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3 weeks 12/12 - Problems yes, what? I don't know. Please help.
- Thread starter DrBeeper
- Start date
scegy
Active member
lift ur plants out of the pots and take a look if there's everything ok, as i heard in coco you can pack the roots pretty tight
add lime man, your ph should be at least 6.5 really, i use lime in my soil and it saves a lot of ph problems in general, you have ph problems
define ur ph for sure and add lime, don't over do it 1 table spoon /gallon should do the trick for now since they'll be finishing soon and you won't need a lot of ferts
do this please:
calculate
volume of your pots * 4g( 4g/L aka 16g/4L(gallon) )
or
1/4 tablespoon per litre of pot or one teaspoon per L of pot volume
put that on the top of coco in ur pots, and pour 2× as much of distilled water as you pour when you water, then leave your plants and coco to dry untill the plants start to wilt just a little
capture the runoff and measure the ph again
report, that's all i can do for now, you can wait for some other oppinions aswell, might help
good luck
add lime man, your ph should be at least 6.5 really, i use lime in my soil and it saves a lot of ph problems in general, you have ph problems
define ur ph for sure and add lime, don't over do it 1 table spoon /gallon should do the trick for now since they'll be finishing soon and you won't need a lot of ferts
do this please:
calculate
volume of your pots * 4g( 4g/L aka 16g/4L(gallon) )
or
1/4 tablespoon per litre of pot or one teaspoon per L of pot volume
put that on the top of coco in ur pots, and pour 2× as much of distilled water as you pour when you water, then leave your plants and coco to dry untill the plants start to wilt just a little
capture the runoff and measure the ph again
report, that's all i can do for now, you can wait for some other oppinions aswell, might help
good luck
scegy
Active member
if you'r sure your pH meter reads right then you should tell us the nutrient values of the soils u mixed togheter, write down their ph values too.
it still looks to me like a Mg deficiency....but do write the soil lables
btw, the fact that the ph was lower at the root ball is because u probably got the reading of active acidity and potential ac.( you measured not just the free H+ ions but also the ones that are currently actively exchanging with soil structual agregates ) + u used more water this time
write the lables, it's easier to say if we have more info, because there's a chance you'r in lack of P if your soil mixture doesn't provide it
look here under phosphorus def
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=11688
again, i don't wanna say anything premature, so write
it still looks to me like a Mg deficiency....but do write the soil lables
btw, the fact that the ph was lower at the root ball is because u probably got the reading of active acidity and potential ac.( you measured not just the free H+ ions but also the ones that are currently actively exchanging with soil structual agregates ) + u used more water this time
write the lables, it's easier to say if we have more info, because there's a chance you'r in lack of P if your soil mixture doesn't provide it
look here under phosphorus def
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=11688
again, i don't wanna say anything premature, so write
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VanGrow
Member
hey man.........i use pbp and cal mag and liquid karma for about the last 8 months and i must say they take some getting used to....to really Dial In a grow....then to apply it to a specific strain....example--my deisel needs tons of nutes and cal mag or it yellows out at the end of flowering....my NL's didnt need much of anything and were grade A buds...etc...
As for my opinon on your prob....lets start with ...i would think that you must be able to grow plants well in veg....those are nice and big and the buds are set nice....you probably dont overwater or you would have had overwatering probs from the start.....i dont think your plants look to overwatered now either...I think those plants are defecient in nutes....PB is not that strong and big plants need more than 15ml of nutes in my experience...the foxfarm soil helped lift your nute levels in veg for the first 4 weeks....maybye more.....as u know alot of PB users....myself included use the PB grow into the 2nd week of flower to raise nitrogen levels....so that the nitrogen level will support the plant through the later weeks of flower as the level drops when bloom feeding begins....so i think having the plants "Ready" to flower....meaning a good amout of stored nutes in the plant itself are important.... Your plants were really going strong popped nice, resinated well and look like what i would consider Vigorus growing plants.....even the pb bottle says use 45ml for fast growing flowering plants....Chances are IMO that those plants needed more nutes early on after the FF stopped giving them...also i think some sort of bloom booster wouldnt hurt to raise P levels...
Plants making big buds need alot of food to make those big buds......
PB needs extra Cal-Mag Iron-P
JMO
VAN
****Under fed plant when i first started using PB was lime green before i fed it about 2 hours before this pic was taken....
****Same strain of plant (the church) from clone.....now.......feeding all of my flowerings 600ppm - 700ppm and im in one gallon pots.......
