH pulsed ballast wont work this bulb it would need the standard cdm400/hor bulb
there is no CMH for non pulsed start MH ballasts
yups this is a one Bulb for Total Life Cycle. (you could always add some supplemental HPS but if u have proper reflector and setup u wont need it)
you already see the benefit of the EYE Blue SPD you will really see the benefit in the Higher Red, Lumen maintenance, Life, Price.
especialy for you your spending allot on 1,250w 1,400 EYE blue 1,400hps
you can switch to 1,250w-CMH 1,400CMH and re lamp less in turn saving allot.that will keep them short while producing.
your switchable ballast will power the lamps on the Links i post..
when its on the HPS side. when u flip to MH your Basically disconnecting the Starting Circuit that sends the Pulse. and that pulse is needed)
theres 2 typs of MH theres standard MH and Pulsed start MH.. (most mhs are standard) all hps are pulsed start (only 1 type hps ballast, the way it starts)
but a MH pulsed ballast wont work this bulb it would need the standard cdm400/hor bulb
there is no CMH for non pulsed start MH ballasts
yups this is a one Bulb for Total Life Cycle. (you could always add some supplemental HPS but if u have proper reflector and setup u wont need it)
you already see the benefit of the EYE Blue SPD you will really see the benefit in the Higher Red, Lumen maintenance, Life, Price.
especialy for you your spending allot on 1,250w 1,400 EYE blue 1,400hps
you can switch to 1,250w-CMH 1,400CMH and re lamp less in turn saving allot.that will keep them short while producing.
Last edited:
greenisgold
Member
Thanks for the answer. I have so many damn bulbs (9 to be exact) why because of all the hype in regards to this and that bulb. So I'm willing to try this for sure.simba said:
Peace
simba
Sleeping Dragon
heya,,
if you Are Die hard stuck on 1kw hmm.. the blue will help with flowering in keeping short and extra usable energy..
a SOLARMAX "ONE" 1000 Watt (u best have a dam good reflctor 2 Arcs)
what i find funny all these hort lamp people say these same lies (to save there hide)
"The biggest advancements made in HID sources for plant growth was to enhance the inherent deficiencies of either HPS (not enough blue) or MH (not enough orange / red). While these specialized lamps are much better than standard "commodity" lamps, the fact is that neither technology can be altered enough to be truly optimum for plant growth."
They are Neglecting to consider CMH in that statement .. CMH is it..
cmh doesnt have the Short life, low lumen maintaince Focusing issues. from 2 arcs.
im sure they considered the EYE Blue MH when they said that.. as that lamp has a nice NM Range but poor red and thats why its not a Great One bulb.. To much blue during flower.but cmh has it..
if you Are Die hard stuck on 1kw hmm.. the blue will help with flowering in keeping short and extra usable energy..
a SOLARMAX "ONE" 1000 Watt (u best have a dam good reflctor 2 Arcs)
what i find funny all these hort lamp people say these same lies (to save there hide)
"The biggest advancements made in HID sources for plant growth was to enhance the inherent deficiencies of either HPS (not enough blue) or MH (not enough orange / red). While these specialized lamps are much better than standard "commodity" lamps, the fact is that neither technology can be altered enough to be truly optimum for plant growth."
They are Neglecting to consider CMH in that statement .. CMH is it..
cmh doesnt have the Short life, low lumen maintaince Focusing issues. from 2 arcs.
im sure they considered the EYE Blue MH when they said that.. as that lamp has a nice NM Range but poor red and thats why its not a Great One bulb.. To much blue during flower.but cmh has it..
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I really want to see a 400 watt CMH side by side with a 400 watt HPS in flower and see the difference, I'm still hesitant to buy a CMH bulb, it's just not proven.. even if the spectrum is more usable, it puts out a lot less lumen than the HPS.. it may work better, but I'd have to see it working better first.
G
Guest
Lumens are for fools to worry about!!!! Sorry to be a jerk but, there is to much "lumen concern" on this site. It is a joke and I can't stand it any more. Yes you need a certain quantity of photon production and relative energy available for the plants to use, but if all your lumens are clumped in to two (off position) spikes then wtf? Have you ever looked at the spectrum of sunlight. All that far blue and far red brings so much to the table. Photosynthesis uses some amount of the entire spectrum. I have put it this way before: Would you feed your plants barely enough N - P - K and leave out the mag, iron, calcium, born, .........NO! That is analagus(spell?) to using a Hortilux HPS, or a regular halide for that matter.
