American Cannabis Breeding In The Early 20th Century

[muddy waters]

thanks sam, actually these slaves that i'm referring to were homo sapiens, complete with a highly-developed telencephalon and an opposable thumb, probably capable of differentiating the seed of thc-containing and non-thc-containing hemp flowers, and planting only the former.

where exactly is your bridge though, depending on the location i might be able to put you in contact with my good nigerian friend who is very excited to buy it, and i will take only a modest 15% commission. ok?

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

I have been to many places where the locals claim that the wild hemp gets them high. In Yunnan they do and I have analyzed the plants and the THC levels are 1-2% and when I smoke them I do not get high at all. I suspect wild Czech Cannabis is the same, it only makes people think that maybe they are high. To prove my point would you like to buy a ton of dried Czech wild Cannabis, why not?
As for South Indian varieties being grown in England, good luck. They don't mature until well after the frosts when grown out doors. I collected Kerala seeds several times in Kerala and they are very late Sativas, no chance to be grown outdoors in N Europe. All of the research I did showed the main hemp cultivation by the British in India was in Simla, not in the south. I am sure they would of imported the N Indian hemp lines which are not potent at all, but maybe have a chance to mature in the UK.
As for a farm growning hemp for 100 years in the UK, if not selected for THC there will be little or no THC.
Cannabis was imported from India to be used for medicines in the UK in the 18th & 19th century.
-SamS

 

[squib]

sam_skunkman,
Hey I looked at your references for the strain orgins of American hemp being partially sourced through Korean genes, and, actually there is no reference to Korea in those articles.
Just wondering if perhaps you have other sources on the part Korean genes played in the American hemp industry? Im curious is all.

 

[Guest]

LOL

Anyone remember the Texas oil baron who bought the old London Bridge and transported it piece by piece to Texas? It was in the 50s.

 

[zamalito]

Is it possible that the the reason you didn't get any effect wasn't so much the low thc levels themselves but the low thc levels combined with higher levels of cbd or other cb1 antagonists?

Due to my lack of access to gc/ms analysis I can't say if 2-3% thc will produce any effects but I always thought that mexican brick or in the case of muddy paraguaian brick is in that range. Maybe its a placebo effect but there's hundreds of millions of dollars of mexican brick bought every year. It has been a few years since I've smoked any and it rarely made me feel good. However I almost always could at least get a buzz off of it as long as I smoked enough. More frequently than smoking mexi brick, test male potency I will smoke medium/small joints of about a dozen growing tips from males in vegetative growth. I doubt they have more than 2-4% thc. I don't smoke reefer everyday so perhaps my tolerance is lower but I really doubt this is the placebo effect.

If someone smokes a large 2-3 gram joint of some material which is 2.5% thc that's 50-75mg of thc consumed overall. Considering that much would be lost in sidestream smoke that would be about the same amount of thc as smoking an average .5 gram joint of 7% thc material which should at least produce some noticeable effects. Shouldn't it?

 

[Guest]

I love it a cannabis/hemp history lesson. Thanks again.

 

[Evolution]

Absolutely Zam! Great point(s)! Additionally, GC/MS analyses do not take into account any of the synergistic effects, nor the particulay physiological quirks of the individual human. I anticipate many more insightful comments from a mind such as yours.

This thread is a wealth of knowledge, truly a special group of folks right on the cutting edge, many thanks.

Paz, please continue to bring your wealth of cultural insight and your fierce home grown skepticism...it is quite refreshing...

(edit:
Sam,
thanks for your contributions, i cherish them, you are a gentleman and a scholar---please continue to share your knowledge, thanks again )

 

[Rosy Cheeks]

How significant is the oft-quoted excerpt from George Washington's diary re "pulling the males too late"? Is this really a pointer to cultivation of cannabis for drug, not fibre, purposes? Or could there be another reason why a fibre grower might still pull males?

It's a pointer bongoman.

