1st Coco Grow ~YAY~

[Bubble~licious]

I am a newbie here, I have tried to read at least 3 hours daily in the various forums over the last couple of months to try & get a feel of what to expect.
I had a game plan, notebooks filled with ideas and somehow almost nothing is going as planned. I think I was over anxious to start growing and had not put enough time in planning it out thoroughly. I'm trying now to right what I've wronged and hope ya'll might stick around and give me some pointers/help me grasp what I'm missing. I can honestly say that without IC Mag, I would never be able to grow my own bud (or at least try it, hehe).

My set up:
My closet space is 3.5x8
I have a 1000 watt HPS (raised up approx. 19’’ from plant tops)
2 - 40W Ecolux T12 fluorescent bulbs (I keep these lights about 3’’ from tops)
My ebb & flow table is 2 x 3
(Temporary, I kinda hacked it in a rush thinking I was wonder woman)
The reservoir underneath holds approximately a gazillion gallons (it's way oversized)
I have (11) 6'' black pots in my table
I currently have no outside ventilation directly from the closet, however the closet opens to a room that has plenty of fresh air and a little wind action (the door stays open about 12 hours a day) trying to get the big guy to put in a vent for me.

My lighting schedule - 12 hours under the HPS, 12 hours under the fluorescents.
I really wanted to do 18/6 using the HPS solely, but I am not in a position to run it that long at the moment due to the lack of proper ventilation.


Started from seed and about 6.5 weeks old, they are all 11-13’’ in height right now, except for 1 bs that is like 9’’
4 - Belladonna's
5 - Bag Seed
2 - Kc33 x Skunk

They are growing in hydroton & coco
I just changed the res. a few days ago and after a day of just ph'd tap water (just under 6.0)
I fed em like this
PBP Grow @ 10ml/gal
Cal Mag + @ 4 ml/gal
Liquid Karma @ 10 ml/gal
Hygrozyme @ 10 ml/gal

I check my PH everyday and it seems to be holding pretty steady 6.0 with just minor tweakin every other dayish
I only have the liquid tester at the moment so all I can do is get it near the low side of 6 and the high side of 5.
I don't have any other meters or testers.
I flood the table 3x a day.

I gotta get some of them sticky strips too, starting to get gnat action.
They got some Super Tea about 3 weeks ago and something tells me they didn’t like it very much but I could be wrong. but for safety sake I will probably skip that the rest of the way through.
There is some algae at the top of the coco, it was not too bad so I was just hoping as the canopy fills in it would fix it.
There is some moldy looking growth on top of the coco, at first I was gonna dig it out, then I was reading that if it’s like a grayish/white powdery than it was possibly something innocent but when I went back and took a closer look I think I got both so I think I better scrape it out..
Well I don’t think they are looking their best and I'd really like to get them better without doing so much guessing and making them worse in the meantime. That means I am open to suggestions : )
My goal was to do a scrog but right now I think I have confused myself terribly and will give that more thought at a later time. Maybe take clones soon for the next round & focus on the scrog then.
It’s my 1st grow so I’m not very familiar with the different aspects. I think it is safe to conclude that I didn’t rinse my coco as much as I should have when originally prepping it, I am finding that over the past few weeks the coco seems to need less and less ph adjusting. Nutes should have been given sooner, in a more precise manner. There really was no need for the Super Tea, especially considering I was not sure what I was doing.

I tried to include as much information as I can think of, off the top of my head, let me know if I am forgetting anything. I have many absent minded moments but sooner or later I get it, so just bare with me. I hope I am posting this in the right place. Any advice is much appreciated. Peace…

 

[-VT-]

Fellow newbie tagging along

Fellow newbie tagging along

Welcome to the coco forum

Gonna tag this one...I am new also, and plan on using the PBP hydro organic line when I start growing (in a few weeks I hope!)...