Sorry just getting old, everyone is so brainwashed on lighting by the adds in MaxYield and such.
Azeotrope
Sorry just getting old, everyone is so brainwashed on lighting by the adds in MaxYield and such.
Azeotrope
I don't even know what MaxYield is, I've learned everything I know from OG and here.. I don't care one bit about the marketing, I just want the highest quality bud possible in my cab, vegging isn't as important as flowing for me.. if there's any detriment to flowering what-so-ever from the lower light output of the CMH compared to the HPS I don't want it..
I saw someone before talking about a plant's ability to adapt to using different spectrums of light available to it. HPS definitely produces the most light right in the area where plants like for flowering, maybe it's a little more orange, but still.. it's a huge amount of light..
I'm not set either way.. but for now I'll go HPS, I can always just buy a CMH bulb later on once I see some comparisons to see if it's actually better for flowering... I plan to throw in some blue fluoros while I veg, but I won't do much vegging, as it'll be scrog.. Then I'll leave a few blues and switch some out for reds when I flower... or maybe some red LEDs, I have a good collection of high flux RED leds, that'll all be down the road though...
I saw someone before talking about a plant's ability to adapt to using different spectrums of light available to it. HPS definitely produces the most light right in the area where plants like for flowering, maybe it's a little more orange, but still.. it's a huge amount of light..
I'm not set either way.. but for now I'll go HPS, I can always just buy a CMH bulb later on once I see some comparisons to see if it's actually better for flowering... I plan to throw in some blue fluoros while I veg, but I won't do much vegging, as it'll be scrog.. Then I'll leave a few blues and switch some out for reds when I flower... or maybe some red LEDs, I have a good collection of high flux RED leds, that'll all be down the road though...
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G
Guest
Sorry to get all fired up, but no the HPS dose not produce the most red. Look at all the good data in this and the other threads where Simba has been kind enough to post the output graphs and such. There is a lot more red and a ton more energy in that end. The sun's red output is just about the same although higher intensity. Yeah plants adapt to a lot of our induced hazards! That does not mean that they do much more than survive. The way to exercise their best genetic potential is to best duplicate that environment that they evolved in. Lighting and nutes and temps and CO2 ......
I will try not to get so excited!!!
Azeotrope
I will try not to get so excited!!!
Azeotrope
simba
Sleeping Dragon
Azeotrope - love ur field Automation is it.. Been working on a PIC Full Room controller W/vari fan speed..every thing is fuzzy logic so each valve can really be Slowly opened and controlled ud really like it..i admit i had a Elec Eng help on some of it ..
thanks for post 59 it was within reason.. (had i tried saying that again. it wouldnt have been cordial.
(i dont get it AN can Lie and Sell Millions We tell the truth and its pulling teeth..)
long story short one day u will convert..
but one thing that gets me u said its not Proven.. UH.. (EYE BLUE) the CMH is better than that..
as far as lumens..
i been playing with Photographers in the area (with CMH and i found out.. some already converted.. one said she replaced a 600 watt Studio light with a 150 CMH fresnel and it provides better color rend and appears brighter..(now this kinda doesnt relate to us but does. cause even though less lumens it provides light where needed either for plants or Camera LOL)
as much as a plant can adapt to absorbe Plah-Phhh.. not enough for me to even Give a tushi
look at it this way..
Solar Pannels only absorbe a few NM ranges of light..puts out lil power vs energy hiting plate (this would compare to a plant under HPS)
that same size solar panel (new RD Style) absorbes Many Nm ranges of Light and puts out allot more power (this would compare to a plant and CMH)
plants been around Millions of years Pot at least 10,000 years.. your telling me that they have adapted to ur HPS in the 4 weeks they been alive.. No it would take 1,000 years of mothers and there babies growing up and mutating to Really convert..
thats like saying i could grow with very lil light (candle) cause the plant will adapted.. NO it wont..
if your after Ultimate Quality CMH can only be beaten by growing outside..