Both George Washington and Thomas Jefferson cultivated Cannabis Sativa on their lands.
There's nothing strange about this, since hemp was a basic industrial crop at the time, the hemp fibers being used for ropes, sails and clothing, among other things.
In England at the time, Cannabis Sativa (or hemp) was the number one plant crop. More hemp was grown than food crops such as wheat or barley.

While the hemp grown was fiber hemp, it was not the same kind of fiber hemp which is used today. Contemporary fiber hemp is selectively bred to contain less than 0.3% THC, which is the maximum level allowed. The hemp the British colonists grew was probably somewhere around 1% THC (ditchweed quality).

Nevertheless, George Washington refers to "Indian" hemp, and that's where it becomes interesting. Indian hemp was Cannabis Sativa imported from the Indian continent, and generally means drug type Cannabis. Hemp had been cultivated in Europe for thousands of years, and the same cultivars that were grown in England and had proven their worth in the Commonwealth navy had been brought over to the colonies. Highly psychoactive Cannabis on the other hand was an oriental specialty. So it's probably safe to say that Indian hemp was drug-type Cannabis, and was defined as such by the name.

"Make the most you can of the Indian Hemp seed and sow it everywhere."

Note by Washington to the gardener at Mount Vernon, 1794

"The Writings of George Washington"
Volume 33, page 270 (Library of Congress)

There is dicot cousin to Cannabis Sativa, the Apocynum Cannabinum (native to America), which is also called Indian Hemp. Although, there is no reason why Washington or anyone else would cultivate the Apocynum Cannabinum, since it is a plant of no industrial value. The plant fibers are inferior (to that of Cannabis Sativa), it is no good for lumber or fuelwood. It contains cardiac glycosides and is toxic in moderate to large doses, so it can not be used as fodder for live stock (although it is concidered as a medicinal plant, treating various ailments).

A couple of notes in Washington's diary have aroused attention.

May 12-13 1765: "Sowed Hemp at Muddy hole by Swamp."

August 7, 1765: "...began to seperate (sic) the Male from
the Female Hemp at Do... rather too late."

Washington could - as mentioned - have separated the males from the females to get better fiber, but the phrase "rather too late" suggests that he wanted to complete the separation before the flowering female plants were fertilized, and this is a practice related to drug potency rather that to fiber culture. Washington wanted to grow sinsemilla (so we know that practice was in use in 18th century America).

We cannot say whether he was a recreational stoner or a medical user. It has been said that Washington used drug type Cannabis as a pain-killer against his chronic tooth aches or many ailments, which sounds possible.

 

[Guest]

Good point about the origin of Indian hemp Sam, I will do some research and see if I can find out some info about hemp growing in England. I have been told that hemp crops were resinous by old folks who remember playing in the fields as children, they remember the intense smell and getting sticky if they brushed against the plants, but of course, that is no indication.

I think zam is on the right track talking about accessory cannabinoids rather than THC levels. I am very sure that tolerance to a particular type of cannabis does not translate into tolerance to all cannabis. At the 420 Cup I had to get a taxi to my hotel at 8.20 pm on the first night because I'd sampled a load of the indica entries and was so stoned in a couchlock way I had to go lie down and I'm a hardcore, all-day every-day smoker, but i smoke sativas, most indica things I smoke normally are Blueberry and Ak47 x Hawaiian Delight so my tolerance to heavy indicas was low and hence I was wiped out. The following day I stuck to sativas like SSH and Acapulco Gold and Mako Haze from the Dampkring and was fine, smoked loads and didnt get wiped out. Probably the highest I've ever been was from bad brown Mexican brickweed in Cancun, had my hallucinating aurally and visually, totally hyper and paranoid, I expect that was largely due to some unique blend of cannabinoids in that brick weed that I was unaccustomed to rather than a high THC level.

Now, my Czech friend and I both speculate that the wild ruderalis near his house in Moravia is about 4% THC as it is about half as strong as weed we have grown outdoors like Top44 and Purple Power that was low potency and quoted as 8-10% THC by the seedbanks. However, we do think that the wild plants are high in the 'stony' cannabinoids that cause couchlock effects like CBD and CBN. We have been trying to cross this wild variety to some high THC strains like Herijuana but sadly so far its been slow progress as i lost the pollinated Herijuana lady and the wild seeds we colelcted have very very low germ rates, we are experimenting with refrdigerating the seeds for a period to simualte the cold period of winter but think we will have to wait until late August to collect more seeds and pollen from the wild.