Are you using RO water? What's the source water like? I like your PBP mix...if using RO, for veg I'd bump up the Cal/Mag+ to 10 ml/gal and stepdown the LK to 5 ml/gal...
then in bloom step up the LK to 10ml/gal, and stepdown the Cal/Mag+ (or drop it for bloom)...are you using low TDS water?

If you have a fan circulating the air in the closet that should suffice for now....long as the temps are holding up

those plants look good

 

[-VT-]

Missed this earlier....

Missed this earlier....

I gotta get some of them sticky strips too, starting to get gnat action.
They got some Super Tea about 3 weeks ago and something tells me they didn’t like it very much but I could be wrong. but for safety sake I will probably skip that the rest of the way through.
There is some algae at the top of the coco, it was not too bad so I was just hoping as the canopy fills in it would fix it.

Many growers feel algae is not a big deal...non-issue as the algae will die off when the canopy deprives them of light...I gotta disagree....
Algae attracts fungus gnats....they feed on it....sticky traps are good....best to try a double attack...so something for the root zone....I have had success with a Bti product I got a while back....in fact I am battling them again...I just lost some clones because of gnats eating the roots....that's the real threat....the larvae feed on the roots....anyways I use caterpiller killer (Bti product)....others use gnatrol, some use mosquito dunks (found at Home and Garden centers....$12 usd approximately).....I like neem oil also....I have used neem for the rootzone in coco....but didn't see good results until I got the stuff I use now (Safer is the brand) lots of ways to attack it...I just shared mine

 

[Bubble~licious]

Glad to have you here VT, I have read quite a bit of your posts and gained much insight & understanding through your comments. I look forward to watching your soon to be grow : )

Oh my good gosh, I am going to answer the water questions the best I can. I am water illiterate. I know I am not using RO water because I get it from the tub in my bathroom. I don’t have a TDS meter and am pretty clueless as to the overall water quality. I let the water stand uncovered for about 24 hours before it's used/mixed and have to PH down it as it comes out 7-7.0. Do you think using RO water has a big advantage? I should have done more homework on the subject but my mind just kept wondering every time, well just every time…

I’ve heard mostly good things about the PBP Line with coco, was originally going to go with the canna line, but current hydro supplier does not offer them. I’m going through LK like its candy, so it’d be nice to know the dosage could be lowered without compromise.

I have a circulating fan for the area; don’t use it faithfully however. Will have it going more often, I just get so paranoid about the juice flowing in my house. If you think that’s bad (being paranoid about a freaking 12 inch fan) you should of seen me cooking tonight, every time I flipped a burger over, would run away from it thinking the grill was gonna explode.

Thinking about taking clones in the morning. I have an awful green thumb, but like the little engine that could, I think I can, I think I can…

Glad to have company

 

[-VT-]

PBP works great with tap

PBP works great with tap

Glad to have you here VT,

Thanks man :smile:

I know I am not using RO water because I get it from the tub in my bathroom. I don’t have a TDS meter and am pretty clueless as to the overall water quality.

PBP works well with tap water, as illustrated by your pics....with tap water you could try dropping Cal/Mag+ (I did).....PBP and LK is a good combo with tap....if the plants get mad....then add some Cal/Mag+....use as needed kinda thing

Do you think using RO water has a big advantage?

Well....it's not compulsory by any means....but I'll say it has it's advantages

PBP + RO = very little or no pH adjusting
I rarely use(d) meters with PBP hydro organic
Also mitigates saltbuildup IMHO....makes for a cleaner solution....Hey....your tap is cool too though bro....as illustrated by your pics

 

[Bubble~licious]

I went ahead and removed the top layer of coco from the pots. Found some neem under the sink, will grab the sticky strips in the morning. The existing gnat issue compounded by the algae can’t be a good thing. Thanks

Looking forward to dropping the Cal Mag.