As for my opinon on your prob....lets start with ...i would think that you must be able to grow plants well in veg....those are nice and big and the buds are set nice....you probably dont overwater or you would have had overwatering probs from the start.....i dont think your plants look to overwatered now either...I think those plants are defecient in nutes....PB is not that strong and big plants need more than 15ml of nutes in my experience...the foxfarm soil helped lift your nute levels in veg for the first 4 weeks....maybye more.....as u know alot of PB users....myself included use the PB grow into the 2nd week of flower to raise nitrogen levels....so that the nitrogen level will support the plant through the later weeks of flower as the level drops when bloom feeding begins....so i think having the plants "Ready" to flower....meaning a good amout of stored nutes in the plant itself are important.... Your plants were really going strong popped nice, resinated well and look like what i would consider Vigorus growing plants.....even the pb bottle says use 45ml for fast growing flowering plants....Chances are IMO that those plants needed more nutes early on after the FF stopped giving them...also i think some sort of bloom booster wouldnt hurt to raise P levels...
Plants making big buds need alot of food to make those big buds......
PB needs extra Cal-Mag Iron-P
JMO
VAN
****Under fed plant when i first started using PB was lime green before i fed it about 2 hours before this pic was taken....
****Same strain of plant (the church) from clone.....now.......feeding all of my flowerings 600ppm - 700ppm and im in one gallon pots.......
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scegy: I'm using a variation of the moonshinemix. My variation Is that I have added nothing to the mix. Each bag of soil from Foxfarm, already has dolomite lime, and oystershell added to it. My first and only other grow I used the same mix however, I added dolomite lime to It, and my plants died three weeks into 12/12. PH of the runoff was always over 7. One day just for a test (after the point of no return) I watered distilled water at a PH of 3 and the runoff measured In at 7.4. This time around I went without the dolomite lime. PH I would say Is stable and In the safe zone. I use a freshly calibrated Hanna PH pen with a well maintained electrode.
VanGrow: Thank you for chiming In with your knowledge. This girl grew outstanding In veg. Very vigorous and very healthy from top to bottom. I topped her at the 4th node and she took off like a rocket growing two very thick new tops. She was always a very nice dark green color with nice purple undergrowth (blue moonshine x lui).
Once she hit 12/12, she continued the nice growth with good color, and good structure. The yellowing didn't occur until day 17 or so. I thought It might be a deficiency so I gave her the first taste of bloom nutes (15ml per gal)
As of right now the yellowing Is continuing and the tips are dying as they go. It Is slowly moving It's way to the top leaves. There are dictinct differences between the dying off of this plant and my first plant. One: as the yellowing tips spread and the older parts start to die off, the color of the dead material Is brown where as on my first plant It was a burnt orange color. Two: the Pistles on this one are still very white and very perky (none have even turned orange, whereas the pistils on my first plant started turning orange and dying along with the dying of the leaves.
At this point I still don't know what to do. I really want to save this one because all the time invested In her. My wife will only allow one plant (even though I'm a prop 215 patient) so I have to make It work.
Next watering should I go ahead with the full 30ml per gallon of bloom nutrients. Maybe some Bloom booster at a very light dosage?
DrB
VanGrow: Thank you for chiming In with your knowledge. This girl grew outstanding In veg. Very vigorous and very healthy from top to bottom. I topped her at the 4th node and she took off like a rocket growing two very thick new tops. She was always a very nice dark green color with nice purple undergrowth (blue moonshine x lui).
Once she hit 12/12, she continued the nice growth with good color, and good structure. The yellowing didn't occur until day 17 or so. I thought It might be a deficiency so I gave her the first taste of bloom nutes (15ml per gal)
As of right now the yellowing Is continuing and the tips are dying as they go. It Is slowly moving It's way to the top leaves. There are dictinct differences between the dying off of this plant and my first plant. One: as the yellowing tips spread and the older parts start to die off, the color of the dead material Is brown where as on my first plant It was a burnt orange color. Two: the Pistles on this one are still very white and very perky (none have even turned orange, whereas the pistils on my first plant started turning orange and dying along with the dying of the leaves.
At this point I still don't know what to do. I really want to save this one because all the time invested In her. My wife will only allow one plant (even though I'm a prop 215 patient) so I have to make It work.
Next watering should I go ahead with the full 30ml per gallon of bloom nutrients. Maybe some Bloom booster at a very light dosage?