We specualte that crossing a high THC inbred strain to this wild crop could have the potential for creating a hybrid with both high THC levels and high levels of CDN, CDN etc. Hell, it's fun to experiemnt and as far as I know no-one else is working with these ruderalis genes. In comparison to the ruderalis hybrids I have grown before, I would say that the Moravian wild variety is only slightly less potent than Sensi's Ruderalis Indica, I speculate that the Moravian ruderalis is an eastern indica from the Black Sea/Iran region that has been adapted to the central european climate whereas the Russian ruderalis Sensi used was adapted to the worse climate of eastern europe/central asia. Perhaps the Moravian variety is more potent and less differentiated from the original drug variety because the Moravian climate is better and the season longer than in Russia, less adaptation had to take place and therefore less 'drift' has occurred from the original genetics.

Older villagers in Moravia still grow small private patches of cannabis, and from what my friend was told, these patches produce more potent weed than the wild plants, although they are very closely related. Sounds to me like the same genetics as the wild plants just the tending of the plants and some selection means better smoking material is produced. My friend made some charas from the wild plants and it was quite potent, certainly smokeable, comparable to a lower grade Afghan finger hash.

So all in all, I am pretty convinced that the Moravian wild variety is the result of a drug cultivar going feral and adapting to the local climate and season, due to the relatively cold, wet climate and fairly short season, the adaptation has meant potency has been reduced although they are still recognisably a drug ariety rather than a fibre one. Now, if we take this example and apply it to say, the southern US which has a much warmer climate and longer season, I think it is very possible that feral populations that came about when cultivated crops of hemp were grown could have retained a large part of their drug value if the original crops had drug value. If we can establish through research that varieties with drug qualities were cultivated in a region at one time, then it is perfectly possible that feral populations with drug qualities existed in these regions as a result of the commercial cultivation.

I'm only basing my premise on the Moravian example, perhaps with further research, it will be possible to find other examples of feral populations descended from cultivated crops that have drug qualities. I would think that southern europe, places like the Balkans, Albania, etc. would be worthwhile places to look for feral populations that are descendants of former crops. I have had some discussions on icmag about Balkan wild cannabis before, hopefully the members from that region I was discussing with before will check this thread and add some info. One mentioned that the old hemp crops were so resinous you could definitely smoke their flowers and get high, and there was mention of wild plants found in Croatia and other Balkan states. I would think that a fair proportion of the wild cannabis population in this region would be descendants of hemp crops rather than indigenous landrace or escapees from modern commerical drug cultivation. I have read that a lot of low-grade Albanian outdoor weed is sold in Italy and has been for decades, I wonder if the genetics grown in Albania are old, traditional hemp strains cultivated there for a long time or more modern imports of seed from Turkey, Afghanistan or some other drug cannabis cultivating country?

 

[cooter1]

cannabis use: pre-civil war and during the civil war in america

cannabis use: pre-civil war and during the civil war in america

some copy and paste excerpts/info i found while researching cannabis use pre-civil war and during the civil war in america.

European forebears, fifteenth, sixteenth, and seventeenth century explorers, traders, and conquerors, were open to the pleasures and products of the new worlds.
The European explorers from Columbus on found other [in addition to alcohol] mind-affecting drugs, and brought them with them. Tobacco was discovered on Columbus' first voyage. Cocaine was found in large areas of South America. Caffeine and LSD-like drugs were found scattered all over the world ... the Europeans not only adopted nicotine and caffeine but spread them everywhere. They also imported opium. In a remarkably short space of time, western Europe was converted from an alcohol-only culture to a multi-drug culture (Brecher, 1972).
(my NoteSlaves I highly doubt could bring any items or possessions with them as they weren’t allowed that luxury as some would presume think about

Cannabis sativa, too, was available in the early days of the new world. This plant was not indigenous to the Americas, but brought to the area by the Spaniards, with cannabis first appearing in Chile, where the Spanish introduced it in 1545 (Brecher, 1972).

