18 or 24 hours of light

[Rumpleforeskin]

Your ignorance is amazing.

ignorant = Unaware or uninformed (American Heritage Dictionary).

I guess a few other folks are as ignorant as myself:
Need the dark


Need the dark


By Ed Rosenthal -
Do plants need a dark period during the vegetative cycle?

Does marijuana require a dark period during the vegetative growth stage? I recently read a grow book that advocated an 18-6 light cycle during the early growth stages.


One way in which plants are categorized is by the way they gather and handle carbon dioxide. Cannabis is a C3 plant. It uses the CO2 it gathers during the light period, when it is photosynthesizing. Plants designated C4 also gather CO2 during the dark period for use during the light period. Many C3 plants, including cannabis, do not need a rest period. They continue to photosynthesize as long as they are receiving light.
The plant's photosynthetic rate determines its growth rate because the sugars are used by the plant to build tissue and for energy. Cannabis under continuous light will grow 33% faster than the same plants on an 18-6 light regime.

From Greg Green's "The Cannabis Grow Bible"

Cannabis is a light demanding plant. Professional growers keep the light on their plants using the 24/0 photoperiod for this reason. Plants that grow under 24/0 flourish and do not need a quantity of darkness in order to rest and perform photosynthesis properly. Plants that are grown in optimal conditions under 24/0 light regime grow vigorusly and the benefits of a 24/0 photoperiod can be seen actively in the results. More nodes are formed, more branches are created, leaf numbers increase, the plant is growing at its finest.

I have also read other authors in older grow book that support your claims of needing a dark cycle.

I grew with a 18/6 cycle for years with good results. Just seemed natural to me (and other people as well). I was invited to tour a huge commercial grow operation that used no dark cycle to veg. The team who ran the grow-op had claims of a reduced veg cycle time by eliminating the dark, I decided it would be ignorant to ignore their results.

Just like they said, I was able to harvest the same sized plant in about 25% less veg time.

This plant harvested at 4.5 tall. I veg for a total of ten days:

Want to see more pictures of my "amazing ignorance"?
Click Here

Now I have seen some pictures of your amazing wisdom in action. I think I will remain ignorant.
Peace, R.

 

[Greenheart]

I recently redid my rooms and during that time I put everything under 24 until the rooms were done. The veg I left in 24 hour light and I would agree they seemed happier under the 18 schedule I may have to try the 20-4 cycle.

 

[Bubba2]

Now I have seen some pictures of your amazing wisdom in action. I think I will remain ignorant.

Frozenguy, best not bring a knife to a gun fight. Wow!



Ten minutes later...... Still laughing

Not going to mess with Rumple on this one.

 

[spurr]

FWIW,

This very same topic as been hashed to death over 19 pages in one thread in the past two weeks. With many papers posted, and many topics unknown to growers that are far more important than hours per day (ex. Daily Light Integral) described. I'm not about to enter into another thread on the exact some topic already discussed, and proven that 24/0 is not the best option, besides to post this heads up for anyone who hasn't seen the other, fully referenced thread.

Starting here: https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?p=3996203#post3996203

Peace and pasta

 

[Nickcorp187]

Plants especially cannabis plants need some dark period. it is the time when the roots grow. giving your plants 18/6 18 hours of light 6 hours of darkness a day will give you much better and healthier plants. Give it a try and I bet you wont be disappointed

 

[Rumpleforeskin]

Plants especially cannabis plants need some dark period. Give it a try and I bet you wont be disappointed

I gave it a try and I was disappointed.

it is the time when the roots grow.

Want to see some roots from a plant that never seen a minute of darkness during veg?

How did this root ball grow without a dark period during veg.

darkness a day will give you much better and healthier plants

Does she look ready to die? She has no more room to grow.

They don't look un-healthy to me.

Needed a dark cycle? Not healthy? Perhaps it's not cannabis.

I tried it both ways. 24/0 gave me the above results faster. You like to grow slower, have at it.

 

[spurr]

I tried it both ways. 24/0 gave me the above results faster. You like to grow slower [using less than 24/0], have at it

Come on Rumple, that is disingenuous of you, and you should know that. You can't prove cannabis and other C3 plants grow faster without darkness when sufficient DLI is provided in less than 24 hours of light, but I can, and have, proven that if sufficient DLI is provided in less than 24 hours the plant does grow faster...because C3 plants, and other plants, grow the most at night and very early morning hours (e.g. cellular growth and repair)

You can't make statement like you did, and pretend to be correct, without understanding the science behind how plants grow.

If you see more growth without a night vs. with a night, that means you are not providing enough light (i.e. photons) during light hours. Provide more light, in less hours, AND use a dark period; that is how to get the most growth in the shortest time.

It amazes me that cannabis growers think they are special and the cannabis is special, you aren't and it isn't: you can't defy plant biology through lack of proper testing and understanding...

