What's wrong this time?

[bounty29]

• Blockhead in coco hempy buckets, 2" perlite reservoir on the bottom, the rest is fine coco
• 6ml Flora Micro and 9ml Flora Bloom per gallon every watering
• PH between 5.8 and 6.0
• Temperature is 70-78f
• RH is 50-65%
• Transplanted last week.
• Using tap water after 24+ hours of sitting out, 0.2ec

I only saw this on one leaf, but I want to stop it before it spreads. I'm about to start flowering and I don't want to put them into flower unless they're at 100%. Any input is appreciated






This was a fan leaf one or two nodes down from the top of the plant, one of the larger ones. This has happened within the last 24 hours. I've got two other cuts of this going, getting the same treatment, so I feel like they're all going to show it soon. I was planning on feeding tonight. I've got...

GH Flora Micro
GH Flora Bloom
PBP Bloom (Might be expired)
Cal Mag+
Liquid Karma (If this expires, it might be expired, got them both about 2 years ago)
Hormex

 

[bounty29]

Alright so I went to see if I could see anything else. This picture is from the same plant almost exactly 72 hours ago.

Here are some more detail shots of the plant tonight, this first one showing the other fan leaves in the same position in relation to the top (There are 3 main tops on this one.)

This is of where the tallest top was topped, minutes before the first pic in the post was taken. You can see the new growth is much paler than the plant has been. If I had just flipped to 12/12 I would expect this because of stretch, but I'm still using 20/4. (The flash does make it look brighter than normal, but you should be able to see the difference.)

This is a picture of the plants that are behind by 1 week. They were just transplanted a few days ago, and the plant in question was transplanted a week and a few days ago. You can see there's nothing showing on this one yet.

Looking back at that first pic again, the new growth is more pale than it has been in the past. Maybe because they moved from the 150w CFLs to the 150w HPS it's needing more nutes? Is Blockhead known to be a heavy feeder?

 

[mitsu1]

Have you checked your run-off, ph and ppm/ec ?

 

[Crazy Composer]

using the GH alone would do well for you. Cal mag is okay if needed. The PBP Bloom is good for adding that organic taste, but doesn't need to be used too often, three times during flower, with the last feeding being PBP will give it a nice, organic taste.
I have had nothing but trouble with Liquid Karma. Messy, stinky, volatile, unneeded.


My first impulse, after seeing your plants, was that they could use a bit more nitrogen at this stage.

The leaf burn could be the Liquid HARMa.

I don't like growing hydro because there are so many mysterious things that can happen... but one thing's the same for all growing styles... the fewer products you use to grow your pot, the fewer mysteries you'll have to figure out.

Peace, good will,
cc

 

[bounty29]

Sorry if I was unclear.

All I'm using at this point, and all these plants have ever received, is 6ml Micro and 9ml Bloom per gallon. I'm with you 110% on keeping things simple.

Those things listed, I have on hand, if anyone thinks they can help.

Thanks for stopping by!

 

[inflorescence]

Well bounty, I could help you but since you don't seem to understand diagnosing a deficency "there's no point in discussing this further until you educate yourself."

You don't know how a non-profit works. There's no point in discussing this further until you educate yourself.

 

[Crazy Composer]

Missed that.

Go with 9/9 for a while and see if they stabilize or get greener. They ought to. 6/9 is good for one time applications, but I'm betting a solution for buckets needs a little more N. I use 9/9 when my plants need a little more N, then back back down to 6/9 after they show signs of improvement.

 

[bounty29]

Thank you CC, I think I'll give that a try and see how they respond.

 

[inflorescence]

I'm done with the arguement.
Possible P def, look at the purpling petioles and even the starting of the scorched margin tips. Definately doesn't fit all the criteria and it seems amazing since your lucas formula has plenty of P but I think the coco is antagonising the P somehow or the pH is a little too much on either side of P's prefered pH.
Maybe some strange tap/coco antagonising going on.

 

[bounty29]

Thanks for the input inflorescence.

Here's the difference between 6/9 and 9/9. This is without the numbers from my 0.2ec tap water.

--------6/9------9/9
N------96.0------144.0
P------59.4------59.4
K------108.9-----117.9
Mg-----41.4-----41.4
Ca-----123.0-----171.0

 

[Crazy Composer]

Yeah, I sometimes like to give a boost of N in early flower, if I see that what I'm given them isn't enough.

Purpling leaf stems and veins is a sure sign they are asking for N. I use the purple veins and stems as an indicator of nutrient levels. These purple stems and veins on your plants are what makes me think you need to feed more N.

 

[bounty29]

I'm mixing up a batch of 9/9 right now, I'll take some pictures right before I water them and then see how they react in the next few days. If it looks good, they should be ready to flower. I'll update the thread with pictures of the before and after feeding of the new formula.

