Whole buds in bubbleator-need to break up first?

[THCV]

Hi y'all-

Last flower i had a few plants get aphid infestations. The buds have lots of trichomes--they were harvested normally after being treated with ladybugs--but the buds are filled with white aphid carcasses that the ladybugs left behind. No one wants to smoke buds like that, so i am turning them entirely into hash. Here's my q:

Do i really need to break up the buds before placing them in the bubbleator? They are large MK Ultra buds and they'll take a lot of work to break up (they are frozen now, after being dried), but I am not sure it is necessary, since i was going to run them in the bubbleator for 30-60 mins to get every last trichome out. Will the trichs shake out of whole buds in ice cold water with a long enough run?

Also, will the bubblebags keep the aphid carcasses out of the hash?

Thanks.

THCV

 

[Keefhead]

30-60 minutes? Whoa. Stop there. Let's look at the process...

The ice cold water in the bubbleator is what breaks off the trichs when they get cold and brittle. This only takes a few minutes in the bubbleator. The rest of the time you are breaking off more plant matter, and contaminating your hash. It will be so green you'll want to smoke aphids instead..... LOL

Doing 4-5 seperate runs, running the bubbleator each time for 3-5 minutes only, will get you almost all the trichs, and the first run or two through the bubblebags will be hash you can enjoy. The remaining runs will be lesser quality, but still good for when the stash runs low.

Break up the buds? Well, there is one school of thought that says if you break up the buds you will add contaminants. True. But you seem to be after quantity, so let's try another school.

If you break up the buds you will get somewhat more hash. But with the contaminants you can add, I don't like to. However, breaking them up is easy. If they are frozen, simply pressing the frozen bag lightly with your hand should break up the buds sufficiently. Just break them down to marble size chunks. This will minimize contaminants while helping the yield where it can. Don't overcrush. However:

Look at the material in the bag after a 3-minute run. It's a soggy batch of vegetable matter. So most all the trichs have been exposed to the cold water, and given the opportunity to fall off. This is why breaking up the buds will only result in a small improvement in quantity, and a loss in quality.

And between runs add more ice, lots of it. It will help your yield by breaking off more trichs. Not a lot, but you want it all - right?

As to whether the bubblebags will keep out the carcasses, they will filter out all material not in their size range. If the bug parts are in the range of 120 to 45 microns, they will get into the hash. However, I suspect (not for sure) that the parts are a lot larger.

Are you using the bubblebags with the bubbleator? You used that term, and I was not sure if you were referring to the bags that came with the bubbleator, or the "real deal" bubblebags.

Nice pic by the way...

 

[trichomefarmer]

Break up the buds enough to remove all the stalks.
it will increase your yield, it wont add any contaminents, but most importantly it will greatly reduce the chance of ripping your bag/mesh.

the bubblebags, assuming you have the 190µ and 160µ should have no problems filtering out the carcasses.

 

[Keefhead]

There ya go - from an expert.

I would have to disagree, with much due respect, that it won't add contaminants. When I break up buds, and look at the resulting hash under a "real" microscope (not radio shack), I find an increase in the amount of small particulant plant matter. I doubt it affects the hash much at all, it's quite small. Here's a picture of "contaminated" hash.


You can see the brown and green bits, the brown ones are dark trich heads and misc stuff. The green bits are plant matter - and don't show up when I do a very gentle run. This melted good, but no bubble.

JMHO

 

[THCV]

rad! I have a 220, 70 and 38 micron set, the "deluxe" order of the bubbleator.

I don't really mind some contamination, and my goal is max yield in minimum time. The actual water filtering, esp with the 38u, is very slow and I have a lot to work through. I am basically attempting to get out all the trichs, even if it is rougher than ideal. But i hear you keef on the 60 mins, i will cut waay back. trichfarmer, good point on avoiding ripping the mesh bag--i will certainly remove all the major stems.

thanks.

 

[gaiusmarius]

i think the spidermite carcasses will float with the plant matter. so most of them will not be in your hash. but even if you were to get a few in there, they would be stopped at the 190 bag or at the 160 latest.

i must say if i was to use top colas i would be breaking them into individual buds. i would take every thing off the stem and break the biggest buds up a bit. you want to free as much surface space as possible. if you are after the best yield possible.

i would also say, don't run it for 60 minutes. try 10 minutes then pull the bags for the first quality. then do it all again running the machine for another 10 or 15 minutes. then again pull the bags and collect the hash from the second run. you can do it a third time specially if you are working with a nice amount of material.

have fun, you will surely be impressed with the end product.

 

[Keefhead]

A suggestion if I may: Since Bubbleman sells the bags separate, order a 160 or 190 and use it to filter the really bad stuff. I know you're going for quantity, but .... I too have used the bubbleator bags, but only when I need some quantity fast, like for cooking. Bubblebags, or the equivalent, are, in my opinion, mandatory.

Here's a shot of what got through the 220 bag and landed in the 190 bag.



Nasty - huh? The more filtering the better. This stuff got through the 220, and with the bubbleator bags, landed in your hash.