The plant became a staple crop for colonial farmers, who reportedly grew it for its fiber. Along with tobacco, hemp became a major export crop for pre-Revolutionary American farmers.
The Jamestown settlers [brought] the plant [cannabis] to Virqinia in 1611 and cultivated it for its fiber. Marihuana was introduced into New England in 1629. From then until after the Civil War, the marihuana plant was a major crop in North America, and played an important role in both colonial and national economic policy...George Washington was growing hemp lin 1765_7 at mount Vernon... presumably for its fiber, though it has been argued that Washington was also concerned to increase the medicinal or intoxicating potency of his marihuana plants (Brecher, 1972).
In 1775, hemp culture was introduced into Kentucky and large hemp plantations flourished in Mississippi, Georgia, California, South Carolina, and Nebraska until well into the 1800s

During the mid-1800s, cannabis sativa, whose use dates back to the second millenium B.C. in China, was considered a legitimate (and wholly licit) medication

taken from: antiquecannabisbook.com

Before 1937, with extremely few exceptions, Medical Cannabis products were quite legal and available in almost any corner drug story. It thus should come as no suppose that they were also quite openly advertised. Cannabis was seen back then as simply another medical ingredient

From 1850 until 1942, the United States Pharmacopeia, which lists most widely-accepted drugs, recognized marihuana as a legitimate medicine, under the name "Extractum Cannabis." Too, the United States Dispensory in 1851 reported the use of hemp extract:
"The complaints in which it has been specially recommended are neuralgia, gout, rheumatism, tetanus, hydrophobia, epidemic cholera, convulsions, chorea, hemorrhage" (Brecher, 1972).

Limited non-medical use of cannabis, however, was reported in an 1869 issue of the Scientific American:
"The drug hashish, the cannabis indica of the U.S. Pharmacopeia, the resinous product of hemp, grown in the East Indies and other parts of Asia, is used in those countries to a large extent for its intoxicating properties and is doubtless used in this country for the same purpose to a limited extent" (Brecher, 1972).

Use of cannabis products for recreation grew gradually. The December 2, 1876, issue of the Illustrated Police News featured a drawing of five exotically-attired young ladies supposedly indulging their "hasheesh" habit in a room where hookahs were conspicuous. The News captioned the drawing: "'Secret Dissipation of New York Belles: Interior of a Hasheesh Hell on Fifth Avenue"' (Brecher, 1972).

Popular magazines and newspapers began to feature stories about the newly-discovered hashish users and their lurid habitats. The November, 1883, issue of Harper's New Monthly Magazine featured an article by an anonymous explorer of the "hasheesh dens":
"There is a large community of hashish smokers in this city [New York], who are daily forced to indulge their morbid appetites, and I can take you to a house up-town where hemp is used in every conceivable form, and where the lights, sounds, odors, and surroundings are all arranged so as to intensify and enhance the effects ...

[The hashish smokers] are about evenly divided between Americans and foreigners; indeed, the place is kept by a Greek, who has invested a great deal of money in it. All the visitors, both male and female, are of the better classes, and absolute secrecy is the rule. The house has been opened about two years, I believe, and the number of regular habitues is daily on the increase... Smokers from different cities, Boston, Philadelphia, Chicago, and especially New Orleans, tell me that each city has
its hemp retreat, but none so elegant as this" (Brecher, 1972).

A number of physicians reported ingesting hashish during this era--some for "experimental" purposes, others admitting frank curiosity, and occasionally supplying fluid extract of cannabis to their friends. Hashish candy, too, was available in post-Civil War sweet shops. Dr. George Wheelock Grover, in his book Shadows Lifted or Sunshine Restored in the Horizon of Human Lives: A Treatise on the Morphine, opium, Cocaine, Chloral and Hashish Habits, admitted purchasing a box of the candy in Baltimore. Determined to test the product on himself, Dr. Grover took "'a full dose ... (then the drug) manifested its peculiar witchery with scarcely prelude or warning"' (Brecher, 1972).

