Alternatives to Perlite for soil aeration?

[Mr. Greengenes]

How do you go about mixing the charcoal in you with your soil?

I'm talking about indoor/containers, but I have every intention of trying it outdoors this spring. I'm telling all my homies to as well so we may have result reports in the fall if all goes well.

I've noticed that charcoal really absorbs water, so it's very important to water thoroughly the first time to keep the charcoal from robbing the plant.

On a side note, I was running an experiment putting strong 'compost teas' through a backyard biofilter (similar to what you'd find in a koi pond) for a few weeks to see if I could convert some of the ammonia to nitrites and nitrates. The result was a very potent tea that was better tolerated by plants. One day I was crushing up charcoal with a paving stone and just got a wild idea and tossed a couple handfuls of big charcoal chunks (uncrushed) into the biofilter. They floated around about a week and then sank. The sunk pieces were very potent fertilizer when I crushed them into my mix! I'm guessing they absorbed all the converted forms of N (along with other yummy stuff) and made them available to the plants. Anyway, just thought I'd share that idea (as alchemic as it is) in case anyone else want's to run with it.

 

[Noonin NorCal]

I meant like if you break it down into small perlite size pieces and mixed it into your soil.
Ive heard of adding bio char to soil

 

[art.spliff]

7 Ways to Feed Your Garden For Free (Complete Film)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7CyFqs2qWc

 

[Mate Dave]

 

[Ibechillin]

When I say wobbly plants, I mean the roots and main stalk not the branches. It's like the soil is too "loose" not strong enough to hold a big plant. I put chicken wire around each plant and will try pounding a stake down deep as somebody suggested.

Its your genetics, not your inputs. Not many people think about root anatomy...

There are different types of root structures which reflect the home environment of the parent strains.

taproot/deep anchoring style (arid dry hard ground plants)
fibrous/wide style with no tap root to anchor (tropical wet environments)
hybrid exaggerated style (both combined in increased proportion)

Silverback had a bunch of good info about it, I made a post about root systems in the wider pots or more soil thread that goes pretty in depth about it:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=8273350&postcount=31

 

[CrushnYuba]

I think the bottom line is if you get enough wind, anything is going down without real support. I have had some massively rooted 5+lb plants wrapped in a 5ft wide cage flip right over cage and all. The roots on one side actually snapped.
Bamboo is useless.
The only thing that has worked is 1/2" rebar to support the main stem, pounded through my soil and into the native. And i pound rebar down to support the cage. Especially after the plant grows towards the Sun all year. It gets heavy on the South side.
I don't think the perlite or genetics makes much of a difference once they are real well established. I never see plants uproot. The roots have to snap to go down.. And it happens.

 

[Mate Dave]

I would suggest that plants that are direct sown with a tap root & or planted later into a suitable spot will not need any crop support.

You won't be growing kilos & kilos but a kilo plant don't need anything if it's branching phyllotaxy & lower 1/3 is removed & the tops thinned out reducing weak points & splits in the vascular system preventing breakages from dropping... Cleary fusarium & verticillium are gonna be problematic in any supported grow.. Nets cage all look like options but when you have unlimited plant numbers growing the full season is ludicrous.. Look @ how much Africa can produce from those lil plants

 

[Microbeman]

Huh? We grew over 3000 plants outdoors and very few ever broke. We used no supports. Average height 5 feet but we grew some to 12 feet. We did not cut off lower branches nor top them.

 

[Mate Dave]

They shouldn't need any pruning if you plant them @ the right stage. Unfortunately some plants have little lignin & don't hold up the buds that are encoded in their DNA when left to go the full season. Tested varieties have cultural guides..

It's better to thin out the plants to allow airflow & light to the centres as the grade of the weed increases when they are getting that airflow & light penetration. I learned that in one season.

3000 is a huge grow & would be much work so the plants need to be fit for purpose.