 

[inflorescence]

Purpling leaf stems and veins is a sure sign they are asking for N. I use the purple veins and stems as an indicator of nutrient levels. These purple stems and veins on your plants are what makes me think you need to feed more N.

Wow, I aways knew purple petioles were a P def sign but never knew purple petioles were also a N def sign.
Makes sense in bounty's situation though although I've heard many run lucas (bloom formula basically) from start to finish without a problem because I know from experience that floranova bloom (which is exactly lucas bloom) has plenty of N, even a little too much for my tastes but maybe the N in the nova is more avail than the N in the 3 part because the nova uses like 90% nitrate whereas the 3 part uses a little less nitrate and some urea to make up the difference (for some unknown reason to me: anyone have a guess at that one?) and especially if lucas is only receiving the N from the micro portion and not the grow. Maybe the micro portion has more urea and it's the grow portion that has more nitrate.

 

[bounty29]

I haven't been able to get much info on any specifics on what Blockhead likes, could just be it's more hungry? I don't know

Maybe that will help? I hadn't noticed it before but the leaf is now clawing a bit. I just fed both buckets (9ml Bloom/9ml Micro :: 6.01ph :: 1.7ec), about a gallon each. I'll try to get on the watering every 2-3 days schedule from now on, we'll see how things go.

Here's a side by side, oriented the same way they are in the cabinet, and a shot of one of the tops on the younger clones.


Trimmed up some of the undergrowth, I couldn't even get in to water so I had to make some space. This should help with airflow too, don't want to deal with fungus gnats again.

 

[Crazy Composer]

Oh, you're NOT in a bucket, like a hydro bucket!? I thought you were in a hydro bucket.

In that case... I wonder (by the damage on the leaf) if all you've done is let them get a little too dry once or twice recently? Coco dries much faster than most mediums, so I know it's more common to underwater with coco.

When the medium is allowed to dry out, even one time, some of the smallest roots are damaged. This damage shows up on leaves, sometime exactly like the damage on your leaves.

Was there any chance of a dry spell recently?It happens to the best of us.

BTW, your plants aren't looking too bad at all. Remember, coco is EASY to flush, so if you ever have any question about what's happening in the medium, just flush and start again. When you flush to start fresh, you want to flush the medium, and when you're done flushing, feed them a regular dose of food immediately. In other words, flush, then re-feed right after the flush is done.

 

[Crazy Composer]

Seeing your new pics, not all of them need to be treated like there's a problem... a few of them show the purple veins, but others look perfectly fine. My plants are all fed according to their individual needs. For example, a plant that looks fine gets normal treatment. A plant with purpling stems and other signs of N def. will get a feeding appropriate to their needs.

Some plants yellow fast, and they will often go to the outer edges of my garden to get them in a lower light situation. I use 1000 watters. If I have a yellowing plant that I don't want yellow yet... I'll move it to the less intense light areas in the garden. A recovering plant does better in less intense light conditions.

 

[bounty29]

I was wondering if they might've gotten too dry as well, I've seen what that can do. Hmm... now that you mention it, when I transplanted it I cut off many root, so all the roots would've been contained in the 2 liter and would've had to grow a few inches to get into the bucket.

Maybe the 2 liter dried out before I noticed the bucket starting to dry out? I'll definitely keep an eye on that, you can see in the pictures of the trimmed stalk that it was just starting to dry out, I usually use that as a sign it's time to feed. Once you get a few dried up looking coco flakes on the top, the inner part isn't going to last much longer.

I feel like I've taken enough pictures to accurately say how the plant will respond in 48 hours, if not sooner. I'll definitely update and let you know how it worked out.

That picture is of the plant that I haven't seen affected yet


I like to water soon after the coco looks like this.

Edit: The only way I'm differing from "The Recipe" is...

Floralicious grow SUPPLEMENT....is used a time or three in veg,as a.....supplement.
The GH Flora Series is the 3-part nutrient series that I use,along with GH Kool Bloom (liquid and/or powder) bloom booster.
I use pure,unamended coco coir.

I don't have the Floralicious Grow, I was originally planning on doing just a week or two of veg, but I changed my mind on that because I wanted them to fill up the canopy more. I wonder if that would've solved this?

 

[bounty29]

There's a couple pics. The leaves don't seem to be getting much worse and the new growth is looking darker. There's no signs of the problem on any of the newer or older leaves, it's all on growth from that node.

 

[bounty29]

Things are looking real good. I think I'm going to put them into their first 12 hours of darkness tonight. I'll give at least one more feeding of 9/9 to help them with the stretch (which I'm told is not much) and see how the react from there. Whether it was a N def or an issue of underwatering, it doesn't seem to have slowed her down. Thanks again!

 

[Crazy Composer]

Good, glad to hear everything's good.