DrB
Charles Xavier
Member
Greetings DrBeeper
I note frustration has not lessened your ingenuity. I respect any display of resourcefulness. Well played.
….
This rule (these days) is oft overlooked: When in doubt....flush.
The symptoms commensurate with an incorrect balance of the primary cat ions (Potassium; Calcium; Magnesium)
The purpling of the stem and the erosion of the leaf margins indicate a 'deficiency' in Potassium.
The chlorosis of the leaves potentiate the postulation: there is a problem with Magnesium assimilation.
The position of the chlorosis (relative to the entire plant; so: mid to top leaves) strongly substantiate the negative role of Calcium in this instance.
There very well may be a slight micro-nutrient 'deficiency' as well (particularly iron) caused by the slightly high pH of the medium. (I am of the persuasion/suspicion that the medium's pH is between 7 and 8)
A good substrate flush is in order; followed by the appropriate dosage of a suitable fertilizer. (What is you brand of choice? What is its nutrient profile?)
Consider the following additional amendments:
-Canna's PK 13-14 (to provide Phosphorus and abundant Potassium via the roots).
-Maxicrop Liquid Seaweed plus Iron (to provide Potassium, trace Nitrogen, micro-nutrients emphasizing Iron, and the phytohormones intrinsic to metabolism via foliar application)
-Wilson's 5-1-1 Fish Emulsion (to provide Nitrogen and Magnesium to aid in chlorophyll synthesis, via foliar application).
Post a response and if necessary I will craft a more detailed reply...outlining possible fertilizing schedules and concentrations.
Sincerely,
Charles.
p.s. You are a member of a very special community as evidenced by all the well intentioned responses. Keep persevering...we are all supporting you.
p.p.s. The success of every cultivator....smells like victory.
C.X.
I note frustration has not lessened your ingenuity. I respect any display of resourcefulness. Well played.
….
This rule (these days) is oft overlooked: When in doubt....flush.
The symptoms commensurate with an incorrect balance of the primary cat ions (Potassium; Calcium; Magnesium)
The purpling of the stem and the erosion of the leaf margins indicate a 'deficiency' in Potassium.
The chlorosis of the leaves potentiate the postulation: there is a problem with Magnesium assimilation.
The position of the chlorosis (relative to the entire plant; so: mid to top leaves) strongly substantiate the negative role of Calcium in this instance.
There very well may be a slight micro-nutrient 'deficiency' as well (particularly iron) caused by the slightly high pH of the medium. (I am of the persuasion/suspicion that the medium's pH is between 7 and 8)
A good substrate flush is in order; followed by the appropriate dosage of a suitable fertilizer. (What is you brand of choice? What is its nutrient profile?)
Consider the following additional amendments:
-Canna's PK 13-14 (to provide Phosphorus and abundant Potassium via the roots).
-Maxicrop Liquid Seaweed plus Iron (to provide Potassium, trace Nitrogen, micro-nutrients emphasizing Iron, and the phytohormones intrinsic to metabolism via foliar application)
-Wilson's 5-1-1 Fish Emulsion (to provide Nitrogen and Magnesium to aid in chlorophyll synthesis, via foliar application).
Post a response and if necessary I will craft a more detailed reply...outlining possible fertilizing schedules and concentrations.
Sincerely,
Charles.
p.s. You are a member of a very special community as evidenced by all the well intentioned responses. Keep persevering...we are all supporting you.
p.p.s. The success of every cultivator....smells like victory.
C.X.
VanGrow
Member
after re reading your 1st post....what do you use to ph adjust your water....could be a buffer build up......when you water do you let them run off some..i agree with charles X ph could be high.......as soon as those plants start poppin you show those nutes defs....i really think its a def in nutes.....i use promix and or FF...it is balanced to with lime...... NEVER add lime at the start..... when you ph your water make sure the ph has stabilized after everything is in there......sometimes ph up....will keep going up....ie- reads 6.5--------10 minutes later reads 7.1......... i also use aquarium ph check to double check my ph tester everytime....
Any one else have any opinons....
VG
Any one else have any opinons....
VG
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Charles, a very Buddah like response as usual. Thank you for your time.
I will flush at next watering. I will take her to the shower and run about 20 - 30 gallons of water through her. Slow Is how It's done right? Water from my shower Is okay? The last 2 or 3 gallons should be mixed with nutrients?