Cannabis, it seems, possessed considerably more useful properties than those first attributed to it in the early Pharmaco ,peia listing.
However, the contemporary prohibitionist movement was focusing its attention on the opium problem, and left cannabis products and their users to themselves for the next several decades. During the years of alcohol prohibition, marihuana use had gained in popularity.
[In New York City] marihuana "tea pads" were established about 1920. They resembled opium dens or speakeasies except that prices were very low; a man could get high for a quarter on marihuana smoked in the pad, or for even less if he bought the marihuana at the door and took it away to smoke.

Most of the marihuana, it was said, was harvested from supplies growing wild on Staten Island or in New Jersey and other nearby states; marihuana and hashish imported from North Africa were more potent and cost more.

These tea pads were tolerated by the city, much as alcohol speakeasies were tolerated. By the 1930s there were said to be 500 of them in New York City alone (Brecher, 1972).

In 1926, two New Orleans newspapers, the item and morning Tribune, published a series of "exposes" of the marihuana menace. (note research: who were these sailors and remember the time frame were speaking?)The papers reported that sailors from Cuba and the South American countries were importing large quantities of cannabis into New Orleans, and that marihuana smoking had become widespread, even among children "'The Waif's Home, at this time was reputedly full of children, both white and colored, who had been brought in under the influence of the drug. Marihuana cigarettes could be bought almost as readily as sandwiches"' Brecher, 1972.

In 1927, Louisiana passed a law providing for a $500 fine or six months' imprisonment for sale or possession of marihuana. Numerous arrests and a subsequent curbing of imports resulted but, as with alcohol, use continued.
Resourceful Louisiana residents stopped buying retail and started growing their own.

The first large growing crop in the city [New Orleans] was found in 1930 and its value estimated at $35,000 to $50,000 ... One 1936 about 1,200 pounds of bulk weed were seized along with considerable quantities of cigarettes. On one farm, 5 1/2 tons were destroyed and other farms yielded cultivated areas of about 10 acres ... one resident of the city was found growing 100 large plants in his backyard" (Brecher, 1972).

 

[zamalito]

Cooter, that was exactly what I was looking for. I'm extremely greatful! What is the book you kept citing Brecher 1972? I'm very curious.

Evolution, Imus.....lolololol that's the funniest thing I've heard all week. Thank you for britening my day.

Sam, please don't take offense. 6 months ago my opinion of you was far less than nice. Since then you've truly earned a place as the person I respect most in this community. I mean this with all the respect in the world, but man, you've gotta admit that the comparison between you and Imus is hilarious. I mean you're by no means a rude bigot like he is. Your opinions are well thought out and backed up with facts. Unlike me you get straight to the point and you obviously don't have time for bullshit. I think that can sometimes come off as being rude or short to those that are less familiar with you and how much you have on your plate. Anyways I'm rambling. I better stop before you call me a nappy headed ho.

 

[cooter1]

Brecher, E. M. (1972). Licit and illicit drugs: The Consumers Union report on narcotics, stimulants, depressants, inhalants, hallucinogens and marijuana--including caffeine, n con ne, and alcohol. Boston: Little, Brown.
ISBN-10: 0316153400
ISBN-13: 978-0316153409


http://www.amazon.com/Consumers-Narcotics-Stimulants-Depressants-Hallucinogens/dp/0316153400

hope this helps if you get this book you'll find many more older historic resources that he has quoted from

 

[cooter1]

There also another point i wanted to make but kind of spaced it out the way I wanted to word it. But let’s take a moment and think about hemp.

What makes strong hemp? Climate & humidity or lack of…. can’t remember to lazy to look it up.

Now with that in consideration ...here is where I kind of forgot my point

But it relates to George Washington and growing and throwing out the males also regional areas of cannabis farms thus meaning some were for hemp and others for canna consumption depending on regional areas. I'll have think about it again later and find what exactly I’m referencing to.