 

[Rumpleforeskin]

You have not proved a thing to me (and to just about anyone else).

Yet I have proved what works best for me by measuring the difference between cycles and results. You can tell me the sky is not blue all day, but i took a look for myself.

I use DLTBS to get most my facts.

 

[dutchcrunch]

18/6 here..Gotta give them babies a little time to rest!

 

[ThizZ]

24/0 works best for ME in veg , and no matter what anybody says it is all opinion and NOT FACT no matter how much you believe yourself or think you proved your point lol at the end of the day you just PROVED it to yourself like I PROVED my methods to myself but to say everybody is wrong or not as efficient because they chose to grow a certain way that differs from your own, just makes you seem silly, just my thoughts

edit:
btw not directed at anybody in general just the topic at hand

 

[cirog]

I have always used 24 hour cylce because it does not require a timer, but may have to try a 18/6 cycle to compare. I was wondering about clones. Do people think they also benefit from a dark period when rooting?

 

[spurr]

24/0 works best for ME in veg , and no matter what anybody says it is all opinion and NOT FACT no matter how much you believe yourself or think you proved your point lol at the end of the day you just PROVED it to yourself like I PROVED my methods to myself but to say everybody is wrong or not as efficient because they chose to grow a certain way that differs from your own, just makes you seem silly, just my thoughts

edit:
btw not directed at anybody in general just the topic at hand

You misunderstand the issues at hand, if you are not measuring the irradiance at canopy over the day, then your opinion is flawed because it's not based upon data. When using data we can prove it, and it has been proven for many decades; it's just in the cananbis world people don't like to read anything other than lame and BS filled books from so-called cannabis gurus.

Hours of light per day does not matter, it's irradiance per day that matters. That is what some peole in this thread, and the other thread, completely misunderstand.

For your garden you may see more growth under 24/0, but that's only because you are not giving enough light per second. Thus, you can't make a blanket statement that 24/0 is better for you, unless you have measured the irradiance and tested the same daily irradiance in fewer hours with a dark period vs. the same daily irradiance in 24/0.

 

[Frozenguy]

Frozenguy, best not bring a knife to a gun fight. Wow!



Ten minutes later...... Still laughing

Not going to mess with Rumple on this one.

Who are you? And what is this bringing a knife to a gun fight?
Just because he had an, admittedly, witty line, doesn't mean it has much of a basis.

ignorant = Unaware or uninformed (American Heritage Dictionary).

I guess a few other folks are as ignorant as myself:
Need the dark


Need the dark


By Ed Rosenthal -
Do plants need a dark period during the vegetative cycle?
Does marijuana require a dark period during the vegetative growth stage? I recently read a grow book that advocated an 18-6 light cycle during the early growth stages.

One way in which plants are categorized is by the way they gather and handle carbon dioxide. Cannabis is a C3 plant. It uses the CO2 it gathers during the light period, when it is photosynthesizing. Plants designated C4 also gather CO2 during the dark period for use during the light period. Many C3 plants, including cannabis, do not need a rest period. They continue to photosynthesize as long as they are receiving light.
The plant's photosynthetic rate determines its growth rate because the sugars are used by the plant to build tissue and for energy. Cannabis under continuous light will grow 33% faster than the same plants on an 18-6 light regime.

From Greg Green's "The Cannabis Grow Bible"

Cannabis is a light demanding plant. Professional growers keep the light on their plants using the 24/0 photoperiod for this reason. Plants that grow under 24/0 flourish and do not need a quantity of darkness in order to rest and perform photosynthesis properly. Plants that are grown in optimal conditions under 24/0 light regime grow vigorusly and the benefits of a 24/0 photoperiod can be seen actively in the results. More nodes are formed, more branches are created, leaf numbers increase, the plant is growing at its finest.

I have also read other authors in older grow book that support your claims of needing a dark cycle.

I grew with a 18/6 cycle for years with good results. Just seemed natural to me (and other people as well). I was invited to tour a huge commercial grow operation that used no dark cycle to veg. The team who ran the grow-op had claims of a reduced veg cycle time by eliminating the dark, I decided it would be ignorant to ignore their results.

Just like they said, I was able to harvest the same sized plant in about 25% less veg time.

This plant harvested at 4.5 tall. I veg for a total of ten days:


Want to see more pictures of my "amazing ignorance"?


Now I have seen some pictures of your amazing wisdom in action. I think I will remain ignorant.
Peace, R.

Ed Rosenthal is not right on everything, and he is using indirect experience to claim something, not clean hard experimental evidence. Nice plants. Like I said, 24h veg will give results, I never said it would kill a plant. I even said 24h veg will tend to veg plants faster, but fast doesn't mean better. Ever heard "good things come to those who wait"?
Trees that are grown under technique and conditions for fast growth to supply lumber for construction have fat, bloated, weak cells. They look normal on the outside, but are inferior on the inside.

I gave it a try and I was disappointed.



