Are the varieties of the new school so bad?

[Rembetis]

After we were good and high off my pride and joy, he whips out his "brown scraggly", outdoor seeded no name Ozark mountain guerilla grown Thai looking stuff, no trim. I could take a lot bigger rip than a 0.10, but when I did it peeled my face off.

You older guys remember this but you younger guys probably dont know the history but back in the 80's because of the intense pressure in the Emerald Triangle from the CAMP campaign a lot of the old original growers migrated to the Missouri and Arkansas Ozarks region and resumed growing back in the Hollers.

 

[Rembetis]

otoh, there's no doubt that modern breeding efforts have generally taken effects in a bad direction


warmth, positivity, expansiveness, meditative qualities etc. are all much easier to find in good landraces

Totally agree with you there and thats why I am only growing Landraces any more although I probably come off as only interested in Sativas. I have many good Indica types as well, many of which come from your selections. My first priority as a grower is medicine and I need the full spectrum of strains to deal with my problems. My top criteria is that it not have any of the bad effects. Otherwise I thoroughly enjoy seeing what each strain has to offer. As you say some strains leave you cold but to me that is a big part of messing with Landraces. Its a crap shoot and sometimes you loose but when you do find a gem it makes it all worth while.

The Afghanis of the early 90s were still generally good although times were changing fast by then. So many of those lines are classics at this point and its too bad so many were lost.

 

[Mattbho]

In ontario we had this spicy dank goodness I can only describe somewhat coffeeish chocolatey hash and if u smelled it burning you thought someone was melting rubber in the room . Always came more damp than any other and usually compacted. Easily 3 or 5 times stronger than anything else around . 100x stronger than most mexi brick. We called it mudge and also hash plant. I mustve smoked it for 10 years then falls off the face of the planet.
I mustve tried smoking 25 different hash plants with not 1 even a twinkle of that taste .

I was gifted 20 o.s.h.p. beans i think ill pop them see if i cant get that funk back in my life.

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

blah blah.. I named him as people like you named him, godfather.. fact is that godfather of seed business was heroin addict, personal info or not, which ,in my opinion, affects the selection of plants etc.. personality of breeder is not separated from plants, which breeder choose to breed with.. I stay on topic, about narcotic weed, which northern lights hybrids are. and to be clear I am not interested in your moral judgements.. I am talking about narcotic weed and how it became standard till these days.. proof is in plants and you can moralize how you want.. plants from him are narcotic, although he advertised them as cerebral etc.. simple facts. you can judge me how you can, again I am not interested in your moral posing.. heroin can ruin even cannabis as well as human lives.. of course Godfather is not responsible for it all, but he stays main figure of junkie/yuppie social moves(of cannabis world) so typical for 80´s..

Wow, I didn't relize that or really think about that before. I think you make a very interesting point.

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

.

 

[@hempy]

I used it as example, as it is usual thing these days, to say some afghanhaze is haze.. and opiated haze by narcotic broad leaf varieties.. haze is textbook example of pure narrow leaf variety which through hybridizing was fucked up and narcotized.. and I dont like heroin addicts tell me what real sativa is or not, or advise me about any other thing in my life.. I said that heroin addict set the standards for what strong weed is and what is not, historically by his selection and selling tons of his seeds.. thats why there are northern lights hybrids everywhere, with strong but short lasting effect, boring and dulling.. true and not drama. drama it is for his fans.. I am happy there is useful weed for heroin addicts, but thats all.. problem is more widely social, as many people take opiate pills on various health issues, they are used to this kind of effect and call it relaxing or euphoric, it is like alcoholic thinks that to be drunken is euphoric, but for me it is not it, for me it is to be drunken... so for me oaxacan is euphoric, but with original glue I feel like drunken... these pure narrow leafers have something special to it..

You continue to rubbish and slander a dead man and worse are allowed to do so in icmag with out being pulled up by mods.

People like you need to be put on a short leash so what have you contributed to the cannabis community apart from hate ?.

Yes Nevil used heroin but when he started to breed cannabis he was clean and cannabis helped him stay clean till the end as it has many other people around the world.

You wouldn't know a good haze plant if you had it land on you.

 

[HAZENACIOUS]

I used it as example, as it is usual thing these days, to say some afghanhaze is haze.. and opiated haze by narcotic broad leaf varieties.. haze is textbook example of pure narrow leaf variety which through hybridizing was fucked up and narcotized.. and I dont like heroin addicts tell me what real sativa is or not, or advise me about any other thing in my life.. I said that heroin addict set the standards for what strong weed is and what is not, historically by his selection and selling tons of his seeds.. thats why there are northern lights hybrids everywhere, with strong but short lasting effect, boring and dulling.. true and not drama. drama it is for his fans.. I am happy there is useful weed for heroin addicts, but thats all.. problem is more widely social, as many people take opiate pills on various health issues, they are used to this kind of effect and call it relaxing or euphoric, it is like alcoholic thinks that to be drunken is euphoric, but for me it is not it, for me it is to be drunken... so for me oaxacan is euphoric, but with original glue I feel like drunken... these pure narrow leafers have something special to it..