I use PureBlendPro, grow, bloom for soil, liquid kharma, and calmag+
I'm using foxfarm soil's, ocean forest, planting mix, and light warrior with lots of added perlite. Nothing else added.
How can I lower the PH of my rootball now?
I use the suppliments you recommend In conjunction with what I already have? Consider them on my shelf already.
Thank you for the welcome. And I want to taste the victory.
VanGrow: Thank you for your time and help.
I use chemical PH adjusters. GH up, and down, however I have never used the up.
I would PH adjust my water, add nutrients, and then water my container, to the point of runoff then stop. In the future I will PH adjust at least 24 hours before watering.
I will post pics exactly 72 hours after my flush. Thank you all.
DrB
I will flush at next watering. I will take her to the shower and run about 20 - 30 gallons of water through her. Slow Is how It's done right? Water from my shower Is okay? The last 2 or 3 gallons should be mixed with nutrients?
I use PureBlendPro, grow, bloom for soil, liquid kharma, and calmag+
I'm using foxfarm soil's, ocean forest, planting mix, and light warrior with lots of added perlite. Nothing else added.
How can I lower the PH of my rootball now?
I use the suppliments you recommend In conjunction with what I already have? Consider them on my shelf already.
Thank you for the welcome. And I want to taste the victory.
VanGrow: Thank you for your time and help.
I use chemical PH adjusters. GH up, and down, however I have never used the up.
I would PH adjust my water, add nutrients, and then water my container, to the point of runoff then stop. In the future I will PH adjust at least 24 hours before watering.
I will post pics exactly 72 hours after my flush. Thank you all.
DrB
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Okay, so I flushed about 20 gallons of water through the container at a slow rate. At first the water runoff had color to It but by the end the runoff was clear.
Should I add nutrients now or wait until the rootball Is dry from the flush?
I have 2 gallons of distilled water mixed, 1 with bloom for soil, at full strength (30ml), and 1 with calmag+ (5ml), and LK (10ml) at full strength. I mixed, and PH adjusted these almost 48 hours ago, and they are stable at a PH of 6.2
DrB
Should I add nutrients now or wait until the rootball Is dry from the flush?
I have 2 gallons of distilled water mixed, 1 with bloom for soil, at full strength (30ml), and 1 with calmag+ (5ml), and LK (10ml) at full strength. I mixed, and PH adjusted these almost 48 hours ago, and they are stable at a PH of 6.2
DrB
muddy waters
Active member
Cannabis generally recuperates well, have faith Dr. B, I think you're on the path to recovery. My personal choice though would have been to fertilize with a lower concentration of nutrients the first time or two and monitor the plants' reaction. I hope Charles will again weigh in but perhaps this nutrient regimen doesn't have optimal cation ratios?
(I'm not familiar with the precise values as I grow with organic teas, which are much less exact even than so-called "organic" PBP and I have suffered from the same Mg deficiency symptoms which were not corrected by a simple fertigation with Epson salts.)
(I'm not familiar with the precise values as I grow with organic teas, which are much less exact even than so-called "organic" PBP and I have suffered from the same Mg deficiency symptoms which were not corrected by a simple fertigation with Epson salts.)
Blackvelvet
Member
16.67 ml pbp bloom for soil + 5.8 ml cal mag plus per gallon of water. 
Hi Mr Waters, thank you for stoping by. Hello again Blackvelvet.
The flush went well. I ran about 20 gallons through her very slow.
So, I'm still waiting for the rootball to dry out before I fertilize. I will cut down to half strength nutrients for the first feeding after the flush.
Surprisingly, even though the yellowing worsened a little, and the leaf tips got real crispy, she looks better. I think.
Pics In a few days.
Do you think the buds will fatten up anymore, or am I stuck with these?
Best regards,
DrB
The flush went well. I ran about 20 gallons through her very slow.
So, I'm still waiting for the rootball to dry out before I fertilize. I will cut down to half strength nutrients for the first feeding after the flush.
Surprisingly, even though the yellowing worsened a little, and the leaf tips got real crispy, she looks better. I think.
Pics In a few days.
Do you think the buds will fatten up anymore, or am I stuck with these?
Best regards,
DrB
Blackvelvet
Member
Mix the two together and ph adjust. 1 teaspoon = 5mlBlackvelvet said:16.67 ml pbp bloom for soil + 5.8 ml cal mag plus per gallon of water.
RevolutionX
Member
updates?
i love herb
Member
im having a similar problem with the exact same nutes
looking for an update as well GL
looking for an update as well
GL