Want to see some roots from a plant that never seen a minute of darkness during veg?


How did this root ball grow without a dark period during veg.




Does she look ready to die? She has no more room to grow.

They don't look un-healthy to me.


Needed a dark cycle? Not healthy? Perhaps it's not cannabis.

I tried it both ways. 24/0 gave me the above results faster. You like to grow slower, have at it.

Again.. One will get results. What I'm arguing here is not something about death of a plant, or sickness, but of reaching the top top quality of cannabis.

Slower but with stronger trunks, branches that can support huge fat buds. Also promotes resistance to bugs and disease/mold. And the difference in time, is not worth the drop in quality of plant.

Again, you can grow some awesome, huge, dank buds with 24h veg, but proper lighting will lead to a healthier, better performing plant.

Here are some of my plants, grown organically.







We can all agree that 24h veg lighting grows faster, but that is not much when taking into account other factors of the switch.

If you want to save a week to try and cut corners, be my guest.
China builds stuff fast too, but then it comes crashing down. Maybe one day you will learn speed isn't the answer to everything.


Plants just grow better with darkness.

It has been proven by professional researchers, that plants collect energy during the day, and grow at night (plus rebuild/repair damaged cells), maximizing their efficiency. When you go 24h veg, they have to mix this operation into one and use different proteins to keep switching back and forth. Gets growth out fast, but thats about it. Not the best growth (that darkness has to offer), but growth nonetheless.. I strive for quality, and every little bit helps. I dont mind waiting an extra week for something of much better quality. And I dont even really have to wait any longer because I veg separately so its no skin off my back to just choose the better end result
BTW, this difference could be so small I've realized it may not even be worth arguing. Because I look at your plants, and they do look pretty good. I wonder how they taste with all the chemicals (or are you organic hydro) but thats a different thread.

All I know is that I've tried 24h lighting and 20hr lighting side by side and saw faster growth for 24h, but negatives in structure and flowering speed from thereon out. The plants grew out and flowered beautifully, but the ones that had darkness didn't need yoyos, and were more resinous (judgement, not a measurement), and had started flowering quicker by a few days.

 

[spurr]

We can all agree that 24h veg lighting grows faster, but that is not much when taking into account other factors of the switch.

Nope, that just isn't a true statement because it lacks the most important detail: DLI (Daily Light Integral), i.e., the sum amount of photons within PAR range in a meter^2:

I agree with most of your claims, and you seem like a really smart person, but the fact is plants (C3) grow the most at night and very early morning (i.e. the greater cellular growth and repair). Thus, if we provide the same DLI in 18 hours as we do in 24 hours, the plants under 18 hours of light will grow faster than those under 24 hours of light.
​

That is the point most people are misunderstanding, it's not about hours per day, it's about photons per day.

 

[Rumpleforeskin]

fact is plants (C3) grow the most at night and very early morning

I never use a dark cycle, so my plants must never grow?
I grow a 4.5 foot plant and only veg 10 days, how can this be possible?
I grew for years with a dark cycle, it was 25% slower. Must be plants made in china.

Frozen says my "overall inferior plant" could be more like his if I changed my light cycle.

I will take my inferior plant made in China.
Thanks

 

[VIKINGtrich]

24 hours for me....My girls don't need a rest....they get to sleep when they go into flower....My buds come out perfect.....I'll stick with whats been working for years....Done the 20/4.....18/6......15/9......and if I'm flowering indoors, its 24 for me.....and I never have plants with a shitty root system....lol....

 

[spurr]

I never use a dark cycle, so my plants must never grow?
I grow a 4.5 foot plant and only veg 10 days, how can this be possible?
I grew for years with a dark cycle, it was 25% slower. Must be plants made in china.

Frozen says my "overall inferior plant" could be more like his if I changed my light cycle.

I will take my inferior plant made in China.
Thanks

Maybe you missed the modifier "most", as in "grow the most"? No one, I repeat, no one, claims plants won't grow without a night time.

Your plant grew 4.5 feet in 10 days!?! Suuure it did.

 

[spurr]

I think it's funny all you naysayers refuse to accept what has been proven for decades: that plants do better with a night time for a myriad of reasons already listed such as circadian rhythm, calvin cycle, assimilate and partitioning, starch conversion, etc., etc.

What ever floats your boat I guess, happy growing.

 

[Rumpleforeskin]

Your plant grew 4.5 feet in 10 days!?! Suuure it did.

You did not understand? You need me to spell the details out for ya?

Ok, you did not seem that slow but here you go.. I veg 10 days and flower 60 days to harvest a 4.5 foot tall plant. Sorry if it was not clear. Got that? Sure you did.

Used to veg longer using a 18/6 schedule.

 

[spurr]

Of course I knew what you meant, I was messing with ya; your wording needs work. It's funny you think using 24/0 for veg in 10 days has a big affect upon plant height.