Just something to think about.

 

[gaiusmarius]

it's true Keefhead. but i think you'll find that most people who have never made their own hash will be pretty chuffed with what they get even from a 3 bag kit. but i totally agree with your advice about ordering the 190 and/or the 160 as soon as possible as they add a whole dimension of purity to the end product.

 

[Keefhead]

it's true Keefhead. but i think you'll find that most people who have never made their own hash will be pretty chuffed with what they get even from a 3 bag kit.

You're right. I sure was.

 

[THCV]

good to know about the 190. I'll get one. note, however, that the bubbleator in fact uses 2 220u filters in a row, so maybe it would catch some of that crap that squeezed through the first 220. I looked at my last run under the 60-200x scope and it was pretty much trichome heads and stalks.

i am looking forward to high yield from colas, should be badass.

 

[ft100]

i have only made hash with my bubbleator and 1 gallon 7 bag set of bubblebags 3 times. This is my opinion based on this experience. I run the trim about 3 times for 10 minutes each time. the bucket the bags are in has holes so the water leaks out of the bottom. i add ice after every 10 minutes sessin. i only harvest the bags one time. i do not think the second or third runs diminish quality, but that is my opinion.

 

[gaiusmarius]

interesting. its funny because i'm having trouble telling my 73u from the first run with the one from the second run. the radio shack scope shows an equal quality. and when i hit it up with friends no one can tell which is better yet lol. its very strange cause up to now i have been able to see the difference with the bear eye. i understand why you do it, but i don't think i'll start doing it that way lol. most of the time only the first run 73 is fmcd, if i get fmcd lol. it's hard enough to achieve without making it more difficult lol. but i do know that the end product will still be a superior hash for most.

 

[ft100]

yeah i see what your saying now gaius. for now i am happy with my nice little 5 gram chunks of hash. the quality definitely satisfies me in every way the way i do it. maybe not totally fmcd. but boy it gets the job done. peace my friend.

 

[THCV]

So, what i am hearing is that the 1st and 2nd runs don't necessarily end up different? These are some pretty fine filters, so there is some logic there, although i always thought the "more ripe" trichs fell off first and thus the potential better quality of the first run. Then again, if you like an "up" high, the less mature trichs might be more to your taste, as the ripest trichs are popped amber.

But help me understand this: if i keep adding ice whenever it's melted too much (and siphon off a bit of the water it displaces into the bags), why not just run it for 45 mins straight? The bags will filter out the garbage. What is the downside? I mean, why is everyone suggesting multiple runs for 10 mins, but one big run is somehow no good?

Like i said, i ran it for 45-60 mins before, and got great hash. Not fmcd, but that's cuz I don't have the 190/160 right? I guess i am a little confused, but for yield, it might make sense to run it for "all 3 runs in a row", ie 30 mins.

Am I too blazed? Or does this make sense?

Thanks for all the expertise, guys. I have yet to smoke fmcd, so you know I need you help!

I have also noticed that reusing the darkened trash water for subsequent runs seems to result in lighter colored hash, maybe due to chlorophyl saturation of the water? Anyway, I like to reuse it either way, as it is ice cold and smells so damn nice.

 

[ilife]

Run the Mini washer for 30min.

Run the Mini washer for 30min.

Let you material cure for at least 2 weeks and don't freeze it. Double your 220u and your 160u filter bags. Can also double 190u.
Then put it in your mini washing machine 2 seperate zipper bags with 100 to 150 grams in each zipper bag. Then turn your machine on for 15 minutes and then another 15 minutes. a total of 30mins. Then harvest. If your tricomes are fully developed and your material is clean you will harvest a very nice quality water extraction. In one wash and still have a very nice quality.

 

[gaiusmarius]

oops i deserve that i suppose lol. what i said was that this is the first time this happened, ie that i couldn't tell the 73 from the 1st run from the 73 of the second run. normaly it's easy to tell at the latest in the bowl with fire on it. so it's really true that the ripest trichome heads come off first, and if you are interested in trying to get full melt, let alone clear dome, then you will do sepperate runs. if you just want to get all you hash in one go and don't care if it melts or not, then do one big run.

 

[THCV]

ok, got it. Now, how about fresh-frozen vs cured then frozen? I have cured in the past, but this time i put all the trim and aphidy buds straight into the freezer after drying. Is it better to cure or not before making hash?

 

[gaiusmarius]

again it depends whats important to you. for the best quality with the most taste left you use fresh frozen material, but for the best yield use dry material. with bubble hash you don't have to cure it for longer then it takes for it to dry. well made bubble will not have hardly any chlorophil in it. but it also ages nicely and becomes smother with time. i have some WW bubble thats over a year and a half old and is very smooth to hit on now. but it no longer has such an intense taste as it did when fresh.

 

[Guest]

I have always found that when making budder/hash/BHO, the best return and best quality oil come from when I remove buds from the colas (seperating into individual nugs).
This isn't cutting buds, just stems to release the bud from the stalks to their smallest individual size, often about the size of your thumb tip.

peace - Tug