I wouldn't top seed plants with known apical dominance but cuttings are grown to a framework to optimise centres with the more BLD types. More nutrient flowing evenly throughout the vascular system. NLD or traditional sativa need that apical stem to do anything usefull it seems.

Pruning of anything increases vigour & rejuvenates prior to differentiation & cell & tip elongation..

 

[h.h.]

Pushing that nitrogen, need a balance. Top heavy with weak roots, gonna break.

The only reason I agreed with the staking was due to the layering of soil on top of clay. There's no structure to stabalize the soil. The roots probably go straight down to the clay and have little reason to go anywhere else.
Water is probably collecting on top of the clay. Play around with your watering.
Try to tease the roots into spreading more.
IMO. Oatmeal will help your soil aggregate. It will help establish a fungal network. It will give more structure to your soil.

Not an idea situation. Making due with what you got.

 

[Sunshineinabag]

Pistachio shells and an occasional round of night crawlers into the medium, I put 6 crawlers into 20 quarts of medium. No issues!

 

[Ibechillin]

Pushing that nitrogen, need a balance. Top heavy with weak roots, gonna break.

Good mention, kind of a long post but there is a good explanation of Nitrogen and Phosphorus' roles in root development:

Ive been thinking lately about alternating ph down, phosphoric acid in the first half of flower/till end of stretch as P provides energy for the plant and then sulfuric acid during bud development for increased quality.

From what I understand currently Calcium should be at least equal to or ideally slightly higher than potassium, as excess potassium or magnesium competes for calcium uptake. Even with plenty calcium available in solution its mostly immobile to the plant, with balanced nutrition regular routine (weekly) foliar application of an amino chelated calcium (Glycine amino added makes highly plant available form) and ammonium nitrogen should be used to keep up with rapid above ground growth. Boron drives calcium availability as well and needs to be maintain in an equilibrium, like 1ppm needed available constantly.

Fulvic acid is amazing at increasing nutrient availability/plant cell permeation ability and should be used as often as possible in feeds/foliars to maximize its benefits. Beneficial fungi can greatly increase the availability of Phosphorus to the plant's roots as well. Amorphous (biogenic) forms of silica (im pretty sure diatomaceous earth is the same/similar) grab onto and carry plant available forms of nutrients to the roots and are used as a home by beneficial bacteria/fungi to colonize on the roots more efficiently also.

Info on Phosphorus/potassium use in plants and maximizing its benefits by Harley Smith:

"Phosphorus is the energy element, essential to the chemistry of life. It is part of a molecule called ATP (adenosine tri-phosphate) that serves as the energy currency of plants. Energy from photosynthesis and respiration is temporarily stored in the high-energy phosphate bonds. When the phosphate bonds are broken, energy is released to activate a series of chemical reactions in plants.

If a plant doesn’t receive adequate phosphorus, its energy needs can’t be fully met. The plant’s new growth will be stunted, both at the roots and at the shoots, and as phosphorus deficiency worsens, the plant will eventually shut down and die. An adequate amount of phosphorus is required throughout the entire life cycle of a plant, and lack of available phosphorus is often the limiting factor for plant growth.

Phosphorus is not very mobile in soil. It is easily adsorbed or locked up with other minerals, making it unavailable to plants. Very little plant-available phosphorus is actually dissolved in the soil solution. In fact, adsorbed phosphates on soil particles are often hundreds to thousands of times greater than phosphates in the soil solution. As a plant takes up the phosphates from the soil solution, the adsorbed phosphates slowly take their place, but they are sometimes not fast enough to meet the energy needs of the plants. Plants must have a steady supply of phosphorus from seed to harvest.

In nature, mycorrhizal fungi help plants take up phosphorus. The fungi penetrate root cells and send out hyphae (thread-like structures), seeking out water and precious phosphorus in the surrounding soil and organic matter. The fungi exude enzymes and organic acids to make the phosphorus soluble, then feed it to the roots of the plant.