I think text books tend to downplay or wool over the founding fathers intent and make it more of a fuzzy feel good excuse this only enables the prohibitionist to counter the farming and cultivation this plant.

Great thread

 

[Guest]

This thread is wonderful, folks sharing knowledge and being mature about it.

 

[muddy waters]

I love Sam's contributions, we're fortunate to have someone with so much research and experience under his belt. If he had a radio hour though he'd probably lose ithe practically called czech weed nappy headed hemp.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

WTF?, What makes strong hemp? What do you mean, strong fiber or strong smoke? If it is fiber then variety is more important, if smoke then don't use hemp.
Smoking hemp is like manicuring a plant and then tossing all the flowers and keeping the leaves to smoke. Why do it? Smoke real drug Cannabis not wannabies...
-SamS

 

[cooter1]

wtf,lol i'll say it again for ya Sam..hope this time I’m abit more clear
Strong hemp meaning cultivation for industrial production not for consumption. Strong hemp or hemp for that matter as we know does squat but regular sativa and indica will do the trick and i believe the used both and knew the differnce and was working on perfecting both for each need.

In the medical journal forget the title of the book for medicine during the civil war, the problem was it was either too strong or not strong enough to treat lockjaw tetanus ...there is a point here trust me,lol What that article told me though they were getting thier medical from both crops not truly understanding the differnce between hemp and herbal cannabis but i do believe some did.

As I said I forget the point and It will come back to me as I find the article I was relating too, but basically 2 crops 1 for herbal use the kind that gets you stoned was cultivated and the other was to make a stronger fiber.

I believe this was not limited to just the civil war era but also in the 1700's and folk like Washington (who I believe was and is the greatest pres. in America of all time, loved reading his vision of American and it’s future) knew this and was perfecting his indicia and African sativa’s as he was separating males from the females just as he and other were working on making a stronger fiber from hemp..ah fuck it i give up lol what can i add we got all the experts here right..my point Sam was actually for both just as we strive for the best they did also thats all

 

[PazVerdeRadical]

hello cooter1, your point is pretty valid in my opinion.

one question that i would like to know the answer to is that if marijuana drug-lines can be used for the industrial purposes just as non-drug hemp is used?

i know that hemp harvesting is done before the plants flower, whether male or female; unless you seek to make seed for various purposes.
so what are the exact botanical/taxonomic differences between the two plants besides that one contains proper thc levels to be psyche-active and the other does not. ?

paz

 

[cooter1]

Paz, I'm not totaly sure maybe Sam could tell ya or another
but i bleive you answered your own question in the post.

1 word Maturity

we know we have to flower enable to get the stone effect, where hemp is produced doesnt reach that stage.

 

[zamalito]

The accepted theory on brazilian cannabis is that it is descended from seeds brought over by slaves but after further research I've come to the conclusion that much of the original brazilian drug cannabis gene pool was originally from hemp. The old brazilian strains typically aren't overpoweringly strong but definitely strong enough and on par with some of the more sativa dominant old southern homegrown. Some of the people of angola where portugal kidnapped most of their slaves from were known to carry dolls, pouches and talisman filled with cannabis seeds. However, first of all sailors of the 18th and 19th centuries were notoriously superstitious and I doubt they would allow the slaves to carry anything that could possibly used for placing a hex or casting a spell on the voyage. Then even if they could get the seeds aboard they would've probably been eaten since food was scarce during the 35-45 day voyage from Angola to Brazil. The angolan population after seeing the hemp introduced by portugal probably recognized it as the same plant from their homeland and were allowed to cultivate it by the plantation owners planting it in between the rows of sugar cane. In Mexico the same thing happened where much of the original drug cannabis strains are also thought to be descended from hemp. After several years of attempting to introduce hemp cultivation to Mexico the church advised the crown to cease because the Indian laborers had started to use the plant as an intoxicant. The reason why this didn't also occur in the united states is because the English took their slaves from regions of Africa where cannabis use and cultivation is thought to have not become commonplace until after WWII.