Ma,
You are totally full of crap!

So much cliche, and many wrong assumptions here, I do not know where to start. First of all weed has so many applications, more of your contradictory, opinionated lies about weed. The most narcotic debilitating strains I have tried outside my hazes, are landrace African strains which I smoked, while I was in Africa!
This conviction you have that narcotic chemotypes come exclusively from indica, and that these genes have somehow adulterated and harmed the "pure" race of euphoric sativas is totally wrong. If Hitler was a dope fiend he would sound just like you.


All this shit you talk about pure landrace bla bla blah, and yet you like sour diesel?
I got news for you poser, Diesel is basically just a chem crossed with Nevils 2 most famous and totally commercial strains NL and superskunk!
Diesel rocks! You are one posed out delusional mess of contradiction, Nevil's hybrid work is behind Diesel, fool.



Most Narcotic debilitating strain I have grown outside my haze hybrids(also most pure landrace African sativa):

 

[HAZENACIOUS]

Ma,

I am guessing you are too young to remember the Thai sticks of old, but it didn't matter if they were green sticks or brown, they totally knocked you on your ass and made you practically comatose if you smoked too much, this high is the most similar to my original 5hz cut, that is why I cherished that cut, it's narcotic effect comes from Thai not Northern lights which has a nice mild relaxing social type of high, as compared to Thai sticks and haze.
I also get the pure euphoric chemotypes in my hazes, no comedown, these are the phenos I select for my day smoke, and they are much cleaner and more refined than any of the pure landraces I have smoked, and I have smoked many.

 

[HAZENACIOUS]

Ma,
ECSD is actually the perfect example of a cut that defies your cliche simplistic, and totally flawed view of Chemotype.
Diesel, which while it may appear sativa dominant by phenotype, actually has quite a bit of indica in its pedigree, yet it has the cleanest most uppity "sativa" high of anything available from dispensary(and by the way cleaner than most true narrow leaf phenos I have tried). Why is this? It is because, although there is some correlation, chemotype is really not completely tied to leaf expression believe it or not. It just worked out that way with diesel, I guess nature is not a weed bigot like you.

 

[Donald Mallard]

Ma,

I am guessing you are too young to remember the Thai sticks of old, but it didn't matter if they were green sticks or brown, they totally knocked you on your ass and made you practically comatose if you smoked too much, this high is the most similar to my original 5hz cut, that is why I cherished that cut, it's narcotic effect comes from Thai not Northern lights which has a nice mild relaxing social type of high, as compared to Thai sticks and haze.
I also get the pure euphoric chemotypes in my hazes, no comedown, these are the phenos I select for my day smoke, and they are much cleaner and more refined than any of the pure landraces I have smoked, and I have smoked many.

i didnt get the same , the high from cannabis is subjective as we are all aware now , what i feel , may not be what you feel ,

i felt energized by those thai sticks and the herb we grew from the seed ,
sitting on the edge of my seat waiting to finish the toke in order to go somewhere and do something ,
slightly more narcotic effect is sometimes due to the longer cure and the sweat cure we think those sticks underwent imho ..

if they were fresh as us western folks tend to toke the effect would be quite different imho ... (see t he malawi cure thread)



in more recent times i spent time in thailand smoking similar weed , while not as potent , it did the same ,
i got very high , but was quite keen to head out into places to see new things and enhance the high i was on ... i was on the edge of my seat waiting to go go go ..

 

[Donald Mallard]

You continue to rubbish and slander a dead man and worse are allowed to do so in icmag with out being pulled up by mods.

People like you need to be put on a short leash so what have you contributed to the cannabis community apart from hate ?.

Yes Nevil used heroin but when he started to breed cannabis he was clean and cannabis helped him stay clean till the end as it has many other people around the world.

You wouldn't know a good haze plant if you had it land on you.

everyone is able to give their opinion hempy ,
it doesnt matter if it conflicts with or is the opposite of yours ,
or even it it puts folks you regard highly into a darker light ..

that is how a forum is supposed to operate man .. like it or not ,,..

hey we even allow your opinion ..

 

[willydread]

I would like to have the strains of twenty years ago ... but I would also like to have the head and soul of twenty years ago ...
You may like it or not, but the effects (the experience) you have at 16-20 years is different from what you have at 40-50-60 years, it changes the organism, the brain, (even if inside they are the same sixteen year old idiot XD )...