In exchange, the plant exudes sugars to feed the mycorrhizal fungal. Usually, it’s a good trade. In fact, if there is a phosphorus deficiency in the soil, plants will exude signal molecules to attract mycorrhizal fungi. On the other hand, if there is plenty of water-soluble phosphorus, plants will exude enzymes to repel mycorrhizal fungi, treating them as a pathogen.

Organic gardeners using relatively insoluble forms of phosphorus such as bone meal and rock phosphate should consider inoculating roots with mycorrhizal fungi. But for even better results, adding phosphorus-solubilizing bacteria along with the mycorrhizae is a powerful combination.

The beneficial bacteria hitch a ride on the fungal strands and swim to places in the soil solution the fungi can’t reach. The bacteria then exude enzymes to release phosphorus from the surrounding soil and organic matter and make it more available to the mycorrhizae. Phosphorus-solubilizing bacteria feed the fungi, and the fungi feed the plants.

One of the benefits of hydroponics is the availability of water-soluble phosphorus. Even so, the phosphates must be kept separate from calcium ions in concentrated form. That’s why hydroponic nutrients often come in two-part and three-part formulas. All of the calcium is in one bottle, and all of the phosphates are in the other bottle.

If the two were combined in concentrated form, the calcium would react with the phosphates to form calcium phosphate, which is 95% insoluble. Both the calcium and the phosphates would lock up, precipitate out of solution and become unavailable to the plants. But once diluted in enough water, the calcium and phosphates remain soluble in solution to be easily absorbed.

Mono-ammonium phosphate (MAP), a highly water-soluble form of phosphorus, is often included in starter fertilizers used by commercial growers. The additional phosphorus energizes the rooting process, and the ammonium is quickly assimilated through the developing roots to produce growth hormones and enzymes.

Adding a little extra phosphorus during the first 2-3 weeks of vegetative growth can have a dramatic effect on root strike and the establishment of plants. Lab tests have shown up to a 20% increase in root mass with nutrient formulas supplemented with a moderate increase of MAP during the early vegetative growth stage.

Another key stage for phosphorus application is during the fruiting and flowering stage. Most hydroponic bloom formulas provide phosphorus in the form of mono-potassium phosphate, providing adequate phosphorus throughout this phase. But sometimes plants need a boost. For example, during the transition from grow to bloom, a great deal of energy is diverted to flower production, and the plant may not be able to keep up with the extra energy demand. A little supplemental phosphorus during the early flowering stage can give a plant the energy boost it needs, promoting earlier flowering and more flowering sites.

During heavy fruit and flower production, plants continue to require higher levels of phosphorus to help provide energy for the developing fruit, but higher levels of potassium are also important for increased carbohydrate metabolism. That’s why there are many P-K boost formulas on the market.

Generally speaking, phosphorus and potassium are both important during the fruiting and flowering stage, but increased phosphorus is particularly beneficial during the early flowering stage, while increased potassium is particularly beneficial during heavy fruiting and flowering. If you want to fine-tune the nutritional needs of your plants, it’s best to spoon-feed phosphorus and potassium separately whenever possible.

Many hydroponic growers use phosphoric acid to lower the pH of their nutrient solution, but since phosphoric acid is actually a phosphorus fertilizer, it can quickly build up to toxic levels if too much is used. Moderation is the key.Phosphorus additives are beneficial when they are used in the correct amounts at the correct times. Learn to spoon-feed your crops to give them exactly what they need when they need it. A little extra phosphorus can energize the rooting process and stimulate the flowering process, but too much at the wrong time can have adverse effects. Manage your phosphorus fertilizers wisely and your plants will reward you with heavy yields of vibrant flowers and tasty fruits.

End Quote.

Biogenic Silica Info From Harley Smith:

"biogenic silica from volcanic sources does not have sharp edges. In fact, the biogenic silica particles are very smooth and porous, with a fine matrix of tiny holes that can actually filter water as it passes through them. As the water flows through the particles, mineral ions adhere to silica surfaces, allowing them to be released to plant roots on demand. So biogenic silica is not just a great source of plant-available silica, it is a reservoir for other important nutrients, actually making trace elements more available to the plant instead of locking them up!