Took 22 cuttings, all I have space for right now. I have never tried to clone anything, so I’m really hoping to luck out and they root. When I took the cuttings, cut them at angle with an alcohol swabbed razor blade (from my venus razor, it was not easy to take apart). Then cut another angle under water, then dipped in Clonex, then put into peat cups filled with coco & hydroton. Watered the coco ph’d to just under 6 with a touch of LK & Hygrozyme. They are on a heat mat and under a dome; it’s fogging up pretty good in there. I have to resist the temptation to take the dome off and stare at them.

It’s always been my intention to keep em fairly small indoors so I thought now that they are averaging 15’’ I would attempt topping. There’s a big issue with humidity at night and while I am able to get a grip on it to some degree, the smaller multi colas might be more ideal or at least a little less to worry about down the line. I have to learn to do it eventually and really want to have fun with this grow; learning at least the basics, I’d hate to ruin female clones with my 1st attempts (assuming they make it and one is female). Any thoughts on topping?

 

[-VT-]

I have to resist the temptation to take the dome off and stare at them.

...I have the same problem...I think it's cause we're new and excited...well, I'm also impatient You have a sound cloning procedure...maybe I should send you some OGK cuttings to root for me lol....I am sucking at cloning lately....you could be my personal cloner ...lol

There’s a big issue with humidity at night and while I am able to get a grip on it to some degree, the smaller multi colas might be more ideal or at least a little less to worry about down the line. I have to learn to do it eventually and really want to have fun with this grow; learning at least the basics, I’d hate to ruin female clones with my 1st attempts (assuming they make it and one is female). Any thoughts on topping?

How high does the RH% get at lights out? In veg I don't think it should be a big deal....I like topping and using stakes....but I have a different growstyle...if you need more canopy then topping will work fine, as you'll have more budsites....just make sure the canopy is even as you can get it....
I plan to top and use stakes when I start growing....I never used stakes in DWC....but I will in coco...fatter buds are more susceptible to budrot than smaller nugs I've heard....I have never had budrot....I've always had success with dehumidifiers...or maybe I have been lucky in that regard

I never apply neem at 100% strength....I spray with it now....don't use it for the rootzone...but I did use it at the rootzone because I didn;t have the money for anything else at the time....so I layered the top of the bags/pots with perlite and applied neem to the foliage and rootzone to slow 'em down...

An aside....I fell asleep logged in invisible last night, and woke up in this thread

 

[Bubble~licious]

I’m really glad I am not the only impatient one.

The RH at night gets about 55% with the dehumidifier on auto/normal. If I don’t keep in on @ night then it goes up to 75ish%.

Well they got topped this morning. I thought I had topping figured out until after it was finished, now I’m not so sure if I did it right. I think the cuts were to low, too close to the stem, they certainly do look naked now. I wanted to try and get a nice full canopy as I figured I won’t end up with many females to fill it without a little help.

When deciding to top, I figured maybe add a scrogging screen. Naturally, enough planning was not done and now have to weigh the issue of training time, sexing and removing plants from the screen adjusting open spaces and getting possibly getting root bound for the extra time being allowed. Ugh a bug…



Got to read up on the whole idea of staking, another topic that never quite jumped out at me.

Neem concentrate says mix 1 ounce per gallon of water, so maybe ½ oz. /gal. sprayed on? I don’t have access to any quality perlite, do you think covering the pot tops would help?

Anyway, I included some pictures of post topping, somehow my scissors found themselves trimming in preparation for a scrog, and I take no accountability for this as I was in an OCD zone and couldn’t have stopped myself anyway.

I’m surprised as to how smelly it is already.

Funny thing you woke up in this thread, then inquiring as to the RH. Coincidentally, I had a dream about the humidity in the grow closet, except in my dream the electrical charge of the lighting combined with the humidity caused a thundershower in the closet, which I might add is unrealistic as there is no way a cumulonimbus cloud would ever fit in there. (The little hairs on my arms are standing up now)

 

[-VT-]

Watercloning for sex and Scrog

Watercloning for sex and Scrog

What's up B-licious They are still...looookin' goood Nice work....
I have scrogged before....but only once....it can be laborious, especially in a closet....cause I couldn't access the screen from all sides....mine was DWC though... 3 x 3 Screen with 830W, 6" over the canopy....2 lights (back at OG...where I learned to grow)....3 plants



Have you considered watercloning for sex? I was reminded of Rosy Cheeks' posts back at OG when I saw one of Gaiusmarius' threads a while back here at ICMAG, and now use that method....you can determine sex before flip...remove the males...then go to bloom with the ladies. They don't even have to root...

do you think covering the pot tops would help?

