Am I reading this correctly? Arent cations attracted to organic matter?
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A question for the growers using Jacks 5-12-26
- Thread starter Jabapc
- Start date
Am I reading this correctly? Arent cations attracted to organic matter?
How much K would you drop outta the 5-12-26?
Do you think a coco/perlite mix 75/25 or 50/50 would make it work better with the amount of K it has?
I have noticed issues when trying to use silica, and I will say. It's much much better without it
Y
YosemiteSam
To the humus portion yes. cec sites are just open negative charges. Peat has at least 50% more cec than coco...then you add humus to it and it goes way higher.
Y
YosemiteSam
How much K would you drop outta the 5-12-26?
Do you think a coco/perlite mix 75/25 or 50/50 would make it work better with the amount of K it has?
I have noticed issues when trying to use silica, and I will say. It's much much better without it
First of all the Jacks is a good formula...better than bottled nutes for sure. The formula I run (in coco or peat...it don't matter) is 100-80-100-117-40 N-P-K-Ca-Mg. On top of that I add a cup per cubic ft of CaCO3 (to peat) or CaSO4 (to coco).
Per gallon of water I add...CaNO3, 2.44 grams...epsom 1.6, mkp 1.33, STEM 0.1 and Fe dpta 0.1
The problem with too much K shows up at the base cation exchange sites in soil and at the cellular level in plants. For maximum health you want 12% H (see Bruce Tainio's work). If you get too much K it will displace H (on cec sites or in the cell). When that happens the pH will go too high and your plant will become a bug magnet.
What I really shoot for is a base cation % of 68% Ca, 12% Mg, 12% H, 5% K and less than 2% Na. Get close to that and you got it made.
black_thumb
Member
The jacks has 52 P to 215 K ppm + i was adding another 35 ppm k with the silica to up my ph back to 5.8 that's 250 k ppm now my buds are fucked at 50 days 12/12 they look like there at only 30 days 12/12.
D
dramamine
Your water sounds like it has really high alkalinity. Maybe that's a part of the issues you're seeing. Jack's works very well in coco, even if the K level is higher than needed. I do use RO water, though.
black_thumb
Member
My well water is cleaner then bottled water i tested bottled @ 60-85 ppm .5 and my well water is 20-25 ppm .5
So i have very low alkalinity if any at all. iv not had it tested yet by a lab.
In my conclusion if you have low ph tap the jacks will not work in flowering but seem to grow good in veg only with my tap water.
So i have very low alkalinity if any at all. iv not had it tested yet by a lab.
In my conclusion if you have low ph tap the jacks will not work in flowering but seem to grow good in veg only with my tap water.
D
dramamine
If you are at ph 2.8 after adding jacks, you have an alkalinity issue. With pure ro water, it would be around 5 or so.
after some research, I agree.. Never ran peat before, not once, so ive nothing other than soil to compare with coco, but Im with ya, coco doesnt seem too bad as far as retaining cations.. good stuff..
black_thumb
Member
D
dramamine
i'm relatively new to Jack's but i was under the impression you could send J.R.Peters a sample of your water and they will tailor a nutrient mix specifically for that water supply, ...i don't know what it cost's though.
peace, bozo
peace, bozo
johnnyrotten
Member
They will do that I think the cost is around $25... My water had 270ppm and it was easier to use an RO filter...
Snook
Still Learning
Any tips on getting this stuff to dissolve? I've used a totally cleaned out bottle of gatorade to mix up the jack's hydroponics and I always have what I assume is the magnesium sinking to the bottom. I've tried HOT water, I've tried distilled water, I've tried hot distilled water. I've been shaking this bottle off and on for 30 minutes now and still have crap floating to the bottom, just with a little over 1/4 tspn of the stuff.
I don't have these issues when I use epsom salts so I don't get why this stuff never dissolves properly. Here's my water test sample from JR Peters, it cost either $25 or $30 I forget.
Secondary question would be are these numbers low enough that I shouldn't worry about having to get an RO system for ebb and flow?
I don't have these issues when I use epsom salts so I don't get why this stuff never dissolves properly. Here's my water test sample from JR Peters, it cost either $25 or $30 I forget.
Secondary question would be are these numbers low enough that I shouldn't worry about having to get an RO system for ebb and flow?
SecondAttempt
Active member
1. Don't use hot water
2. How much Jack's are you mixing and in what size gatorade bottle?
- try using distilled in the bottle... sounds like your making a stock solution so you don't want tap in
there.
2. How much Jack's are you mixing and in what size gatorade bottle?
- try using distilled in the bottle... sounds like your making a stock solution so you don't want tap in
there.
...i personally mix mine up in 2 gallon containers and i put 1/2 teaspoon of the cal/nit into that jug and shake it up a bit and let it sit while i find something else to do, i don't know that it helps any letting it sit but it doesn't hurt either.
anyway, like i said i mix in the cal/nit first and then when i get back to finish up i put that same 1/2 teaspoon of the base nutrient in, then about 1/2 ml of ph down and i'm good to go. (i'm very casual about my amounts because i believe a little fluctuation is no big whoop)
i forget who it was who recommended mixing in the calcium nitrate first but since i started doing it this way i no longer need to deal with anything settling out.
...keep in mind also that this is a weed that won't suffer one iota if your nutrient mix fluctuates a little so occasional sediments isn't the end of the world.
peace, bozo
anyway, like i said i mix in the cal/nit first and then when i get back to finish up i put that same 1/2 teaspoon of the base nutrient in, then about 1/2 ml of ph down and i'm good to go. (i'm very casual about my amounts because i believe a little fluctuation is no big whoop)
i forget who it was who recommended mixing in the calcium nitrate first but since i started doing it this way i no longer need to deal with anything settling out.
...keep in mind also that this is a weed that won't suffer one iota if your nutrient mix fluctuates a little so occasional sediments isn't the end of the world.
peace, bozo
About 1/2 teaspoon in a 32 oz bottle. I've read to use hot water for epsom salt so I asked JR Peters and they said there was no problem using hot water if it helped. I'll try just unheated distilled next time but I don't know if that's going to help. I've also used a gallon milk jug but I can't see through it enough to tell if anything is settling to the bottom.
Interesting, I have also always heard the opposite and was told by JR Peters to dissolve the base stuff first and never in a container that contained any cal-nit cuz supposedly that's what makes the Mag separate and settle. I just don't get why it's any different than simply dissolving Epsom Salts which I can do in any water without too much undissolved "leftover" and with hot water I can dissolve it 100%
Epson salts are magnesiun sulphate and what you have settling is the calcium most likely. It forms gypsum which is calcium sulphate and is what is settling out. The sulphates in your solution is combining with the calcium.
I make a stock solution with RO water and shake the piss out of it and let it settle for several days. I mix 880 grams per gallon of the Jack's and 580 grams per gallon of the calcium nitrate. I don't use magnesium sulphate. With these stock solutions I use 10 ml per gallon of easch to get about 600-650 PPM. Or and EC of about 1.2 to 1.3.
If you are getting something in the jack's that is not disolving it could be the MKP (monopotassium phosphate) which is harder to disolve and takes a little longer. If it is not that it is most likely calcium in your tap water combining with the sulphates in the Jack's.
