Aphids with 3 weeks to go, help needed!

[Hombre del mont]

Hi Chaps, My Panama (outside in the earth) has about 3 to 4 weeks left till she's done. Yesterday i noticed that i'm getting more yellowing and falling leaves than i would have expected. When i exaximned them i discovered that i have a bad infestation of aphids. I have removed the worst affected leaves. I'm using neem in the irrigation water. Is there aything else i can use at this late stage.
I'm currently not able to upload photo's, but aphids are aphids.
Many thanks

 

[vcasqui]

I don't know how big the infestation is or where the aphids are located in the plant; but if they are in the lower parts, where the buds are not "too important", I would recommend to spray with dish soap (if I remember well you live in Spain, so you can use something like Fairy or Lagarto. I tried them both and they work good).

It actually works like wonders; last year I had an extreme infestation of them too and I tried many things, the only thing that really worked was dish soap. This year I had some leafs infested too on my MalawixPCK#1, one spray was enough to get rid of them (I catched the plague early tho). If you do it, you should expect a lot of dead, dried aphids the next day (their color should change from green/yellow to grey/black, that's how you know they are dying/dead). Spray nicely on both parts of the leafs (front and back) and also spray some of the stock and stems (where the aphids might be moving around to get to other parts of the plant).

Stay on top of them tho, they reproduce fast.

 

[Hombre del mont]

Hi vcasqui, Thanks for your reply,
You are correct, I live in Spain. We have fairy.
The infestion has not yet reached all parts of the plant, (she's quite large and spread out scrog style) it's mainly on the older fan leaves.Could i use Potasium soap instead of dish soap at this late stage?.
I'll see if i can upload some pictures.

 

[Hombre del mont]

 

[deepwaterdude]

If you can hose the plant off, or spray it with a somewhat powerful sprayerr, you can get rid of many/most that way. I used soap on my Zam x Kali China that was much more badly affected than yours. She got to harvest fine, then I dipped her tops in H2O2 water before drying to get the remaining off. Good luck, very nice plant

 

[vcasqui]

I have no idea about Potasium soap. The way the dish soap works is by drying the aphids, due to the kind of body they have and the products on the soap (surfactants I think). If the potasium soap has the same effect, then I'm guessing it should work; maybe you can find some info about that.

Another option I checked last year was (and I will write it in spanish) Diatomeas, that had a similar effect to dish soap (meaning that the objective is to kill the aphids by drying them) but the working was different; in this case, the Diatomeas are supposed to be small unicelular organisms with sharp "edges" or "walls" (I'm writing from memory. I readed this one year ago) and so when the aphids walk through them, because of their soft body, they get cuts and eventually die. I think that appart from that, diatomeas may have another benefits for the plants; and maybe they leave less or "more natural" residue behind. That said, I didn't try it out, so I don't know if it works or not.

I'm not sure what you mean by older fan leaves. I will guess that these leaves are on the bottom of the plant; if that is the case and if you can avoid to spray on top of the buds, then I would use dish soap. I can almost guarantee that, if you spray correctly, the aphids will greatly diminish or even completely die with just one spray.

Another option would be to try different methods in different parts of the plant, even if you have to sacrifice some of it. That way you learn for upcoming seasons.

Last year I fought them for too long, using different methods: removing leafs at the start, smashing thousand of them every day with my hands under the sun for hours was the next step, spraying 2 different pesticides (after the first didn't wotk at all, and same with the second one). These were my plants after around 45 days of fight (and I mean fight):

Gross right?

When I used the dish soap, those leafs were covered in black bodies the very next day. Some were left, but my infestation was massive. This year, as soon as I saw them, I sprayed them down. I never saw them again. You might be luckier and get away with just "physical fight", because the temperatures are going down and they should slow down.

And that's pretty much all the info I have about this topic. If you have doubts or whatever I'll try to help, but yeah.

EDIT: Ok @Hombre del mont , I can see by looking at your beatifull plants that it might not be too easy to spray them.

 

[Hombre del mont]

Thanks for the input chaps. After much thought and reading i decided to go with the potasium soap and mixed a little propolix cinam (prevents prowdery mildew) in with it. I took as many of the badly affected leaves off (the one in the photo was not one of the worse, although not as bad as yours in the photo vcasqui) I was careful not to spray the buds but did give the undersides of the leaves a really good drenching. It'll be interesting to have a look at her tomorrow morning.

For anyone iterested in my other plants, all grown srog style outdoors, take a look at https://www.icmag.com/node/17952564

 

[Frosty Nuggets]

Next year keep an eye out, as soon as you see them release some ladybugs and they will eat the aphids.

 

[Montuno]

Tranquilo, Hombre del Monte : cultivas en el Mediterráneo español en exterior, y encima con "cultivo rastrero" (el que más atrae plagas).
No te preocupes que no es grave. Sigue regando con el neem hasta que lo nesesites (da igual el estado de floración; pero añade N, eso si).

Para fumigar, es mejor el jabón potásico (o el jabón artesano de siempre) que el lavavajillas, pero si este es biodegradable, no hay problema.

Ten cuidado de tampoco promover demasiado una humedad excesiva artificialmente, no vayas a atraer otras plagas diferentes como la mosca blanca o mohos... El último es la peor plaga posible, quitando bacterias y virus...