Yea...some soil growers use sand at the surface to smother them...I won't try that though....covering the bags will help...(I think)....I'm too lazy for that...lol

I’m surprised as to how smelly it is already.

Damn I miss blooming!

Funny thing you woke up in this thread, then inquiring as to the RH. Coincidentally,in my dream the electrical charge of the lighting combined with the humidity caused a thundershower in the closet

You don't need stakes if you're gonna Scrog....I used stakes for mini bushes...for branch support....I prefer that over tying colas from the ceiling...

I may need to follow your lead on the cloning...I discovered another dead Jackie-O today

You're doing great man....and your thread is perfect timing :wink: I need a refuge; and friendly place to post in here lol...thanks bro

 

[Bubble~licious]

GOOD MORNING!
​

3 plants, that is both beautiful & remarkable. I think scrogging would do me some good, keep me busy, I’m glad you mentioned that.

I Thought about going DWC, but considering I can’t even put together a prefab key holder. It took me 2 months to figure out how to build an ebb & flo table and I still screwed it up.


“Have you considered watercloning for sex? I was reminded of Rosy Cheeks' posts back at OG when I saw one of Gaiusmarius' threads a while back here at ICMAG, and now use that method....you can determine sex before flip...remove the males...then go to bloom with the ladies. They don't even have to root...”

I think I have read it, but not absolutely sure. I will look for it and see if it’s easy enough that I could do it, if so it would be ideal, it certainly would contribute to setting up a game plan. I don’t quite have the bookmarking thing figured out, been bouncing from page to page. It’s amazing, the knowledge & dedication from many of the threads here, I hate when I loose them.

Gonna work on making a screen, figure maybe 2 weeks more of veg/training and if I get the watercloning for sex right, that fits in the same timeline. I just hope the plant balls are big enough for me to see, never did see any in person before. I got to consider repotting still, with 2 weeks left of veg. and I noticed the roots are already poking through the bottom of the pots.

Keeping my fingers crossed on the cloning, hope it works. It seems everyone has a variation to how they clone from simple to intense. I just hope I got it right.

I put up the pest strip, it’s already collected a couple gnats and applied the neem @ ½ the bottle recommendations.

Really glad you came in, I am not in a position to talk to anyone about growing, and it’s nice to have people to talk to that understand what’s going on, especially being a 1st timer. Thank You!

 

[Rebel_444]

Nice Avatar Bubble~Luscious

I always love a female grower.

 

[-VT-]

One of the many things I have learned in this forum is that it's better to get rootbound...then transplant...some folks taught me that in my thread....and purcerville covered his "kinetic energy" theory in his thread...

Not sure if you found any posts on it....but watercloning for sex is very easy....if I can do it anyone can. I covered it in all of my seed threads I did...worked well everytime....you may need to setup some floros and a small space for the cuttings, as it seems you do not have seperate veg/bloom chambers.

I can’t even put together a prefab key holder.

Thanks for the chuckle...that cracked me up when I read it earlier today via email

An even canopy might be a challenege if you have multiple strains runnin'....especially if Indicas and Sativas mixed together....
What size pots you planning to bloom in?

You're gonna have some phat, juicy buds soon

peace​

 

[gaiusmarius]

Hi Bubble~licious,

nice to have another lady growers in the coco section

your plants are looking nice and healthy, i look forward to following along as your plants make their journey from now to harvest.

clones can be used to tell the sex of the plant they came from. so take a branch off the bottom off each plant making sure you mark each branch with the same number or sign as the plant you took it from. now put the branch in a cup of water and stick it under a 12/12 light/dark rhythm. after 2 to 3 weeks the twigs will show sex, they might even root. but the main thing is that you will know the sex of the parent plant. one can then get rid of the males. that's what the water cloning sexing is all about lol.

