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Getting Durdy w/ recycled soil!

D

Durdy

Hello all!

Well this is the first summer I did an organic grow! One plant left to harvest and whats down so far is looking nice! and smoking even better:woohoo:

I decided I'm going to take the soil from my outdoor pots, re-amend it, let it sit for a month, and get cracking on my winter indoor!

The original mix was pretty basic

50% coco coir
30% perlite
10% compost
10% EWC

It got watered with various teas (alfalfa, kelp, compost, guano) through the outdoor grow season.

So I've taken 30 gallons (about 4 c.f.) of that above mentioned mix and added the following to it...

(Once every thing is said and done this mix will be a total of 10 cubic feet / 75 gallons)

7.5 gal (1 c.f.) compost

5 cups crab meal

5 cups kelp meal

a small handful of mycorrhizae powder

5 cups neem cake

5 cups oyster shell flour

5 cups azomite

7.5 cups gaia green glacial rock dust

and plan on also adding once I have it...

17.5 more cups of gaia green glacial rock dust

5 cups basalt rock dust

7.5 gal (1 c.f.) mushroom compost

30 gal (4 c.f.) rice hulls

Looking good to everyone? Or should I make some adjustments?

:tiphat:
 
R

RanchoDeluxe

Member
Looks pretty good to me man. Are you at 1tbs per gal with all the 5 cups of this and that? Hard to tell how much soil you are actually making to do some quick numbers in my head. I've read that mushroom compost is usually full of pesticides...I would seriously consider replacing it with EWC.

Good luck man.
 
D

Durdy

I'm trying to mimic clackamascootz recipe from the recycled organic living soil thread.

Once the aeration and mushroom compost(or EWC) are added it will be 10 cubic feet total or 75 gallons.

I'd like to add some EWC but the only thing i can get is ednas best, and I figured the mushroom compost from the local mushroom farm would be of better quality. I'll ask them about pesticides though, thanks for the tip.

I do believe all the 5 cup measurements come out to a little over 1 TBS per gallon
 
R

RanchoDeluxe

Member
Right on man. Are you talking about the living organic soil thread? Or are you talking about a thread that is specific to recycling? I am also running with Coot's mix or as close as I could get for now. So far so good.
The only other thing I that may cause a problem is all that coir. It holds onto Ca and Mg, at the same time releasing K. I ain't no expert but I'd try to double the amount of soil but replace the coir with peat.
 
D

Durdy

Yeah thats the thread. And interesting point about the coir, I hadn't heard that. I was just trying to reuse what I had laying around, I could definitely get a bale of peat though and double up on everything.

Only thing is I really don't need 20 c.f. of soil but I guess it can't hurt to have extra on hand!
 
D

Durdy

Also there was no more coir added this time around, just from the original mix, so at this point in time it's less then half of whats making up the soil.
 
R

RanchoDeluxe

Member
Yeah man somewhere in that thread, there is a reference to all the Ca/Mg defs that get discussed on the coir boards...might have even been CC himself. I would guess it's somewhere in the first 50 pages. I've read this before in a few other places. I would assume this info could be had with a simple google search as well.
 
D

Durdy

Just did some reading on it, generally seems most people having issues are using RO water and feeding with bottled nutrients. I'm not to worried about it, at this point in time with the new compost and aeration being added the coco is only at around 20% of the mix. With all the cal/mag from the crab meal, and rock dusts I think it should be good to go, we'll find out in about a month!
 
S

SeaMaiden

Using RO water isn't the issue with coir, it's to do with its CEC and propensity to lock onto Ca and Mg. It also gives up a good deal of K. Charge the coir with sufficient Ca and Mg and it won't take any away from the plant or microbes as they're synthesizing. The other problem with many of the threads discussing Ca/Mg deficiencies is that they're lumping both problems together, and you just can't do that. They're not the same, they don't perform the same functions and with one you can correct instantly (Mg-) and the other, not so much (Ca-). Ca is the most underappreciated nutrient out there, in my opinion.

May I suggest getting rid of the perlite next time and substituting with something like rice hulls? They don't float to the top, are renewable being an ag waste product, offer some silica as they break down (they break down very slowly, years, depending on microbial activity) and are, in terms of 'being green' much greener because they don't require the same kind of processing that perlite does.
 
D

Durdy

Hey Seamaiden glad to see you here!

So are you saying wit a sufficient supply of Ca and Mg in the mix the coir shouldn't be an issue?

Like I said before, this mix is getting fairly low in terms of its % coir,

Also no new perlite has been added, just what was there from the original mix I used for my summer outdoor which was made in the begginning of June. It was a mix I threw together on short notice, and now I figure I've got 260 gallons of it, might as well turn it into some nice soil.

Rice Hulls will be added as aeration this time around, still sourcing them though.

If my math is correct, once the mix done, it will stand at these percentages

12% perlite
20% coir
28% Compost / EWC (or mushroom compost)
40% Rice Hulls

Might add anther 1/2 to 1 c.f. of compost depending on the consistency
:tiphat:
 
S

SeaMaiden

Yeah... you know, I haven't played much at all with mixing coir with soil, but, if it were me I'd make sure the coir had sufficient Ca charge in it, because that's the most difficult deficiency to adjust for after the fact. Mg is too dang easy, but Ca is another story in my book.

