p0opstlnksal0t
Active member
Is anyone using a battery bank
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Battery bank load hiding with smart meters?
- Thread starter p0opstlnksal0t
- Start date
lol have you done ANY of the math for your proposed battery bank?
this is called a feasability study. you do those first before you waste alot of time and money trying to work out a solution to a problem that is affordable/ not feasable from the get go.
storing anything in batteries is just about the most expensive way possible to provide on demand loads. you would literally be better off buying a genset and auto transfer switch.
if you dont bellieve me, price a tesla power wall vs a 5kw generator( power walls max steady state current draw)
batteries are typically used as a sort of flywheel... they keep things going while your minivan sized emergency generators are coming online and their output is stabilizing.
this is called a feasability study. you do those first before you waste alot of time and money trying to work out a solution to a problem that is affordable/ not feasable from the get go.
storing anything in batteries is just about the most expensive way possible to provide on demand loads. you would literally be better off buying a genset and auto transfer switch.
if you dont bellieve me, price a tesla power wall vs a 5kw generator( power walls max steady state current draw)
batteries are typically used as a sort of flywheel... they keep things going while your minivan sized emergency generators are coming online and their output is stabilizing.
p0opstlnksal0t
Active member
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i know what you are saying, but you would still need a huge battery bank just to provide 1 hour of "masking".
for the price of that 1 hour masking, you would be far better off just running a generator. do the math, battery storage price per kwh delivered is insane compared to just about everything.
for the price of that 1 hour masking, you would be far better off just running a generator. do the math, battery storage price per kwh delivered is insane compared to just about everything.
p0opstlnksal0t
Active member
sulphated/weak deep cycle batteries are free around here and easy to desulphate and recharge. the switch panel and such will cost a little bit though. i imagine still cheaper than picking up a honda eu6500is or something with a controller/switch to flip it on regularly and keeping it filled with gas constantly seems like quite a chore.
A 100 AH deep cycle batt at say 8A per hour discharge over 12 hour period per batt... we're only looking at maybe 4 of these batts to supply 32 amps per hour over 12 hours. is my math off?
FireIn.TheSky
Active member
Nobody cares how much power you use.
You want to conserve put in solar panels but if you pay your bill on time the power company could care less.
5k isn't that much, an electric stove consumes 50 amps 240v, a water heater draws 30 amps at 240v and so does a dryer, when you look at it that way what you are using doesn't seem that bad.
If you are using grid power you would still have to draw power to load the batteries so nothing would be saved.
Now you'd also have to convert the power twice because grid power is ac, batteries are dc then you would have to convert back to ac to run your stuff.
Solar panels sometimes use a battery bank but it's because they generate dc power, load the batteries with dc then convert once to ac.
You want to conserve put in solar panels but if you pay your bill on time the power company could care less.
5k isn't that much, an electric stove consumes 50 amps 240v, a water heater draws 30 amps at 240v and so does a dryer, when you look at it that way what you are using doesn't seem that bad.
If you are using grid power you would still have to draw power to load the batteries so nothing would be saved.
Now you'd also have to convert the power twice because grid power is ac, batteries are dc then you would have to convert back to ac to run your stuff.
Solar panels sometimes use a battery bank but it's because they generate dc power, load the batteries with dc then convert once to ac.
p0opstlnksal0t
Active member
Lets say someone gets tipped off randomly.... LEO looks up your power usage and its been masked efficiently so they drop it...
FireIn.TheSky
Active member
Read my edit.
Energy is neither converted nor destroyed only transformed.
Nothing will be saved by charging v
Batteries with grid power.
You would need solar panels, wind turbine, propane generator etc.. to keep power off the grid.
Energy is neither converted nor destroyed only transformed.
Nothing will be saved by charging v
Batteries with grid power.