 

[Bubble~licious]

Well, my gnat population quadrupled over night. It was pretty disgusting, so I took everything out of the grow closet and disinfected everything. Emptied the res., put my plants in the bathtub and sprayed em down with ½ strength neem, put up fresh pest strips, grabbed some perlite/filled up about ½’’ on top of the coco (I dunno if that’s an okay amount) and picked up some mosquito dunks, dropped one in just now.

Thanks for the warm welcome & the tutorial Gaiusmarius, made it as far as 6 cuts before noticing the gnats crawling by the dozens through my poor babies, will resume shortly.

Changed the res. to something a bit smaller (20 gallon), doubled up the containers hoping they don’t let go with 13 gallons of water in em. They seem pretty sturdy. Rubbermaid don’t let me down now.
Ph’d fresh water to 5.8, bought a digital PH tester while I was there, I can’t handle the little vial anymore. Gonna just keep them on water overnight, will add nutes tomorrow.

I was thinking 2 gallon pots for bloom, thanks for pointing me to purcerville’s thread VT, I am gonna try holding off the transplanting till the switch.
They seem to be growing at a pretty even rate in comparison to each other with the exception of 2 of the bag seed, which one is only 9’’ tall. I don’t know much about it; it was given to me by a friend a ways back. I am considering moving it outside.

Got the items I need to make a screen, this autta be interesting, even if I don’t use it this time around, at least I’ll have it for the next round which hopefully isn’t too far down the line.

Also picked up some Sweet, any opinions on it?

Thank You Rebel, happy growing to you.

All I can think about are these rotten gnats, hard to focus on anything else, it really is quite disturbing. Will spend this time reading up some more, get some positive thinking flowing.

 

[Bubble~licious]

1 more thing, that's 2 neem sprayings in roughly 24 hours, that may be a bit much, no?

 

[-VT-]

An opinion on Sweet

An opinion on Sweet

Hey there, B-licious
I'm sorry you're going through the gnat thing....I am dealing with it also....they are more annoying than harmful. You don't want to overdo it on the spraying IMO....couple times per week is good....give it some time....and as long as you continue the attack you will win eventually....I think the 1/2" layer of perlite is good...it helped me when I tried it. I like using Diatomaceous Earth also....in fact I go back and forth between the two....
Here's a POSTon it from one of my threads. Blowing a fan at the canopy can disturb them also....I've also tried dropping some garlic cloves on the top layer in the past....you'll see improvement once the eggs are destroyed....so it's a matter of killing off the adults, and not allowing them to reproduce...so continue the rootzone attack with the mosquito dunks...the gnats will not win! you're smart, and studious, so I am sure you'll find your way

Sweet​

I think Sweet is a great source for Mg...in fact I have used it in veg in lieu of Cal/Mag+ with tap, succesfully....In bloom it helps the flavor a lot IMO....but I don't think it improved yields cause I had the chance to bloom without it with some of the same plants and the yields were not that different...but the taste was better with the Sweet...The plants do transpire more when they are pumped up with Sweet....I was gonna drop it and use molases, but I am eventually gonna go back to using Sweet (I vacillate a lot lol)....but for those on a budget, I have heard (and read) that molasses is also great for taste...no personal experience with molasses though....but it's much less than $20/quart....

Damn gnats...I am feeling your pain, B-licious! Damn...I'm more concerned about the fate of your plants than my own right now...

 

[Rebel_444]

Sometimes the cure is harsher than the pest. I lost a prized pepper plant to fungus knats in a drawn out war... Well, I did get rid of the gnats...

