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A new possible threat to Stoner Liberties - Pain Management

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
There is a trend going on in the healthcare profession in the US that is pushing people with chronic pain towards an emerging specialty field of healthcare known as Pain Management. Traditionally in the past chronic pain was something one could get taken care of by their general or primary healthcare provider. You told your doctor of your pain, he/she maybe sent you out for some testing X-rays, MRI's, etc. and then if it turned out to be something that couldn't be fixed your doctor would prescribe you some form of pain medication, typically narcotics and muscle relaxers.

Unfortunately as is usually the case a few asshats like Rush Limbaugh ruined it for everyone else by going bat shit crazy with it and shopping around to multiple doctors in an attempt to build up a ridiculously large stash of pills to support a ridiculously large habit. Then again what would you expect from a ridiculous, large man? :)

Additionally you had the introduction of OxyContin, a powerful narcotic that was more or less legal heroin in pill form. That combined with an unwarranted prohibition of marijuana based on lies and propaganda denying access to people who wanted a way to self medicate from the stresses of everyday life other then the only government sanctioned (legal) form of self medication known as alcohol. You now have all the necessary ingredients to turn prescription drug abuse into the number one drug problem in America, especially among the country's youth who are denied legal access even to alcohol.

This caused lawmakers to address the issue by so complicating the treatment of chronic pain with rules and regulations aimed at preventing abuse, that general practitioners and primary care providers are turning away from treating chronic pain. Which in turn gave birth to a new specialty field known as pain management. One of the main practices of pain management is to require patients to come in monthly for their supply of medicine and before they can get it they must submit themselves to giving urine samples. The purpose of which is to determine if the patient is sticking to the regimen the doctor has prescribed or are they abusing it by taking more then they are supposed to and/or supplementing with other things. If it is found that the patient is doing that then the doctor generally cuts the patient off leaving them to suffer their pain with no legal avenue for relief.

This in effect holds the patient hostage, by forcing them to have to follow all the rules and regulations or suffer chronic pain. Now it is unclear to me at this point if marijuana use would be something they would test for at present but with medical marijuana steadily becoming more and more accepted as a real medicine for real health problems, including pain, it's just a matter of time before it will be tested for if it isn't already. That then will set the stage for recreational users of marijuana who have chronic pain to be forced to follow the laws regarding the use of marijuana or suffer their chronic pain if they don't. Also if they don't or they have a hard time complying I can see where government might use that information to strengthen their argument of how bad and addictive marijuana is by point to such people and saying "See, it's so addictive these people would rather risk suffering chronic pain then give up their marijuana use."

So watch out American Stoners or you might find your desire to treat that bad back or whatever other pain you might have will force you to have to give up on your desire to light up rather then drink up. America, the land of the not so free.
 
Such a good,informative article Hempkat. Also very true,unfortunately. I believe I read that prescription med abuse is the DEAs new number 1 priority. Its always seemed crazy to me how lawmakers could put marijuana "addiction" ahead of Oxycontin, xanax,valium, percocets. even qualudes back in the day. Ive known,seen,heard of so many people whos lives are ruined because of prescription meds. The ONLY way peoples lives are ruined by marijuana is because of arrest not because of marijuana
 

subrob

Well-known member
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Ya I had to take a urine test at the v.a. last week for the first time in a decade...wanted to make sure I had nothing but vics percs and cannabis in my system(that's another story)...I also had to sign a contract that I wouldn't get opiates from any other doctors etc....instead of getting 6-9 refills at a clip I have to call or come in every month...I can only imagine what its like for civilian patients w out documented proof of injury..america needs to handle the problem of scrip abuse..have a feeling its going to be a pain for everyone
 

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
Such a good,informative article Hempkat. Also very true,unfortunately. I believe I read that prescription med abuse is the DEAs new number 1 priority. Its always seemed crazy to me how lawmakers could put marijuana "addiction" ahead of Oxycontin, xanax,valium, percocets. even qualudes back in the day. Ive known,seen,heard of so many people whos lives are ruined because of prescription meds. The ONLY way peoples lives are ruined by marijuana is because of arrest not because of marijuana

Well it's not an article as in something someone else wrote that I'm posting. This is purely an opinion piece based on observation of what my wife has been forced to deal with lately. She has some serious health issues that have been causing chronic pain for the past decade but now her doctor quit the office she worked out of to pursue a type of practice where there is less government interference and the office she worked out of is no longer going to treat chronic pain nor has she been able to find any other local primary care providers willing to treat chronic pain again because of all the new regulations. So she's been forced into "Pain Management" which is treating her like a junkie because they're weening her off the opiates she's been on (Percocet and Fentaynl) and replacing it with Methadone a (synthetic opiate). She also has COPD so she hasn't smoked marijuana for quite some time but after learning of how this Pain Management system operates it occurred to me how this could impact people who smoke recreationally but also have chronic pain they treat with prescription narcotics.