 

[Rembetis]

Donald, my experiences were like yours . I dont recall any Thais or Durbans having any narcotic aspect to them. Or any of the Landrace Sativas for that matter that were around during the 70's.

Haze, you probably think my views are narrow as well but to be fair all of our opinions are valid because they are based on our own personal experiences. I havent tried some of the strains you have mentioned so my experience is more limited than yours especially with you having lived in Africa.
We all have different reference points which leads to misunderstandings I think. Someone mentions 20 years ago as old strains. Another the 90's. My reference point starts in the early 70's and others the 60's. It does have a huge effect on what we all think of as good weed. As does your place in the world and what particular smuggling routes were employed at the time. And as we all know even the Landraces have evolved in their homelands so it tough to be able to really compare.

I dont mind having my views challenged at all and maybe it will force me to evolve my thinking on a subject but I agree that personal attacks should be kept out of our discussions.

 

[Sunshineinabag]

VT reggae festival

VT reggae festival

These threads at times remind me of the old fest.....started out small w old heads...then newer younger folks started showing up....before too too long 2-5 yrs, it grew so big and out of control it wasn't fun anymore.......

 

[Switcher56]

I can relate to that

 

[HAZENACIOUS]

i didnt get the same , the high from cannabis is subjective as we are all aware now , what i feel , may not be what you feel ,

i felt energized by those thai sticks and the herb we grew from the seed ,
sitting on the edge of my seat waiting to finish the toke in order to go somewhere and do something ,
slightly more narcotic effect is sometimes due to the longer cure and the sweat cure we think those sticks underwent imho ..

if they were fresh as us western folks tend to toke the effect would be quite different imho ... (see t he malawi cure thread)



in more recent times i spent time in thailand smoking similar weed , while not as potent , it did the same ,
i got very high , but was quite keen to head out into places to see new things and enhance the high i was on ... i was on the edge of my seat waiting to go go go ..

Hi Donald,
Yes, well, when I say narcotic, I mean like if you smoke to much of it, you get the spins and can't really move, like if you take too many narcotics, I'm not trying to say it's going to give the same effects as an Indica.
But my point is, cliches are usually mostly true, this is why they become cliches in the first place, this does not mean they can be used as axioms. But racists and bigots do use generalities as axioms to try and prove their false bigotted points.

An example to illustrate:
Forbes did an article examining statistics in USA showing that generally white people earn more than black people. They made a statement in the article "in USA the black population is poorer then the white population."
Now let's take a basketball thread, some folks are arguing about who the highest paid ballers are, and someone says it's Michael Jordan.
Now some idiot comes on the thread and says this is impossible because white people obviously earn more than black people so the highest paid baller must therefore be white.
This is the type of inductive reasoning flaw that bigots make all the time, and it's the same mistake Ma is making when he tries to discount or refute the experience of others with his broad sweeping generalizations about sativa and indica,
There are exceptions to every rule and this is what makes bigotry so stupid.

 

[therevverend]

i felt energized by those thai sticks and the herb we grew from the seed ,
sitting on the edge of my seat waiting to finish the toke in order to go somewhere and do something ,
slightly more narcotic effect is sometimes due to the longer cure and the sweat cure we think those sticks underwent imho ..

I've heard plenty accounts of shipments of Thai Sticks having an extremely narcotic effect. Your description sounds the opposite of that. It seems likely the narcotic couchlock nod out effects could be attributed to opium.

 

[VerdantGreen]

Preferring to get high rather than stoned doesn't make you better or more discerning than everyone else...



Personally i love to get high, and i also love to get stoned.


Aren't we all lucky to have variety and a choice ?


VG

 

[Benny106]

I've heard plenty accounts of shipments of Thai Sticks having an extremely narcotic effect. Your description sounds the opposite of that. It seems likely the narcotic couchlock nod out effects could be attributed to opium.

Perhaps even oxidisation of thc from the boat trip.

 

[HAZENACIOUS]

I've heard plenty accounts of shipments of Thai Sticks having an extremely narcotic effect. Your description sounds the opposite of that. It seems likely the narcotic couchlock nod out effects could be attributed to opium.

That is a good point, I used to get brown sticks, which I was told were opiated that used to effect me totally different then the green sticks(which were greenish brown).
But the experts on here were telling me I got duped, there was no opiated Thai, so these narcotic effects must come from a different way of curing or something. But regardless, a lot of the weed in Africa does amp you out for a few hours and then knocks you out hard. The landrace pictured above does this in the extreme and it is the most sativa leaning variety I have grown.