Since biogenic silica comes from a natural source, it is not 100% water soluble. It is usually provided as a dry powder with the consistency of talcum powder. When added to water, about 25-30% of the silica dissolves into various forms of silicic acid and becomes immediately available to the plant. The rest of the silica is “flowable”, becoming trapped in the root zone to provide a slow-release form of silica and other beneficial minerals. The flowable particles are small enough that they won’t clog emitters, but they must be stirred up to keep them suspended in water. If they are not stirred, some of the fine particles will settle out of solution in a few hours.

Silica is great for plants, but the greatest benefit of biogenic silica is its effect on plant-growth-promoting bacteria in the root zone. Beneficial bacteria thrive at neutral pH, so biogenic silica makes a perfect home for bacteria that colonize the root zone. In fact, biogenic silica is actually one of the best “carriers” for microbial blends used to inoculate plant roots. As the fine particles of silica embed themselves in the root zone, the microbes use the particles as launching stations to the developing roots. In addition, the trace elements that adsorb to the surfaces of the silica particles are readily available to microbes, speeding up their metabolism and providing a biological bridge to the roots. Along with the microbial-enhanced silicon and trace elements, microorganisms provide vitamins, enzymes and growth hormones that stimulate root development and provide a nutritious soup of natural plant protection agents. Therefore, plant-growth-promoting bacteria in the root zone, in conjunction with the biogenic silica, greatly enhance the plant’s natural resistance to stress and disease.

End Quote.

The ratio of ammonium to nitrate nitrogen plays an interesting role in plant development and nutrient PH stability as well.

Here is a good explanation on ammonium:Nitrate ratio by Harley Smith:

"Nitrate-N is a “luxury” element. In other words, if you give your plants extra nitrate, the plant will take it up, whether the plant needs it or not! Over 30% of the energy of photosynthesis is burned just to take up nitrates. So if you add too much nitrate nitrogen, the plant burns up its energy reserves for more top growth, but root growth is inhibited. The plants may look lush and dark green, but the plant will be weakened. Plants supplied with excess nitrates will produce large cells with thin cell walls, making them more susceptible to stress and disease, and excessive nitrates can delay or even prevent flowering! Stored nitrates in plant tissues can also give rise to off-flavors, and they are generally considered unhealthy. In fact, in Europe if nitrate levels are too high in the plant tissue, the produce will lose its organic certification, even if all-natural fertilizers are used.

A little ammonium-nitrogen is a quick fix. Plants will take up the ammonium ions immediately, without accumulating excess nitrates in the process. Ammonium - nitrogen can also be used as a light foliar feed to quickly green up the plant. Professional growers manipulate the ammonium:nitrate ratios of the nutrient solution to maximize quality and yield. For example, a “hard water” nutrient formula will have a higher ammonium to nitrate ratio to help stabilize pH. The ammonium ion is positively charged. So as the plant takes up ammonium ions, it exchanges positively-charged H+ ions from the roots. This tends to neutralize excess bicarbonate ions in well water and help drive the pH down. On the other hand, the nitrate ion is negatively charged. So as the plant takes up nitrates, it exudes negatively-charged bicarbonate or OH- ions from the roots, tending to drive the pH up. Therefore, increasing the ammonium to nitrate ratio can help stabilize pH problems in well water.

Unlike nitrate nitrogen, ammonium nitrogen is assimilated directly by the roots for immediate use by the plant, without burning up excess carbohydrates in the process. Under high light and CO2 conditions, extra ammonium ions can be very beneficial. If carbon dioxide is supplemented to levels above 750 ppm, plants will preferentially take up carbon molecules over nitrate-N, limiting protein production. If more of the nitrogen is provided in the ammonium form, however, the plant can utilize it directly for increased protein production under high CO2 and light conditions. Just don’t overdo it! Ammonium nitrogen can become toxic to plants at even modest levels, producing soft, “rank” growth, especially in cool, low-light conditions."