You would need solar panels, wind turbine, propane generator etc.. to keep power off the grid.
p0opstlnksal0t
Active member
I see what you're saying buddy. im not worried about "overall" use or saving any money.... what im really getting at is paying a 10-15% "tax" or inverter loss costs to "mask" the signature of a standard grow. Yes I understand energy consumption will be higher but to keep it from looking like a 12/12 cycling standard grow is really what this boils down to. my hot tub (not wired up yet) can draw as much as 50 amps when heating and running all 3 pumps. the signature of a hot tub can be comprehended when looking at the usage graphs. So can the 12/12 cycle of a flower room. If i used a controller-switch and schedule random intervals of a battery bank to discharge back into the house during lights on could this be an effective tool to break up the tell-tale signs of a grow op?
If that happens (someone tips them off about you) and you are residential, LEO will compare power usage between your house and the other homes on the street.
With 5k of lamps (and the HVAC/fans to cool them), you are toast, regardless of usage pattern. Guaranteed you will be WAY over what your neighbors are using.
Next, they will then come by with an infrared camera and take pics of the house to reveal hot spots. Those pieces of evidence combined with the tip that flagged you to begin with should be enough to get a warrant.
They'll be knocking on your door at 6 or 7 am within 30 days (time for planning, scheduling, maybe additional surveillance).
One way to detect you are hot before they kick your door might be to have a kickass video surveillance system setup around the house to catch them when they come to take the thermal pics.
If the hot spot is on the back side of the house (not street side) and they have to get out of the car to check it out, all the better as far as detecting them with video.
dude no, your math is off.
deep cycle batteries are not intended for high continuous amp drainage.
they are like car batteries in that they are intended for a super high crank amperage, but only for a few seconds. so you would need many of these batteries so as to not exceede their steady state amp draw specs. probably like 8.
also like car batteries, you are not supposed to drain them down to like 7.2 volts or what ever they bottom out at. they do go deeper than reg. car batteries, but not more than like bottom 20%.
even if you could draw down that full 100 Amp hours at a perfect 12v... thats only 1.2 kwh.
you would need 5 minimum just to run your lights for one hour.
realistically you would need atleast double that when accounting for the max steady state amp draw, and the maximum discharge.
you would also need an inverter and battery charge controller.
there is a reason why nobody does this outside of like... hunting lodges or remote cabins etc.
In Kyllo v United States, the SCOTUS ruled that thermal imaging is not admissible evidence so it can't be used to obtain a warrant in this country, at least not yet. That doesn't mean cops don't use it surreptitiously. I doubt that power usage (even from a smart meter) would be sufficient evidence for a warrant in most jurisdictions, either. Add most anything else, however, & they'll be able to get a warrant. Snitches are the #1 source of warrants, I suspect, along with inadequate odor control.
Expect people to roll over to save their own skins or to exact revenge, particularly jilted lovers.
Odor did it for me. The FBI was investigating terrorist activities I participated in during my youth and immediately smelled the garden from the driveway. They leveraged their knowledge to encourage dialogue. Hey, it worked with my buddy who grew poppies. I used the opportunity to get a heart operation while in federal custody and then changed my plea to not guilty and am enjoying my bonus time with refurbished heart arteries.
Whoo hoo, talk about pissed off FBI agents, I ate their lunch and their bosses sent them to bed without dinner. I smile.
Most all of mechanical surveillance is considered circumstantial and an in person report is necessary for a warrant.
Once you have their attention they own you at their leisure. Avoiding the first look is the mission.
I have no plumbing or furnace in my 800 square foot home. However, I live in an affluent neighborhood and my 4000 KWH use per month is only a bit larger than the usage of the half million dollar homes surrounding me. Hot water and HVAC draw as much as gardening if the house is large.
I was first here and all the protective covenants do not apply, my outhouse is untouchable by the more refined folks.
Whoo hoo, talk about pissed off FBI agents, I ate their lunch and their bosses sent them to bed without dinner. I smile.
Most all of mechanical surveillance is considered circumstantial and an in person report is necessary for a warrant.
Once you have their attention they own you at their leisure. Avoiding the first look is the mission.
I have no plumbing or furnace in my 800 square foot home. However, I live in an affluent neighborhood and my 4000 KWH use per month is only a bit larger than the usage of the half million dollar homes surrounding me. Hot water and HVAC draw as much as gardening if the house is large.
I was first here and all the protective covenants do not apply, my outhouse is untouchable by the more refined folks.