I would add more compost to the mix as you're considering, lowering the percentage of hulls just a wee bit. They're neat, but I don't know that they can comprise that high a percentage of a good mix and still perform well. In other words, when you're closing in on 50% of the mix, you're in new territory for me. :)

Have you ever just wet down the hulls themselves? They feel so weird, like wet shrimp shells.
 
D

Durdy

Good to know SM, I really appreciate the words of wisdom!

I'll make sure to water the soil pile down with some EWC teas and possibly add a bit more oyster shell flour.

I've got another c.f. of compost on hand so i'll mix that in later.

and the rice hulls haven't been added yet, so i'll just add those till I'm satisfied with the ratio.

I'm still waiting for my rice hulls to arrive, so I haven't had the pleasure of playing with them yet, but they should be here soon!
 
D

Durdy

There she is boys, my first pile of ROLS!!

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And my first attempt at composting! So far I believe its going well. Everything seems to be breaking down fairly quick. and it has a nice sweet smell not rotty at all.

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Those are 100 gallon smart pots by the way.
 
S

SeaMaiden

I haven't liked the SPs much for growing, too floppy. This may be a good repurposing.
 
D

Durdy

They seem to be working great for composting! Are you just using regular rigid plastic pots? What size?
 
S

SeaMaiden

For composting I tried for years just doing a pile. I could never get it big enough, never, so composting never occurred. This last year I got this thing called a Geo-bin or something like that, basically a very thick, perforated plastic roll/tube, the width of which is completely adjustable. You push sticks down into the ground to hold it into place after you afix the screws that keep it in the desired width position, then just start putting your stuff into it.

Got it here (at the storefront, but you don't get a discount going that route): http://www.groworganic.com/geobin-home-and-garden-compost-bin.html

I can attest that this stuff holds up to the strongest attention by raccoons! Which visited us last night, a momma and a couple of babies. Dog was on it, but I pulled her back inside when I saw it was babies, just couldn't let her get a hold of them. I got a stick and gently told them it was time to go and they climbed down and ran off. I'm supposing they'll be back tonight, but can I blame them? It's gotten very, VERY cold very, very quickly and they've gotta live, too, right?
(Can you tell I just watched the raccoon episode of Nature on PBS?)
 
D

Durdy

That geo bin looks pretty cool! Is it tricky to turn the stuff at the bottom?

Smart pot makes something similiar to that, its made out of the smart pot material and holds I believe 100 gallons but instead of being low and wide its narrow and tall like the geo bin.

I've got a bunch of yard debri left over from my summer garden, and I'm going to go collect leaves around town tomorrow, so I'm going to need to do something about making more compost. I'm thinking of taking three wooden pallets and making a bin out of them. I love composting! Never have I had so much fun playing with something most people would consider garbage haha.

That was very kind of you with the raccoons. I can understand, I saw one walking around the other day and it was absolutely adorable!
 
S

SeaMaiden

I'm not trying to turn anything, my back can't take it. My goal is to be able to pull the stakes, lift it up and then get good stuff out of the bottom, or I'll leave it be once it's full and just let it compost in place.

The raccoons are very destructive, but so clever, and they're just trying to live. My only concern is that they might hurt the cats, but every time, and I mean EVERY time, the cats are just looking at the raccoons and the raccoons are ignoring the cats. We no longer leave food outside and the cats' food is taken inside at night if there's any left over. I also throw my old fruit and veggies down away from where we feed the cats, so the raccoons can have whatever leftovers they want, but away from our cats.

And in other news! The deer got into one of the veggie gardens and one of them very nicely pooped in a raised bed. That'll save me the trouble of going through the forest to collect deer poo for my raised beds.


Yes, I'm kidding (about going to the forest to collect it, I do collect some of what I find on the property and put it in the compost).

Next up for Durdy...? How about some green manure?
 
D

Durdy

Sounds like a solid plan! I like the sound of no turn necessary. It seems the more I turn though the faster my material breaks down.

Yeah I hear lots of stories about the cleverness of raccoons. My friend last year found it impossible to keep them from eating his strawberries. They figured a way around every defense he set up.

Sounds like a solid source of free nutrients! yay deer :D

I've been contemplating getting something going in terms of green manure. Theres an entire section of the backyard thats fallow atm and eventually will have fruit trees planted there. The current soil is mostly clay and very compacted. I was thinking of using some oil seed radish to loosen the soil then also use as a green manure in the raised beds next spring. Only issue is the owner of the house is weary of this as they don't want the plant growing back forever, which I'm not sure it would, need to do some more research.
 
S

SeaMaiden

I was going to suggest mustards, but they will come back IME. However, I have this Japanese mustard, mizuni or mazuna, something like that, and it's a very pretty plant, looks ornamental, yet it's edible.

Clovers and peas might be better than vetches, but you wanna know what I've been going NUTS planting? Fenugreek. We can thank the Aussies for putting the idea into my head, and the local health food shop for having viable fenugreek seed without even knowing it. Also I've tried amaranth, but haven't eaten it yet, just planted.

Last spring I went through my cupboards with my granddaughter. We took everything we could find that looked like a seed and planted it. Most of the stuff grew, including the popcorn of all things.
 
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