I'm guessing Doctor/Patient confidentiality would keep the doctors from being able to "snitch" on the people they find using marijuana. But this system could allow them to force people to choose between continuing to smoke pot or treat their chronic pain. I can see where some marijuana would help with certain types of pain but I have a hard time believing it would effectively relieve the kind of pain most people on prescription narcotics have.
 

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
Pills are evil. I hate losers who use oxycontin

Well I think that's a bit harsh, although I would agree that people who abuse narcotics like oxycontin when they don't really need them, are losers. Some however have genuine need for those kinds of drugs and they get genuine relief from them so those people I wouldn't consider losers and for them these narcotic pills can be a godsend making every day life at least tolerable.

So I wouldn't say the pills are evil but rather have the potential to be put to evil use by evil people who screw it up for those who genuinely need it.
 

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
Ya I had to take a urine test at the v.a. last week for the first time in a decade...wanted to make sure I had nothing but vics percs and cannabis in my system(that's another story)...I also had to sign a contract that I wouldn't get opiates from any other doctors etc....instead of getting 6-9 refills at a clip I have to call or come in every month...I can only imagine what its like for civilian patients w out documented proof of injury..america needs to handle the problem of scrip abuse..have a feeling its going to be a pain for everyone

The way you describe it for how it's done at the VA is exactly the same as how the civilian "Pain Management" place my wife is being forced to go to. Even down to the opioide contract. The also told her that if she got a script for opiates from anywhere else like a dentist giving viccodine after a tooth extraction she would have to bring it to them first and they would say whether she could get it filled or not. They also told her that if she ran out because she wasn't getting enough relief and took more then she was supposed to she would just have to tough it out until a month had passed and she could get her refill. Additional if her pills were lost or stolen she would be SOL until the next month but in the event of theft she had better file a police report. Not that they would give her a refill if she did but because if she didn't they might view her as trying to scam the system.
 

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
I guess I need to amend this because originally I was casting this as a US only problem but someone here just gave me some rep indicating he just had the same thing happen to him in the UK.
 

HempKat

Just A Simple Old Dirt Farmer
Veteran
Another aspect of this that is really twisted is this. I have a friend in Colorado that has been going to pain management for a while now and he tells me that he has to be really careful about maintaining an appropriate level of narcotics in his samples otherwise they cut him off. Which means essentially he has to keep taking the narcotics he takes whether he's actually feeling pain or not otherwise he risks losing them for the times when he does need them.
 

Hammerhead

Disabled Farmer
ICMag Donor
Veteran
I have used pain management Dr. I had no issues with getting my meds. they only thing is they want to make sure your taking the meds and not sealing them. This is what I was told. So they give piss test to see if its in your system. If not your cut off.. I have always passed my tests and got what ever they prescribed. Now I changed my Dr. I want them to detox me and start a different treatment. I don't want to be dependent while im trying a new treatment. This will start April. I hope the Suboxone will keep the withdraws under control. It's time to get of these permanently. I might have to get a scooter after since I wont be able to walk very well.
 

redlaser

Active member
Veteran
Pain management places and docs vary on their cannabis policy in my experience. I've been to three, two in a non-med state and one in CA. They all piss test but only the cali one wanted to boot me for weed despite a valid rec. As the douchey doc said, his hands are tied because it's a federal thing.......Most docs don't wanna screw with the red tape/extra d.e.a so there aren't many pain docs......That being said, I have found a few primary physicians that will write for pain but of course you need the medical history to back that up. It shouldn't be so difficult to get your pain treated, especially if it's chronic. But I do see two sides to this after twenty+ years, you have doctors on the other extreme who give meds too freely, and some in the middle. Not once has a doctor ever discussed with me how easy it is to o.d. on pain meds. Woke up in the hospital three different times from an accidental overdose, once on a ventilator. One time it happened while I was driving, luckily I was semi-stopped at an intersection. .......But I sympathize with what your wife is going through HempC, they do treat you like an addict and make you feel like your the problem somehow. I didn't think methadone was much of an improvement although it slightly helped with the memory problems morphine and fentanyl, oxy would cause. ( it was like a 10% improvement)
 