Now I just let them have their way- I put sticky traps up, and give them a jug of vinegar water to drown in. A little BT (Bacillus Therugensis sp?) like Gnatrol will kill them for sure. In my case, they're digging into the soil the plants were growing in before coco.

Gotta be blackstrap unsulphered molasses, -VT-

 

[Ziggy420]

Good show B-licious! Check out this thread on mollases.

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=15581&highlight=Mollases

I just got off the phone with the local Feed and Farm Supply. They have 1 gal. molasses for $9.95.

If I remember correctly from my reading here and elsewhere, you should use sulfered mollases as the sulfer is one of the trace elements you want going to your roots.

Oh, and so you don't sound like an idiot like me when I was talking to my chemist sister, Molasses is a Chelating Agent (pronounced Key-late-ing); or maybe I'm just an idiot.

 

[Bubble~licious]

Well, looking around the room, it seems the flying action has decreased. I would not know if the crawling action has slowed down (I put the perlite in there; there are no gnats visible in the perlite anyway). I added a fan full time too. It’s amazing how fast the population increased, which has taught me to try harder to eliminate once I see just one.

I noticed yesterday, did not mention, (so sick with the gnat issue) the plants started taking on a deep green color, enough to make me raise my eyebrows, I don’t know that there was necessarily an issue, but it didn’t feel right none the less. This morning after giving them just water for about 24 hours, they really do look much better, which is a bonus, as I started to question whether or not I acted prematurely in emptying the reservoir. Gonna add nutes `n such later today.

Finished taking cuttings for the sexing. Thank You!

Started the 2nd screen, screwed up the 1st one earlier today. I think I got it figured out now. I made the legs like a gazillion feet high. It was not easy sawing through pvc piping with a steak knife (I need some of them knives you see on infomercials that cut through anything). I mentioned getting some tools to the big guy, but he just gives me a peculiar look when I mention me/tools in the same sentence.

I’m really glad I took more time to go over some of your threads VT, after some reading and viewing some of your pictures, I feel less worried about my topping attempts, and this is a HUGE relief. YOU ROCK!
As far as the Sweet goes, after reading various threads and you guys’ recommendation, much thanks, I have two options A) use up the bottle (can’t return it) then switch to blackstrap unsulphured molasses when it’s gone or B) Get the molasses sooner than later and use the Sweet outdoors.

Sorry bout your pepper plant Rebel, these little bugs are just nasty.

Thank You Ziggy. “pronounced Key-late-ing” I did not pronounce it right either, hehehe.

Gonna add Diatomaceous Earth and possibly silica blast to my next shopping list. I have a big ole bottle of Koolbloom lying around, I don’t remember why I bought it, so I gotta do some reading up on it, possibly use it outdoors. I don’t think I’ll be adding it to my upcoming bloom regimen unless something extraordinary pops up.

 

[-VT-]

I noticed yesterday, did not mention, (so sick with the gnat issue) the plants started taking on a deep green color, enough to make me raise my eyebrows, I don’t know that there was necessarily an issue, but it didn’t feel right none the less. This morning after giving them just water for about 24 hours, they really do look much better, which is a bonus, as I started to question whether or not I acted prematurely in emptying the reservoir. Gonna add nutes `n such later today.

Glad you caught that....keep your eyes open for droopy leaves also....
I liked PBP hydro @ 10ml/gal in my grows (same as you)....but not sure which PBP you're using though....I use(d) the hydro formula....but I may experiment with the soil formula. I think you should back off the LK a lil' bit...from 10ml/gal to 5 ml/gal....not knowing the quality of your source water, maybe you should keep a small dose of Cal/Mag+ in the rez....

I have a big ole bottle of Koolbloom lying around

After seeing Xtrakritical's phat SD IBL buds, I may have to try the Koolbloom...if you use it, I'll definitely be looking for your opinion on it....not sure if he is still using Koolbloom for his current plants (he ignored my inquiry when I asked in his thread, lol) but I know he uses PBP and Botanicare cocogro, and will assume he used the Koolbloom....his buds are kinda HUGE