End quote.

When plants are grown from seed or cuttings are taken from mother plants fed in this style of balanced nutrition higher feed strength will be required throughout the plants life, Jidoka mentions having to feed rooted cuttings on 2.4 ec feed strength from transplant and needing aggressive microbiology to keep up with the plants Phosphorus requirements.

Lately ive been doing alot of research towards building a good organic soil mix in regards to Albrechts BCSR and spoon feeding soluble salts at specific intervals of the plants life in trace amounts to not hurt the microbiology and utilize the best aspects of both. Heres a post i shared with uselesss.gardens recently about it.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=8454921&postcount=252

 

[Mate Dave]

p2o5 & kelp are the proven ameliorants for optimum emergence. You need the Cal there from the start, there can be no nutrient cycling needed.

Water soluble phosphate is most beneficial during early root development, even if only in small quantities. Naturally occurring phosphorous can be very tightly bound to clay particles within the soil and is relatively unavailable to the young plant at a time when it is growing rapidly..

 

[40degsouth]

Hi everyone,
l've really been enjoying watching this thread expand and it's kind of slowed down so l thought I'd chime back in.
Thanks Microbe Man for your response to my question......l thought l was drawing a long bow with the whole worm thing but it seems we're on the same page with the brick layer's sand.
Hey Ibchillin, l don't know how to find that link to the sillica in your whachacallit thing?? Do l need 50 posts?? But anyway mate... it's lovely to make your acquaintance.
To get back on topic, l have been running activated charcoal in my R n D beds for a long time and my anicdotal experience is that it works well. This transpires for plant health and structure given the exra available carbon.
I'm not sure if the worms break it down or if it degrades due to microbeial process but crushed, activated, charcoal, sub soil, seems to degrade over the course of the season.
I've experimented this year with lumps of charcoal to see what happens sub soil this year, plant's are still big.
I've also used water crystals in my grows, since they became available and l can catagorically state that they are a gorilla's best friend.
In terms of airation of the soil, i.e. alternatives to perlite, they would have to be my number one. I haven't been able to find out if they are organic however, perhaps someone can enlighten me.
Some other cool experiments l've been running for a while are using crushed up cuttle fish as an alternative too. This experiment has become a bit redundant due to the vast nature of my soils but l can tell you that it stays in the horizon, of soil, it's placed in and doesn't degrade over time. You indoor guys should get into this and give it a go.........
You're welcome,
I've been using zeolite for a while and it holds cations, anions and water and gives them up freely.
From memory bentonite clay isn't the same as zeolite but if you're chasing cheap zeolite, l think it's the non clumping cat litter. Check it out and get back to us.
Cheers,
40

 

[h.h.]

Pittmoss, char, pumice, rice hulls, SPM, and zeolite(3/8" & sand).

 

[mrghost]

I use different sizes of lava rocks and clay pebbles + organic matter e.g. rice hulls, oats, etc.
Grainy rock dusts and shells can also create air pockets in your soil.

 

[ramse]

about the main question... the cork

you can find cork granulate, as a substrate for terrariums or as an insulating material for building

 

[risasdemaria]

Hi guys,

I'm looking for alternatives to Perlite for soil aeration and to give better structure to the soil.

fungi


but it takes time

 

[Mate Dave]

I've been playing about for month now with perlite stones & pine bark & the bark is the best of all 3. You get less compaction from watering & the media drains better. I add some perlite but the bark mulch reduces watering loads.

 

[CrushnYuba]

I use pine bark also.. But pine bark is more of a replacement for peat then perlite. It's the fluff, not the drainage material. You still need drainage like perlite or lava rock.
Also, pine bark has some down sides. It leaches allot of nitrogin when it decomposes, it is very acidic. When it dries out too much it becomes waaayyy hydrophobic. More then peat.

One of the best budget base mixes i have seen is 1/3 pine bark fines, 1/3 lava rock, 1/3 cow manure or some other compost. 50$ a yard base.