also the CMH dumps UV that is proven to be needed to Fill the THC sacks HPS DOESN'T FILL Glands FOR CRAP FACT... the plant needs as close to all NM ranges to Fully produce..
you need blue during Flower aswell its just that if u only chose one lamp you would get a hps but it was allays good to run MH and HPS till CMH..
you buy nutes without seeing side by side testing (real side by side testing)
u should seen the results when we did a side by side...for a simple nut reg Im starting to Lean back to using only FloraMato Dry, flor plus KB thats it.. and for Organic bcuzz Bio-nrg lineup.silica only if im not using higromite. the rest is more than its worth..vs cost vs output vs hassle IMPHO
i should also state i had a Tomato plant going for bout 2 years (started it on FN crapy nute then to GH FM dry, Flor plus, KB.. and 1 year ago stopped checking ph, tds, and let the roots go DRY in dwc then reflil water even stopped feeding 6 months ago, few weeks later it stoped producing fruit and it just died from loss of food..6 months later.. the benis i think made the difference (in basicly producing organic nutes from there chit) and i gave its roots hair cuts all the time.. i tried so hard to kill it without actully pulling the plug.. More of torture.. i should have documented it better that would be ultimite sell for GH Floramato Dry, flor plus (flor plus gave the benis)
Philips CMH 250,400 Watt HPS Ballastable, 20-150 watt on other pages
http://advancedtechlighting.com/cdmed18.htm
thanks for post 59 it was within reason.. (had i tried saying that again. it wouldnt have been cordial.
(i dont get it AN can Lie and Sell Millions We tell the truth and its pulling teeth..)
long story short one day u will convert..
but one thing that gets me u said its not Proven.. UH.. (EYE BLUE) the CMH is better than that..
as far as lumens..
i been playing with Photographers in the area (with CMH and i found out.. some already converted.. one said she replaced a 600 watt Studio light with a 150 CMH fresnel and it provides better color rend and appears brighter..(now this kinda doesnt relate to us but does. cause even though less lumens it provides light where needed either for plants or Camera LOL)
as much as a plant can adapt to absorbe Plah-Phhh.. not enough for me to even Give a tushi
look at it this way..
Solar Pannels only absorbe a few NM ranges of light..puts out lil power vs energy hiting plate (this would compare to a plant under HPS)
that same size solar panel (new RD Style) absorbes Many Nm ranges of Light and puts out allot more power (this would compare to a plant and CMH)
plants been around Millions of years Pot at least 10,000 years.. your telling me that they have adapted to ur HPS in the 4 weeks they been alive.. No it would take 1,000 years of mothers and there babies growing up and mutating to Really convert..
thats like saying i could grow with very lil light (candle) cause the plant will adapted.. NO it wont..
if your after Ultimate Quality CMH can only be beaten by growing outside..
also the CMH dumps UV that is proven to be needed to Fill the THC sacks HPS DOESN'T FILL Glands FOR CRAP FACT... the plant needs as close to all NM ranges to Fully produce..
you need blue during Flower aswell its just that if u only chose one lamp you would get a hps but it was allays good to run MH and HPS till CMH..
you buy nutes without seeing side by side testing (real side by side testing)
u should seen the results when we did a side by side...for a simple nut reg Im starting to Lean back to using only FloraMato Dry, flor plus KB thats it.. and for Organic bcuzz Bio-nrg lineup.silica only if im not using higromite. the rest is more than its worth..vs cost vs output vs hassle IMPHO
i should also state i had a Tomato plant going for bout 2 years (started it on FN crapy nute then to GH FM dry, Flor plus, KB.. and 1 year ago stopped checking ph, tds, and let the roots go DRY in dwc then reflil water even stopped feeding 6 months ago, few weeks later it stoped producing fruit and it just died from loss of food..6 months later.. the benis i think made the difference (in basicly producing organic nutes from there chit) and i gave its roots hair cuts all the time.. i tried so hard to kill it without actully pulling the plug.. More of torture.. i should have documented it better that would be ultimite sell for GH Floramato Dry, flor plus (flor plus gave the benis)
Philips CMH 250,400 Watt HPS Ballastable, 20-150 watt on other pages
http://advancedtechlighting.com/cdmed18.htm
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