Hammerhead

Disabled Farmer
ICMag Donor
Veteran
I agree Methadone s the last one I would take due to its very addictive and some say worse then opiate addiction. im going with Sub to get off of them after 8 years. It should be easier for me since I was taking Morphine that one is the weakest form of Opiates out there. Fingers crossed it works for me. Im very hard headed. they all told me I would start taking more then I was prescribed years ago that never happened, If I took my dosage for the day I would not take more no matter how I felt.

My last Dr just gave me what ever I asked for. Im hoping my new Dr will listen to me and treat me the right way. Even if I cant walk its better then being sick and dependent on a drug.
 

redlaser

Active member
Veteran
Hope that subox does you some good PF. I tried it while quitting opiates and didn't care for it, but didn't truly give it a chance. All that crap feels the same to me, especially while going through withdrawl so I would rather just suddenly stop and get it over with. I have been able to get cortisone shots that helped with pain some. Sure wish I had tried to quit earlier but it took the right dr. with these shots to even offer any alternative.
 

rives

Inveterate Tinkerer
Mentor
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Veteran
I've been going through this for quite a while, in California, and am curious how they are determining the level of opiates from a urine test. The tests that I've taken are basically a litmus test and only show positive or negative if it is above detectable levels.

My doctor told me in advance that they were going to have to start testing, and that if I might test positive for cannabinoids, then I needed to get a rec on file. He said that as long as I had the rec, it was fine, and that has proven to be the case for the last several years.

The test that they administer is a standard panel that I believe tests for 8 different drugs.
 

Critter

Think for yourself, question authority
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Tell me about it. Down here in hell I have a older(late sixties)patient recently get 1/3 lung removed has cancer/many other health probs amongst being blind. The fn dock wouldn't perscrib him cause he told em he smoked bud. Dude had to move to get another doc. On the flip side the opposite has been true for me ..doc said it was cool if I smoked. Same state so it's wishy washy at best. Made me feel terrible
 

Hammerhead

Disabled Farmer
ICMag Donor
Veteran
I think it will get better. That's doesn't help those now. I don't think the test how much is in your system. just that it is there..So far no one has said anything about Cannabis in my system. With the new dr i don't want any pain meds. I want off of them so they should help me or I will be pissed off.


I need something to help. my cramps are bad enough to put me in the hospital. I cant move, puts me on the floor curled up like a baby.


I have had that shots before. I don't think they will help with my withdraws though. I have a very strong will so my old Dr says. out of all his pain patience he had I was the only one that adhered to the dosages he prescribed me. Everyone else alwys took more then what they where supose to.
 

Tripsick

Experienced?
Veteran
I was lucky, on Oxymorphone for 6 years and stopped abruptly in Jan due to the fact that at the time it was making my headaches worse.. so i just stopped.. And I had 0 withdrawal symptoms.. So i feel i dodged a bullet but my back is fucked up and cannabis isnt enough. Even with non stop unable to sleep pain.. i dont crave pills.. and i have a ton of them... But i refuse to take them until i have a doctor that is on my side once again.. So in Colorado there is a pill mill Doctor that takes cash and writes whatever if you have proof of your injury.. or you can search many pain management docs.. But there is a lot of them that just hate Marijuana and want you to choose opiates over marijuana. well ill take option 3 and find a doc that takes insurance and wants to treat pain and understands that marijuana and opiates work well together.. Doctor of Osteopathic Medicine are a good place to start..

Drug war needs to end and all drugs need to be legalized... fuck conforming to whatever morals a certain doctor has.. it would like them forcing me to practice their religion or no service.. One day i hope someone sues the crap out of them.

Dr. Carl Hart on the Joe Rogan Podcast talking about the Addiction Myth and the propaganda that is being forced fed to the unsuspecting public.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5jMC8j7ElI

More proof of the addiction myth... check out the Rat Park Experiment.
 
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