Saludos montunos!!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=DRYreJMfHio

 

[RED 1]

Thanks for the input chaps. After much thought and reading i decided to go with the potasium soap and mixed a little propolix cinam (prevents prowdery mildew) in with it. I took as many of the badly affected leaves off (the one in the photo was not one of the worse, although not as bad as yours in the photo vcasqui) I was careful not to spray the buds but did give the undersides of the leaves a really good drenching. It'll be interesting to have a look at her tomorrow morning.

For anyone iterested in my other plants, all grown srog style outdoors, take a look at https://www.icmag.com/node/17952564

Deepwaterdude's spray them,hoze them down with masses of water,works.Even a thunderstorm,or,two might be beneficial in the plant's pest free grow
Had a similar situation,outdoors,with 2 sativas in pots,1 in soil
Light spray of your choosing,let it sit for 15min(underneath the leaves as you are doing),wash her down afterwards,3/4 times.Nighttime,towards dawn,best time I found,so by sunrise most of the extra water has evaporated,absorbed by night temps
Hose them down 'against the grain'

 

[40degsouth]

Hey Hombre, sorry l’ve only just seen your predicament. Aphids can multiply really quickly, an aphid can reproduce without copulation and are perfect genetic replicas of the parent.
They are generally “farmed” and protected, by ants living in symbiosis. The ants eat the honeydew secreted, as a byproduct of sap sucking and the aphids get protection from predators. If you can stop the ants getting up the stem of the plant they generally disappear in a few days either by predation or flying away to find another security detail to care for them.
The nest, of ants, is generally located very close to the base of the plant and can be killed with ant powder however the easiest way I’ve found to stop them is to smear a petroleum based product around the stem, at the base of the plant. Tiger Balm, Vics Vaporrub are examples.
Hope this helps,
Cheers,
40.

 

[RED 1]

Hey Hombre, sorry l’ve only just seen your predicament. Aphids can multiply really quickly, an aphid can reproduce without copulation and are perfect genetic replicas of the parent.
They are generally “farmed” and protected, by ants living in symbiosis. The ants eat the mildew secreted, as a byproduct of sap sucking and the aphids get protection from predators. If you can stop the ants getting up the stem of the plant they generally disappear in a few days either by predation or flying away to find another security detail to care for them.
The nest, of ants, is generally located very close to the base of the plant and can be killed with ant powder however the easiest way I’ve found to stop them is to smear a petroleum based product around the stem, at the base of the plant. Tiger Balm, Vics Vaporrub are examples.
Hope this helps,
Cheers,
40.

Thin wire messing,the type you put on a window,laid on top soil,stem growing through(from seedling),kept down by a layer of perlite,makes life difficult for ants,and,a few others to spread
Very good point,thought I add something that seemed to work outdoors

 

[Hombre del mont]

Thank you gentlemen for your reassurances and good advice. It seems the spray has done the job. I'll put pictures up at the weekend.

 

[dubi]

Hi Hombre del mont, sorry to hear that your Panama got aphids in late flowering.
It's easy to keep aphids under control during growth and early flowering with consistent and frequent potassium soap and neem preventive sprayings and plant inspections.

40degsouth is correct, usually severe aphid infestation is related with ants. I won't recommend you to spray with anything at this point.
What you did is correct, remove manually the most the most affected leaves and with more bugs, wash the main leaves of the colas and most affected parts of the plant with a high pressure hose in mid day of a sunny and dry day. I have been able to fully remove severe aphid infections from hibiscus with just constant and frequent high pressure water washes.

I don't recommend to always add neem in every watering, it may provide more protection, but it can easily alter the natural aromas and taste of the plant if used too much during flowering.

 

[El Quijote]

Thank you gentlemen for your reassurances and good advice. It seems the spray has done the job. I'll put pictures up at the weekend.

Hombre del Mont mira a ver si al lado de tus plantas tienes otras plantas Con pulgones y se pasaron unas a otras, me pasó lo mismo un año y fue por unos Rosales que tenía al lado que les encanta las Rosas y se pasaron a mis plantas que estaban cerca, Corte los Rosales y adiós a los pulgones, espero que los puedas controlar aún que sean manualmente saludos

 

[El Quijote]

Hola buenas tardes a todos/as con permiso de hombre del Mont que inició este hilo y ya que veo que hay buenos doctores en la enfermería, tengo un problema con mi killer A5 Haze tengo oidio en la planta y nunca me pasó en mitad de floración me habia pasado en floración muy avanzada pero no en mitad de floración, limpie con los dedos y agua todo lo que pude ver pero no se si esto ira a más hace más de 6 días que no llueve y no se que hacer no quiero echar químicos ni nada que me cambie el sabor, ayuda por favor saludos

 

[El Quijote]

Ayuda para eliminar el oidio

 

[El Quijote]

Hola buenas,Esta tarde comenzaré a fumigar con agua oxigenada mezclada con agua 30 mililitros de agua oxigenada por litro de agua y veré si se va el oidio o al menos lo controlo un poco , Estado leyendo que funciona, asin que no me queda otra que experimentar y ver si funciona

 

[Hombre del mont]

HI El Quijote, appologies but my spanish is poor. Have a read about Propolis, its a natural product that works against Oidio and can be used up to 10 days before harvest. I bought some from the local grow shop as a preventative but it also stops it, i believe. Good luck

 

[El Quijote]

Muchas gracias sería buena idea fumigar con agua oxigenada y al día siguiente fumigar con propoleo. es líquido el propoleo??